Maldonboy38

Welcome young fella - hop on board a Dees train that might finally be going somewhere. Looks like an outside mid or a small half-forward. Don't reckon we will see him in 2013 - needs some beef, but 2014 might be the go.

I am trying to sort this out in my head. Was Barry available in the draft? If yes, how do we know we have him - is he not available to other clubs? Or was he already on the GWS list in some way?

Yeah I know dandeeman your posts are usually entertaining, but your post above was a little bit depressing during a time when we got Viney, probably will have Hogan and Dawes, and will be getting rid of Morton, Bennell and Petterd. Too many good things in the wind to be too downcast.

To quote Brian Taylor, "Boy Oh Boy" dandeeman, that's a negative spin at a time when things are at the worst looking refreshing. Do you need a hug? An inside midfield of Jones, Magner, Viney, McKenzie, Gysberts attached to outside mids Sylvia, Blease, Bail, Grimes, Byrnes and Trengove all fit with a full preseason doens't sound too bad to me. Add into this Taggart and Tynan with one full season under thier belt, and then add a possible Toumpas / Wines or whoever and it could be OK.

I don't reckon Neeld and co are overlooking anything. They will talk with every club and seek advantage at every point.

There is no way that we are going to be doing 8 - 10 trades, regardless of which players we Demonlanders might love or hate. With Green, Moloney, Lawrence and Jurrah all gone our best trade bait are mid-to-low-range players (Martin, Morton, Bate, Petterd, Bennell etc... ). Rivers is probably the only top 5 player being considered. At this stage I do not believe the Sylvia rumours or the Jordie rumours. It seems too many on here are suggesting possible trades based solely on which players they most dislike. Incoming: Viney Hogan (more than likely) Dawes (more than likley) Pick 13 is way over price for him. Pederson (likely) Pick 3 has to be used on a midfielder with genuine class. I hope Toumpas gets through. Probable trade outs Rivers to Geelong Bate to Bulldogs (although this has gone very quiet) Possible trade outs: Morton to WCE (although this sounds too far fetched for me) Martin to ...? Gysberts to...? Petterd to...? Bennell to...? Although this trade week is turning out to be very different from past years, I cannot see all the 5 possible trades mentioned above actually happening. The draft is really strong and there are better players around for trade than those listed. I reckon some strong delisting is on the cards at the Dees following trade week.

If we get Hogan in the manner described, it must a least bring into question the need for Dawes. Yes, it will leave a hole for 2013 but maybe Fitztpatrick / Martin / Sellar can fill this hole for 12 months until Hogan arrives. It places a higher emphasis on Hogan than Dawes but I don't think we can go through another 12 months with a development big bodied forward. We need Dawes in 2013 The question I find it difficult to anser is this: is Dawes worth pick no. 20? On last year's form no but on 2011 form yes. Mark Neeld is keen on drafting some ready-made stop-gap players and Dawes at his best is better than a stop-gap player. Add to this the established relationship between Dawes and Neeld and I reckon the Dees will chase him hard. So I see it like this: Pick 3 Hogan Pick 4 Wines or other potential gun midfielder (with kicking skills please!!!) Pick 20 Dawes Pick 26 Viney after this, mature age players like Pederson, Ottens etc...

Davey cannot go down back in 2013. His great asset was run-down tackles from behind and he no longer has the pace for this. Small and mid sized forwards will now run off him and he does nor have the physical presence to hustle and bustle and bother other forwards. Kicking skills alone are not enough to win a place in the backline. Keep him in the forward pocket where he can run in short burts and use his excellent kicking. Even though at his best he is one of our classiest players, if Tapscott, Strauss and others develop thier kicking Davey may not be able to win a place in the starting 22 due to this skill.

I listen to SEN 90% of my travel to and from work, and often when driving at other times. When Denham comes on I switch to something else or off. I cannot believe he keeps his journalist credentials. He makes wild, unsubstantiated claims more often than not, then uses the great media escape of "that's journalism" or "I'm only reporting what I was told". He guesses stuff, it is that simple.

IF, and it is a bif IF, this Jesse Hogan is as good as people say and as AFL-ready as people say, then it is worth it. I am unsure about giving away a pick three in a draft that could be one of the best ever but at the very least the Dees recruiters haven't fluffed around. They have examined, planned and goine BANG with thier choices. It all seems very deliberate and strong which I like. But this Hogan better be worth it or there will be blue murder among Dees fans.

I am a huge fan of Bail - he has the grunt, speed and competitiveness that we lack in many of our players. For a fair while I had him in my favourite current players. His run and carry could be really important to us. But I can't turn a blind eye to his two glaring skill deficiencies. His kicking is horrible, especially on gthe run and this is where he needs to be at his best. He misses targets by huge margins like Grimes used to do - often when under no pressure. Also, his tackles get broken too easily and he needs a tackling re-format. Maybe Jordie could mentor him over the summer? A keeper for mine. He has only played 30-40 games. Lets see what Neeld, Craig and Co. can do with him.

Then Swans and Geelong have both proven that although recruiting is important, it is actually player development that is the key. I agree with the original post here about not pinning too much on pick 3 or pick 26. We do need some elite players - both midfielders and marking forwards - but I reckon who we recruit is a secondary issue. If we had recruited Jack Darling or Buddy or Hodge or whoever, would we have developed them well? My answer is probably not. Bailey proved hecould not really develop players well, especially not within 3 years. Watts, Tapascott, Garland, Bail, Jetta, Morton, Bate - none of these have improved at the same rate I reckon they would have at most other clubs. Now is a big test for Neeld and his coaching team - can they develop the players we end up with? After this draft our list will probably be 85 - 90% what he wants it to be so he needs to show his coaching and development abilities. We all have our opinions about drafts, trades and the like and we will agree to disagree, but can our coaching staff form a finals team out of the 40 or so players we end up with in late November? That is my question re 2013.

Don't trade him. His football over the last 8 weeks of 2012 was the best and most consistent he has ever played and it included defensive running, something he has been appalling at for a long time. I reckon he is finding the Neeld/Craig setup exactly what he needs to move from potential to results. Trade others but not Sylvia.

He is known to be a below average people-manager, and too many clubs believe this to be essential in modern coaching. For mine, he is a premiership coach and I remember the days of Tredrea, Cornes x2, Francou, Burgoyne x2. There are some flaky footballers in that list and he was able to harness their best, mould them into a team and beat the Lions often during thier 3 year reign. He seems to be more of an old fashioned ranter like Eade but in some way he gets results out of people. It appears that GWS young players developed quicker than the Gold Coast boys and this is due almost entirely to him.. But his greatest strength - even admitted by people who despise him - is his development of younger players, new draftees, in a teaching role. This is a great move from Williams and the Tiges will benefit from his appointment.

Turning stones implies you will look in every angle, every crevice, every hidden and secret spot and it sounds like our recruiters are doing just that. It does not mean you will take hold of everything you find. A lot of players from other AFL clubs simply won't want to come to the Dees in our current position - only those good enough for AFL but are out of favour or out of form will end up with us, unlesswe offer major $ like we did to Clarke.

OK - you might be right - Farren Ray is more than a team fill up, but I maintain the basics of my position. The Dees will recruit 3-4 players who are 23+ with bniggish bodies to help us through an interim period and who will provide "depth". Farren Ray fits into this category in some ways, but will come with benefits, and they are that he could maintain his place in our midfield because he is better than some of those who are currently in it.

We are not chasing any quick fixes. Neeld's focus appears to be clear. I read it like this: he expects within the next 18 months or so for a heap of players to reach 50-80 games maturity and then we can seriously challenge. Up until that time he wants to add to our list 23+ year old stop gap players with big bodies and great attitudes to help us through this next 18 months or so. Go back 12 months and look at Magner, Couch, Williams, Sellar etc... and you will see the beginnings of his thought process. If we do get Rodan, Farren Ray, Ottens etc... it is likely Neeld does not see them as part of a finals campaign, but definitley sees the need for them in the interim. We need them while the younger boys get to 50-80 games. Farren Ray is a big yes from me. Although he is not a big body as such others Neeld has recruited, he plays his best footy when the game is really tight; he is coming from a strong team at St. Kilda; he is quicker than a lot of our boys; and he has experience.

In answer to the question posed in the topic, the Swans win in the Granf Final has very little to say to me about Mark Neeld's coaching. He was not coaching a team on the day Neither of the two coaches involved have been senior coaches to him as an assistant or mentors to him. The Swans have a wonderful inner culture developed by Roos, now inherited and developed by Longmire. We deliberately tanked, pushed out long-serving leaders and went for youth which has not worked on any level. The inner health and status of the Swans comapred to us are poles apart. Our team has not played one game remotely like the Swans or Hawks in Neeld's time. Team performance is the best measure of a coach and at least 2013 will give us a clear idea if Neeld can coach. Two full preseasons and one failed home and away season have laid the foundation for Neeld to show us what he and his coaching group have.

With Neeld bringing in Magner, Couch and Sellar for season 2012 - all older than 20 years with mature bodies - I reckon we can determine that he knows we need ready-made stop gap players to tide us over until our list matures. Interesting though that he was not sold on Moloney, Bate or Petterd being these stop gap players. He requires a certain attitude to accompany the bigger body and is uncompromising on this. However, I can't see us shifting 15 players during FA / trade / draft. With the three who are already gone - Lawrence, Green, Moloney - I reckon he will shift another 6-7 at the maximum. If Neeld continues with the mentality he has shown so far Approx 3 of the newer players will be early twenties, big bodies, and either not getting a game at their AFL club ( like Cam Pederson) or showing great form in VFL / SANFL / WAFL. 2 via FA / trade for exisiting AFL players (these two players are of vital importance to the Dees in 2013) Approx 5 in the draft - we know Viney will be one of these. There is not a lot of pure talent available to us in FA / trade but we have to get the best aviable that suit our needs. Of course, some of the draft positions might be caught up in the trading and there can be lots of variations but we can't go too far on drafting 18 yo kids, or filling up with other team rejects. The 2 existing AFL players we try to trade for have got to be ready to play and worth our while - maybe Shannon Byrnes from Geelong and Koby Stevens from WCE or other similar types? The two players we do trade for have to be able to come straight in.

If I was envious on 8th September I am even more so now. I hate the overuse of the word culture, but this club has something that can't be bought, stolen or copied. You have to build it and I want the Dees to build a club/team spirit that is similar, but which defines us and wins flags. Across the 22 they were a bit weaker man-for-man than Hawks but played one of the best team games I have seen - ever.

I can't stand the idea that only players from the winning side can win best-on-ground perfrmances. It is an evolution of modern Brownlow voting that would have made players from the past seethe. Bobby Skilton Gary Dempsey Kevin Murray These blokes were guns and champions and would thrive in any era. They went in, got it, played inside and outside abd were rarely beaten. They are also the reason why the word "fairest" should remain the first word in the trophy, before "best". Modern Brownlow voting is too much about the bestplayer in the winning side, and not about the fairest and best footballer. Ablett should rock it in, but I am not sure if the umpires will give him enough votes considering how often GC lost. Sam Mitchell will probably win it

Yep, me too, serious man love for Matty Whelan. That Hird bump is a particuar favourite - I visit it at least twice a year on Youtube. And I agree that Nev Jetta has this streak in him. I just wish he could stay fit enough to use it more.

One of my all-time favourite Dees players who has done a great job at Casey. Sad to see him go.

1. Target a midfield coach like Ratten, Ling, maybe Junior, who can communicate what they know. This is priority No. 1 2. Huge preseason in the gym - give Dave Misson free reign to put big weight on frames like Gysberts, Watts, Strauss, Gawn, Bail, T McDonald. 3. Delist/Trade Morton, Bate, Petterd, Bennell as a minimum 4. Recruit 2 outside midfield class who can run and carry in the manner of Yarran from Carlton, Thomas from Collingwood, Jetta from Swans etc... 5. Recruit 2 players who can't get a regular game at their club who can make an immediate impact on our starting 22 - Wellingham, Gumbleton, Levi Greenwood etc...

Trying to balance brilliance, consistency and skill to find the best 22 from 40 -payers is difficult enough, but they didn't even start with the best 40. Three glaring errors though: No Sam MItchell in the best 22, but they include Rioli No Pavlich in the best 40 Including Natanui at all. Honestly, I am simply not interested in the All Australain awards any more, it has become too tainted. What I mean by this is that it feels as if they want the fans clicking on websites, downlaoding apps, tweeting and Facebook-ing, and create subject matter to fill the media pages, internet and radio call-back sessions, rather than actually selecting the best 22 players IN THEIR RELEVANT POSITIONS.