Demon Dynasty

I don't think it'll ever happen as long as Jack is happy with his present sub par efforts when he isn't handed the ball on a platter. Some of his chasing and tackling/falling over efforts are laughable at this level. His ball use is nice when he has a bit of time but he still doesn't take his opponents or the game on very often. Always looking for the quick give, mostly lateral or sideways. Hoping for better, preparing for the same or worse. Needs an AFL bod as well. Still looks like a 2nd year draftee. Top bloke off the field though and really hope he can do what needs to be done to take it to real AFL level standards...both ways.

WYL this is going to continue until we recruit 2 or 3 stars into the team and fill out the mid field/solve the forward line situation which has nothing dangerous about it whatsoever from a goal kicking point of view. We all hope Hulk comes good to alleviate this a little obviously. But we need speed, skill and class up forward as well (ie., crumbers/mid field goal kicking danger players). This might be organically from current list ie., Tyson/Hulk... or into the future. But until this happens we will never be more than a bottom feeding filler on the AFL's pre determined/managed Foxtel driven fixture/ladder. Just enjoy your Hols mate and make the most of it. If Roos can't turn it around we'll probably be pushing up daisies before this club threatens for finals or wonder of wonders, ever becomes a power house once more.

Lions are a rubbish team....that's why i was furious with last week's effort. We are still miles away from getting ourselves off the bottom and into "average" competitive territory. Having said that, i was expecting a route yesterday of up to 120 points or more IF we didn't put our best effort on the park. 10 goals if we did. 50 wasn't a bad effort (compared to last week's only though) given how many non AFL level players are on our list atm. Hawthorn never drop off from giving their all pretty much every week year in and out. Hopefully we will get there one season, preferably this side of 2020.

Thanks for that Beats I truly hope he gets a run in the last few games if on the cusp of going. Not saying he's a world beater but you don't know if you don't give someone this opp. Seen worse inclusions over the decades.

MFC can hardly be choosy.... i would go hard after him and Garlett at seasons end in a swap for Frawley and picks etc. We could do much worse than having these two running around. Miles ahead of many in our current list in terms of competitive animal attack (Robinson) and pure speed and damage on the run and kicking goals (Garlett). I can't recall "niceness" on a footy field winning too many big matches or finals. One of the nastiest dirtiest a'holes i ever saw grace a footy field is now considered and venerated by many critics and experts to be one of the greats in the game....and by some to be the greatest ever. And he led his mob to a few premierships. Robinson certainly doesn't have that ability but like i said, a fair way ahead of many on our present list.... and we can't be all that choosy. I don't see a conga line of amazing players beating our door down anytime soon to select from as replacements for the many who aren't even close to being AFL competetive.

Chook when was the last time an MFC player smashed an opponent in any contest apart from the bump Neiter put on that Hawks player a decade or so ago which was pretty much in play? Balls or Jacko maybe yes? When was the last time the MFC had a hit man? No one fears us in any manor whatsoever, both in terms of skills, goal kicking and/or physicality. We are a weaponless club and the only shining lights in terms of a highlights reel in the last decade was Neiter, Jurrah and Robbo (Howe in today's team is about it).

Unforturtunately apart from Dawesy's 2nd and 3rd efforts when he loses the contest (which is most of the time), he's had a shocking year. We really are placing alot of hope in the Hulk coming on and at this stage just getting himself onto the park. Need another big marking star player up forward IMO. Dawes is just a structural fill in.

Frankie i would like to have your positivity on the physical front but honestly, i haven't seen an MFC team who go hard at the man and pill consistantly for 4 quarters without fear or favour since Swooper was in charge. And that's a mighty long time ago now. We are miles away from being a bruising team. One of the reasons i'd love to see us go after Robinson very hard at year's end, along with Garlett for some run and carry and super speed off HB and through the middle, decent delivery i50 as well and can kick a goal...something we desperately need more of!

I'm in general agreement D16 with the exception of the 2 highlighted. I'm not sure where Clisby is at injury or form wise as i haven't been following. But based on the 3 matches i have stats on from last year....his uncontested, effective disposal and effective disposal percentage is up there with the best in the team. He ranked No. 1 in uncontested. Equal 1st in Effective disposals alongside the Jones Boy He ranked 3rd in effective disposal %. 10 percentage points higher than the Jones boy, 8 percentage points higher than Howe, and 4 higher than Watts! 2nd in bounces (run and carry/breaking lines?... sadly lacking in our team and we are ranked pretty much bottom of table vs all other clubs in this area this season!) Was it injury or form that's prevented him from making an appearance this year? Maybe both? Others who watch Casey with interest might be able to enlighten me. With regard to Spencil, i really don't think we are short on Ruck options. I think both or at least one of the Maxs will provide us with enough alternatives here, at least until we find an alternative to the Russian if these dont' work out in the medium term. And i think Spencil has had many chances above those two without really putting his mark on the park in most of those matches.

Best post i've read in quite a while. The Demons have been trailing and tagging the coat tails of opposition players for decades with no success We need star players, at least 2 and ideally 3. And i don't mean average/good players. I mean genuine superstars. I would trade 12 to 14 average to sub par players on our list (many of who have already been mentioned in the above threads multiple times) to get my hands on those 2 or 3. As we've seen with GCS, you can build a reasonably competitve team around 1 super star (until he went down anyway). Imagine if we had 2 or more. We need our opponents to be worrying about/chasing us through the mid and around stoppages for a change, and still be able to perform and break their tag/kick match winning goals etc. Not the other way around pretty much every match and even against dud teams/mediocre players. Bring this and we can build a winning team. Don't, and all we will get is more of the same for decades to come. That's if the club survives long enough to see more of the same BS for decades.

Pretty good DA. Not sure i'm sold on Grimes tough. His decision making is woeful. As is Tmacs once. Both are "panic" players when it comes to running the ball out of our backline, especially Grimes. But i will say in Tmacs support he does get to alot of contests on opponents (and leaves to become 3rd man etc) and kills many a ball in defence. The problem is when he gets it he quite often sells the player he is giving off to into trouble. And after delivery proceeds to run towards/into the player he just gave it to...ensuring both players are toast when their opponents are on their tail. Seen it so many times. One thing he does give us also is some decent run off HB....but then there's the delivery/decision making by foot.....UGHH!

I'll 2nd that. And the inclusion of McKenzie around the time that Cross was ommitted from injury really set us back. One of, if not the only, decent ball users in congestion and when under meaningful pressure. His handball is lightning as is his decision making. Mostly to our advantage and hitting targets, unlike many others who just seem lost in congestion with hands/decision making. McKenzie is all effort and occasionaly when in the open he'll hit a target with handballs but that's about his limit IMO.

I think it's more The Jones Boy that is the above Ron. As much as i admire Grimes' effort....i also wouldn't put him even close to being on a par football ability wise with the likes of Jmac

I think Toump is worth a few more pre seasons. I'm not sure we should be backing players just based on their desire to be the best they can. Otherwise we probably will be holding on to the likes of McKenzie, Tappy, Blease, Fitzy, Trenners, Nicho etc for a fair while yet.

These are good points Jumbo. However, i think the questions that need to be asked are..... 1. Do we have anyone with AFL average or above average delivery skills when bringing the ball i50? 2. If the answer is yes, do the forwards (and those around them, including players pushing up from mid) have any idea how to play forward and play to the game style (mids spread away from designated leading zones or out wide of the hot spots instead running into those zones with defender in tow etc, forwards lead to those designated zones or lead back into space created by decoys, smalls run forward of drop zone to get front and square and take marks to kicks in under pressure or sweep up crumbs for snaps on goal etc) and to the strengths/weaknesses of those bringing it in?

I've seen him play a few games in there SPR but mostly in a stopping role. Can't say i've seen him do any damage going the other way while doing so though. Has looked like a fish out of water when played through there so far from what i've seen. I'd like to believe your right. I just don't have that much faith in playing him in this role given what i've seen so far.

I suspect many of the 'come and gone' category was since the CS / Bailey era where CS had the Melbourne "young generation" lets grow them together Red & Blue print happening ie., in with the babies and out with the bath water (eg., J Mac/ Robbo/ Miller). In addition the top line draft players just don't want to come and play with the likes of us and other bottom dwellers like the doggies etc. They are going to arc up and make their play (via their Management team) to try and end up at the top clubs of preference. Until, or unless, the AFL step in and ensure clubs at the bottom receive their fair share of the best talent, and don't lose them to the likes of the Pies/Bombers/Swans/Hawks/GCS/GWS etc who have more room in their football dept to spend on facilities/coaching staff/recruiting/staff etc....we will always wallow around like a skinny little runt stuck in the AFL pig swill and mud as bottom dwellers. This isn't really a surprise to me as i feel that's just the way the AFL want it. They have managed the AFL to promote the stronger clubs get stronger. Those at the bottom they don't really give two hoots about as long as they don't drain too many $$ from the AFL coffers. Like Port and ourselves did recently. The Saints appear to be the next big strain this year if you believe some of the gossip. In short i'm not surprised that the usual bottom dwellers like us, the doggies and toiges are still wallowing on the bottom as the AFL have pretty much thumbed their nose at the periferal Victorian clubs for decades now, instead preferring to focus their marketing dollars on the Swans, Pies, Bombers, Hawks, GWS and GCS. All we are seeing in the main is the outcome of an AFL manafactured product, with the usual bottom dwelling clubs in their usual "AFL acceptable".... place with the bigger/start up clubs of preference still chipping away at the top of the ladder year after year, decade after decade. It's no coincidence the AFL prefers a fixture over a draw and lock in the Bombers/Pies for Anzac day every year etc. Nothing is left to chance when it comes to the AFL.

The sentiments i like chook but with this list the problem is there's not really any replacements that offer anything other than the same old MFC butchering of ball and continually going sideways and lateral (Edit: this should have read..BACKWARDS) as our first option once we get it. The bulk of this list lacks class, run, speed, finish, sure ball handling in close and over 30 meters on the kick. Poor at shooting for goal. Pretty much everything a half decent footballer needs at least 1 of...or more. No weapons/match winners in this lot whatsoever. We also have no run and carry ball users off HB/outside middle who can hit targets once in a while or putting it to the favoured side of the forwards etc for them to run onto etc. The problems are vast a varied but at the end of the day we have a very poor list that's only weapon is being able to defend for 2 or 3 quarters depending on the quality of the opponent. And that 'defend at all costs mentality' starts very early, even before we or our opponent has managed to hit the scoreboard.....which to me makes no sense at all unless the opponent starts getting a run on early (which for us unfortunately happens alot lol). In the end the weight of numbers out of the middle (which we are still losing most of the time) and off the oppositions HB line following our turnovers (as well as continual missed shots at goals) end up ensuring that we lose most matches, even against horrible opposition such as the Bears today. Time to turn over the majority on this list or the club will die a very slow and horrible death...continually bouncing along the bottom of the ladder winning 4 to 6 matches max (if lucky). I don't envy Roos in his present position. He has very very little to work with here. Miracles can happen.....but i certainly can't see any light at this point, not with the bulk of this current list anyway.

OD it must be pretty bloody expensive if you're only drinking after our meagre win ratio. Either that OD or i'm thinking you might be going a tad overboard with the celebrating after a rare win! I wouldn't blame you if you did P.S. Still waiting on the brand

I don't mind 2 byes but it's very unfair that we're always getting 3 every damn year! The 2 that everyone else has.....and the one after about round 6 when our season is over..... Oh....then there's always this little gem

OD please send brand of double malt..... pronto!

Put Stuie's version in amongst them and check it against the rest. It will sit nicely alongside the Tiges, Hawks, Lions, Cats and Bombers as very appropriate and bold IMO. Current one is trying to say too many things. We're a football club not BHP etc..... KISS

Yep....another CS inspired bit of nostalgic BS from memory. You've got my vote.

You haven't sat near me at any games then... that's the only name i've ever used. The other term is an obomination on the original and i'm pretty sure Checker would say the same. Anyone who uses that obomination, particularly of the male genda, should have a long hard look down their loin cloth (using a very bright torch) to make sure the nuts and bolts are still connected. What is a "Dee" anyway?

Playing an obsessive possession game (OPG) mostly in the back half and continually going lateral or backwards with your first/2nd string possessions from stoppages for the majority of a match (particularly early on in the match) wont win you many matches of footy unless the opponent you are playing is in pretty poor form and not very good running the other way when they cough up possession during many of their chains of play (like us) The OPG method is a good ploy when you have a decent lead late into any quarter and you wish to defend the hard work already done on the scoreboad or to stop a run on by the opposition. Very useful and a must have team skill... but to be used for a smaller percentage of match time .... not the majority of it like we are doing atm....particularly early on when the match is only new and anyone's to win. Unless we can somehow manage a "Cats" style run and carry "overlap" game style for the "majority" of a match (particularly early in a game) injecting some super talent with genuine pace and silky dispoal/handling skills (including a few genuine goal kickers ... from mids or up forward) ... I believe we will continue to bounce along the bottom. Change the balance of the present style and make it the exception ie, OPG only when the match situation calls for it....and head towards the Geelong way both in training, recruiting and methods (in particular focussing on recruiting players who have great kicking skills)..and we will start to shine, win many more games by decent margins (rather tha sneaking over the line by the hair of our chin)...and maybe even threaten for a finals birth...