DeeSpencer

Are Richmond even back training yet? Im not saying you don’t get in to full scale training, I just don’t see the point of it in November. I think an under reported aspect of our injury crisis last year was our poor skills and decision making led to injuries. Hore and Viney are 2 that had no need to get injuries and probably plenty more. Richmond’s ball movement, like Hawthorn in their best years is so quick and uncontested. Run, share, link etc. Clearly they are very strong in the contest especially defensively but we’ve got a heap of skill stuff we can do in November. Do that before the finals teams get in full training and we’ll have made ground on skills and fitness and not lost ground in injuries.

The way he can get out of a stoppage isn't just impressive for a ruck it's impressive for any player and it's why I think we'll eventually go with him. Green will win more footy but he's a handball king, Jackson can run it out.

Can have all the pressure without the contract. Pressure these days is as much about corralling as tackling anyway. Then if a defender gets an intercept you call it an intercept, you don't have the forward fight for it. If the forward is going to get spoiled then the defender can just mimic the spoil and the coach can call it a turnover. I think we've got too many guys like Oliver, Petracca, Viney, Harmes who can clean up messy skills even with heavy contact by winning contests that we don't train precision skills and decisions enough. If you're a messy young player just handball it somewhere near Petracca and let him beat his man, you'll look great. Otherwise, slowly ramp the amount of allowed contact up and be cautious with guys who aren't 100%. Oliver and KK both clearly not 100%, don't allow them near a drill that has the potential for a reasonable amount of contact. Last week Kyle Chandler was training with a knee taped up. This week he's in rehab. I'd have a no full training with anything taped rule. Richmond last year - no tape in the grand final, win it by plenty. GWS - all sorts of players taped up!

Nope. Hoping to get to a full session next week. At 9 or 10:30 or whenever

Sounds like poor awareness from Hore to get anywhere near KK, disappointing. Why you’d have Oliver back in any kind of contact before he’s 100% again is beyond me. Stop doing contact drills in November. Just isn’t worth it. This team needs so much skill and decision making work it’s beyond me why you’d do anything with risky contact.

Which picks? 2015: No one predicted Oliver until close to the draft. Weideman - clearly a key forward was of interest but I'm not sure it was influenced. Later picks. 2016: Just later picks, I only knew of Hannan as a VFL player before draft night. 2017: I can't remember any buzz about Spargo or Petty to us until right before the draft when Spargo was mocked to us. Spargo, Fritsch, Petty, Baker was a mixed bag of selections. Tall, medium, small. 2018: There was nothing about Sparrow, Jordon, Nietschke or Hore. Add in Bedford at it was a real variety of talent. Mids, backs, forwards. I think pick 3 is locked in. Most likely Jackson but I can't see a trade. We pick from Jackson, Green and Young as forecast on Road to the draft. Picks 10 and 28: yes draft strategy will be involved here. I imagine player cut offs for both picks. If player A is available then we draft him. If XYZ are all still on the board we move back a bit. If XYZ are all gone then we move back for different reasons. If pick 10 goes back then pick 28 comes up. All sorts of contingency plans.

Sandilands last played a full season at age 32, since then he's played 5 games, 10 games, 11 games, 6 games. Slowly easing down from the 80%+ of ruck he currently plays to a move 50/50 is probably the best way to prolong Gawn's career. I could see Jackson playing 50% game time in the ruck by year 2 if not year 3. That's a lot faster than year 5/6.

Gawn is about to turn 28. Jackson will play from ages 22-32 with Gawn aged 32 and either retired or right near the end. Dean Cox was 27 when Nic Nat was drafted. Only the rarest of draftees make meaningful impact in year 1. Walsh, Rozee, Rioli. Even guys like Oliver play good and bad games and limited minutes. They aren't as good as you think, often they are playing just to satisfy fans and so coaches can say they play the kids. From year 2 Jackson will be supporting a 29 year old Gawn. From year 3 Jackson will be supporting a 30 year old Gawn.

We need top end talent, we should get that at pick 3, but otherwise looking at our list and without digging this up from when I did it the Buckenara thread (so apologies if I miss anyone): A graders or potential A graders on our list: Gawn, Oliver, Petracca, May, McDonald. Pick 3 (eventually) B+/B: Lever, Salem, Harmes, Viney, Melksham, Fritsch, Langdon, maybe Jetta, Brayshaw C+: maybe Hibberd, Tomlinson That's 16 players who you'd think feature in the best 22 if fit and healthy. Everyone else has a big question mark next to them. Absent from that list: 2nd tall at either end, small forward, classy kicking mids and probably a need for a lock down defender sooner rather than later. And of course we've got some handy depth and kids, plus injured guys with talent (Vanders, KK, J Smith, Hannan and even Bennell) but do we need to put every egg in one pick 8 basket and pray to get another A grade prospect? Or is what we really need is a couple of talented kids with skills who play their role and provide a bit of class. And is it possible to get both - the highly rated high ceiling player like a gun mid like Kemp or Stephens and pick up a small forward or key defensive prospect with a later pick.

Stephens still a chance to Sydney if they go for midfield class rather than Flanders, but I can absolutely see Adelaide going McAsey, they are in a full rebuild and need to get tall pillars. Then Freo will find it hard to go past Robertson as a Lachie Neale replacement and could be tempted by Serong or whoevers left from Ash/Young. They've got Henry coming after that who projects as wing as much as a forward and can move Brayshaw or Cerra outside.

Key defender is a huge need alongside small forward. In an ideal world I'd love a classy mid and then by some miracle De Koning and Pickett. 2 of 3 would be a start.

If we get pick 28 for nothing our end then it's a good reason! Let's hope our guys have done the right calculations. I still like the idea of trading back even further.

That's my problem with this deal. If it was done on draft night I'd be all for it because we'd know exactly who's gone in the top 7 and who's left at 8/9/10. The club must be very confident of their research and rankings.

10, 28 matches up pretty much bang on with 14, 17 if we're planning on Weightman or Pickett and are willing to go back again. Kemp at 10, staying above Hawthorn looks a good spot to me. Otherwise slide baby slide.

So far this is more about Freo opening up their future first round pick. My guess is they'll match a bid for Henry with junk picks then look to trade back in to the mid/late first round. There's going to be some bargain picks on offer for teams brave enough to defer until next year. Should we do that??? Brisbane got Port's first rounder next year for pick 16! I'd be willing to bet that works out for Brisbane.

Of course they can, you could have a computer program keep track of which pick has gone where and have a big fat alarm go off if the rules are broken. Plus clubs will know the rules and know which picks they can and can't deal and where. The deals in recent days have all been about clubs getting late round picks so they can trade their future first rounders. Clubs are aware of the rules.

Yikes. 23 not included. We might be sliding down the order more than I thought. (why am I not surprised)

We aren't allowed to get 22 back from the Dockers directly if I've read the rules correctly. That's the Swans loophole last year closing. So the Crows get a one pick slide for making things work, probably some late picks mixed in

Surely Melb: 8 for 10, 23 Freo: 10, 22 for 8 Adelaide: 23 for 22

Fair point on speed, the testing numbers largely don't reflect game play. But he averaged nearly 40 hit outs out muscling or out jumping fellow 18 year old beanstalks, the coaches are going to talk up his leap whether he's the next Nic Nat or a 35 year old chained to the ground Jamar. The numbers aren't biased (unlike Sumich desperately chasing an AFL job) and support that he's got a good but not great leap, particularly when allowed a run at it. All I'm saying is the numbers and watching him play point to a player far more like Grundy - decent but not dominant at hit outs, extra midfielder around the ground - rather than a Nic Nat like athlete.

Agree with most of that. Height doesn't bother me. Reach would be a fairer measurement anyway. Give me a guy who's 3 cm shorter but has 4cm longer arms. On his leap: Draft profiles are nice but hard facts are better. According to one of the draft watchers his jumping numbers are: Standing 57cm / Running 78cm That standing leap is pretty ordinary. So at around the ground contest he'll have to use strength control the taps. But hit outs from ball ups with 20 guys around the ball aren't easy to do much with anyway. The running number is much better, not quite elite but easily well above average for a tall. Still along way from Nic Nat who did 78 standing and 102 jumping, so I don't think Jackson will be jumping over AFL rucks and winning clean hit outs. But no one bar Nic Nat ever does! Grundy didn't make the top 10 in either standing or running leaps so the comparison might be similar there. Cal Twomey said yesterday he's spoken to a number of clubs about what he thinks Melbourne should do with pick 3 and there were a variety of options but several had said take Jackson. Unless they are bluffing GWS appears to be 1 of those. Anyone who thinks this is Jason Taylor out on an island is ignoring some strong reporting.

I think we need to drastically scale back his training loads and build a game plan around him sitting deeper at full back. Many dreams of changing his body shape and game style are just that, dreams.

May wasn’t on the track by the time I got there.

If you think Green is Cripps then draft him, but if you think he is Matt Crouch and you think Jackson is Grundy then you go with Jackson.

Clayton Oliver’s laid more tackles and won more contested ball than any player his age in the modern era. Absolute nonsense to have him aggressively tackling and tackled in November. Save that for Feb/March. They can still do wresting and grabbing drills and whatever else they need to train tackling.