Older demon

Could not agree more. Why then did we give away Martin? Potential to get smashed at the clearances again and again

Need more run out of defence and flankers who kick long and penetrate downfield. Malceski, Yarran, Birchal, Enright, are the play makers we need to emulate

From the vision I think Dunn pushed Vickery into the contest slightly resulting in Vickery copping a falcon ie hit in the head with the ball. He may have thought that Dunn hit him. The umpires mike also came across asking Dunn to stop using his elbows. poor Tyrone he must bruise easily

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Class teams have a plan and deliver the ball to advantage, we have a long way to go to get there. Bombing to the goal square worked for Brisbane but they had Lynch and Brown and a host of talented forwards to mop up the crumbs just as Geelong now have Hawkins & Pods with some fairly talented support staff...we don't. Hogan is only 17 but the type you build a team around but that is 4 years away. I know it is February but we are talking about the same ball butchers as last year so I don't expect they will ever improve (sorry Geordie u are killing us). My son is a kangas supporter and he was rapt with Gysberts game and laughed that we traded him for Pederson I know who will benefit from that deal.

Gee we butcher the ball! And it is the same culprits all the time, mentioned in pre season training and the same again in NAB cup. Still unable to nut out what our game plan is, North constantly transferred play to open up other side of ground. We try and turn it over.

I wouldn't under estimate teams early on. It will take months for the investigation to reach a head and any teams find they have a large list of unavailable players. It is such a foreign concept that a team be found of doping and players will actually be banned for up to 2 years. Having said that in cycling whole teams have been withdrawn after even 1 member has been found guilty. How will the ACCC prove the supplements were tainted? Do they have old batches of PED's to test for contaminants or will a retrospective blanket ruling be made about any PED supplement use? As for the other mystery player I do hope the Age will go after him and his club with the same vigour that MFC has been dusted and Hirdy has been attacked it would be fascinating if, god forbid, it was a Richmond player. How would the Age cope. They do have a habit of sacking individuals before all the facts are available.

I believe that this hits the nail on the head and it all starts in the ruck. We consistently got slaughtered in the clearances at center bounces and throw ins and the issue to address is getting our hands on the footy first. I am concerned that our ruck division is an unknown and shaky, so while the midfield has great potential they may lack the strength of last year. Jordie, Jones and Sylvia even, will have to be the big bodies in the middle to compete or our backline will get opened up again. Mumford is so good at center clearances, the Hawk's rely on Lewis, Sewell and Mitchell to lock it. yet in early in the season they were getting carved up and conceding scores in the absence of a good ruckman. The Woods have Jolly feeding Pendlebury, Swan, Beams, Sidebottom and now Ball. Jamar, Spencer and Gawn have enormous responsibility but with the latter two precious little experience. Of the other talls Fitzy is too raw and Mitch too valuable to risk in the ruck, Dawes wont do that role and Pederson is a little undersized against the big boys. It may not improve much without midfield support

Well I will put my hand up as I have been very critical of Mark Neeld and can I point out it is November. Lets re open the discussion about March next year and see if all the changes have made a difference. My concern is that we have topped up with players that ensure we win more games than last year but who will not be there long term but guarantee Neeld another year. I applaud the FD for bringing Viney, Toumpas and Hogan into the club and hope they develop into 200 game players. I have seen NO evidence that Mr Neeld is a great coach or that his game plan will work. At least next year we will be able to judge him on the performance of the team HE built. Pleasing that we haven't been accused of tanking to get draft picks this year.

This hits the nail on the head IMO. As late as this season GWS sent all its players off for season ending surgery so that they wouldn't accidentally win against GC and lose top pick. Why hasn't anyone made comment, where are the Caroline Wilson's and Dwayne Russell's of the world now. In the same discussion leading up to the game Guy McKenna stated that they wanted to win , they had enough kids and needed some more mature bodies and win's. If there is anything to learn from this saga that bottoming out and losing is bad long term for the fabric of the club

Marcus seecamp

As I remember, he was asked to take a substantial pay cut while Carlton offered him a great deal, he couldn't get a regular game due to always being injured and appearing too slow. I think to find the other reason you may have to speak to Brad Green. His form at the Blues had been woeful and he managed to turn it around only in the second half of the season and only time will tell if his purple patch is sustained. Just because he donated lots of money to the club does not entitle him to think he was above scrutiny for poor form and poor judgement, one only has to read his tweets to see that!

Magnificent piece of writing. Please submit it to the editor of the Age so he can read an intelligent piece of creative writing and compare it with the rubbish Caro is spewing out

I really don't like Caro. So she never made a mistake or did something in her youth she now regrets, ha, what a hypocrite. What has she against Melbourne that she is happy to pour such vitriol on the club and write an OPINION piece not a factual piece written on a basis of good investigative journalism. IT is a bad combination to have a vindictive journo looking for something in a slow news month and a lot of [censored] off former employees. Can the club take legal action against her now based on todays article? Will Gary Lyon have a quiet word and tell her to back off? And will all Melbourne supporters cancel their subscriptions to the Age in all forms and drop the promotions we get for cheap Age subscriptions.

Sorry guys couldn't disagree more. The coach has selected discards who may win him enough games to keep his job at years end. What do Rodan and Byrnes offer beyond 1 or 2 seasons. It is outrageous to expect Viney and Wines (if selected) to come in and make an instant impact. Where are the class highly skilled players, the game breakers and match winners. Neeld is a first year coach who frankly I don't think could train pigs to be dirty. What is his long term strategy didn't he say say he was pleased to take over such a great list that wasn't at rock bottom. NO he took us there, insisted on a game style our list couldn't play and has given away Morton, Gysberts and Martin for peanuts. Just watch martin and Gys develop at other clubs

Woewodin really hurt my family. He was my daughters favourite player and when he went to the Pies she went with him, encouraged by her step dad a Pies supporter. It is one thing to have them leave when out of contract as Rivers & Maloney have but it is another when they are in contract and pushed (sold off) like Woewodin was. Losing marquee players really hurts a club just ask the eagles who lost Judd and North who lost Carey

If what we are talking about is basically a trade of Martin to get Pederson then I think the club has it wrong. Pederson could not get a game at North even when they were a little undersized down back and had no backup ruck man. What is the attraction he has been in the system one basically playing 12 games and got only 2 this year? I thought the idea was to trade up not down. Under the new rules Martin is a better option than jamar who last year could only tap the ball at his feet, rarely took a mark and could miss goals from the goal square and rarely if ever plays a full season. Martin must be the back up or even 1st ruck as Spencer isn't athletic enough and gawn is coming off his second knee reco and will need time. I think Fitzy is the one we will need to develop and shows the most upside.

Agree we have no idea that we can develop players. Very few improved under the great Neeld and his toughest team to play against. The coach is clearing players out but a similar year to this year and I guarantee Neeld wont be there. If he is such a hack why would Geelong be interested? Maybe they rate some of our players but not our coaching staff. Don't throw the baby out with the bath water. Are Pederson and Dawes coming off outstanding seasons? No! Is it just that the other clubs grass looks greener. He has a 1 year contract let him finish it!

Can I point out later in the article how happy North were because they got Shaun Atley who they did rate and has subsequently moved forward. Makes the selectors for that draft look even worse

Why is everyone trying to get rid of Gysberts??

Big mistake to trade Martin as he can play and doesn't tap the ball to his toes. The Russian will struggle now that Maloney is not at his feet to pick up his taps. Decision is between Gawn and Spencer as the two >200cm rucks that aren't that agile. I would love to see Fitzpatrick find a position. The need is to develop talls in key posts and then have lots of runners and blokes who will get the ball to be competitive