Dr. Gonzo

Maybe he figures they'l learn how to play properly in a competitive Casey side instead of a Melbourne side that gets flogged.

Just on the Saints, I was telling my brother & sister about the bag heads at the game on Sunday and said we should start doing it if the team doesn't improve by the end of the year.

He was the first one I thought of last year before Roos became a possibility. In fact at some point during the nightmare round 2 game v Essendon I mentioned to my brother I thought Ratten could be the next coach.

It's pretty laughable. Sure we may have stuffed up and if we did things that breached the rules we should cop it. But trying to equate what happened at MFC with what happened at Windy Hill? What a joke, the two circumstances are WORLDS apart and even a hack journo like "Robbo" should be clued on enough to discern the difference; it is his job after all, even if he thinks it's just sinking pi$$ and hanging out with his idols.

As with most things, the AFL has looked to US sports to implement a concept (FA in this instance) but only gone half way. I'm not an expert on US sports, FA etc but rom my experience the in the US club's have the ability to "Franchise" tag players so that they are not susceptible to FA.

There is a LOT more going on with Essendon than just AOD and more than Trengove involved at MFC (I remember at least Dunn and maybe [censored] among others mentioned in texts relating to receiving injections).

Generally I'd agree but with our dearth of tall forwards and the performance of the team will it really matter if he is straight into the seniors? If he reinjures it again well he would have done that anyway and we play a player down for the rest of the game having taken a chance. If he has to be managed through well at least we get a forward target for at least part of the game. I'd rather see players like Viney & Hogan eased back through the reserves and Dawes & Garland straight back into the side - I mean what do we really stand to lose?

There's nothing else that can be done with our current list and injury situation. Our list still needs another 2 or 3 offseasons to turn around and get it where it needs to be. That doesn't mean we will be uncompetitive for that long and people have every rich to be disappointed when we get belted but people also need to set realistic expectations. When Melbourne finally does start playing well/winning/making finals the supporters will jump back on. The key thig is to make sure the club is in the right hands and the right culture is put in place for the next decade otherwise things will fall apart again quickly. How many teams would realistically expect to win with a ruck/KPF combo of Spencer, Pedersen and Fitzpatrick? Most sides would struggle and that is without even talking about our mids who have improved on last year with the inclusions of Tyson, Vince & Cross but who still don't bat deep enough. I am as frustrated/dejected as anyone with our curren plight but if rather see Roos stick to his guns and set the standards for our team than swing the axe and play players in roles they have not trained all preseason for (such as Watts to FF etc). Let the team/players develop in the roles they've been given and focus on the things we are doing well (contested possessions) and things we can improve on through effort (tackles, 1%ers) rather than the things were not found at this stage (skill errors, turnovers) because those things will come after we get the structures/roles in place, get our key big men back and set the standards for our club.

It's been a long 7 years but unfortunately all we as supporters can do is suck it up and start again. Roos has had a preseason & 2 games so far and our KPP/ruck stocks have been decimated. If it was an even spread of injuries we could have coped better but having all your key forwards out and your 2 best ruck options kills us. If we can get some consistency going and get some players back I will be happy with an improved second half of the year like the Dogs last year or the Tigers in Hardwicks first year. Remember in 2010 the Tigers were being labelled "the worst team since Fitzroy" too but they had a relatively good back end of the year to give them some confidence heading into the preseason and another opportunity to turn the list over.

I thought pre-game we would get done by 80-120 points so the game went according to my expectations. The only really annoying thing is I didn't get on the Eagles -60 points at $3. I'm in the same boat BB. I stopped being angry/frustrated/depressed in 2012. Now I just expect it don't really care anymore although I'll still go to games and always support the Demons. I vicariously barrack for the Cats and Tigers due to my wife's and cousin's allegiances but it's not the same, it will never be the same - it does make footy fun though. So does chucking on a $5 multi-bet each week with 6 or 8 legs. I'm just glad I'm going to see the Hawks/Cats on Easter Monday so I'll get to witness a good game live at least once this year.

I rewatched the first quarter last night (sadist I know) and a couple of Howe's efforts were pathetic. Can't speak for the rest of the game as I didn't really get to see much but on the first quarter Pedersen put in a far superior effort to Howe even if it didn't amount to much.

We won't be getting anything in a trade, if he leaves it will be as an UFA and we may get a compo pick unless the AFL changes the rules (which they have hinted at doing in the past). I agree however while we are left behind bemoaning what he should've done to help us he will be celebrating a premiership with the Hawks.

Richmond were going about 75-80% and we were flat out and we just got over the line.

We tried that before and got fined $500K.

FWIW heard Viney talking to someone outside the ground yesterday before the game and he said he'd be back in a couple of weeks.

He's a yobbo/bogan/alcoholic and the fact that he is the Chief Football Writer for a major metropolitan newspaper is a disgrace and shame towards what is called modern "journalism". But watching him on 360 is hilarious, you know it's crap but you cannot look away. Sometimes I'll get annoyed watching it when they spout their rubbish and avoid the crux of the matter (especially when discussing the Essendon Drugs stuff) but overall I think it's an OK show. I can't read his columns though, for a journalist you would think he would have learnt that you can't begin an article "Went to the game on Friday." I am astounded an editor doesn't correct it and actually publishes it, not just online but in print.

WCE also have Lycett coming through don't they? Cox is surely pretty close to retirement so Sinclair will probably be second ruck next year though.

I think the strategy is better when talking about rucks. Often rucks take at least 5 years before you even know if they will come on or not and many have come through the rookie list. You're better off drafting a mature ruck than persevering for 5-7 years before they start to show something. There is an argument to be made regarding KPP's as well however not to the same extent. Hawthorn and Geelong may have done well topping up their KPP stocks but they had the foundations there to begin with and then supplemented them once they faced retirements/trades. Overall I think our KPP stocks aren't too bad on paper, it's just about whether we can get them on the park at the same time. Clark, Hogan, Dawes, McDonald, Frawley & Garland are OK but if they go down with injury we fall away very quickly. I'd be looking at another KPF if we can draft a good one early this year but otherwise would be looking at someone like Georgiou to step up next season as a 4th KPD option. Our ruck stocks are deplorable, Jamar has had one good year in 10 and is finished, Spencer doesn't have what it takes, Gawn could be good but is still VERY raw and Fitzpatrick is another NQR. I would be looking at which rucks are available this trade period to try and get a big body in who can help us around the clearances next year. My preference would be Clark in the ruck but as we know he is an unknown quantity at this point. Our midfield has improved from last year but is still a LONG way off. We have a hanful of competent mids, we need about a dozen to 15 who can rotate through there. We need to replace the flankers on our list (guys like Tapscott, Blease, Strauss etc) with guys who can genuinely run through the middle and can kick goals. So I'd be looking at another draft stockpiling mids with a KPF if we get a couple of early picks.

My wife is Geelong, I'm going to have a hard time trying to keep him a Demon in the future if our predicament doesn't change, especially when he has a few premiership DVD's he can grab out and watch when he wants to watch some real footy.

That really sucks and is the thing that hurts almost as bad as being so poor, the fact that we are disenfranchising a generation of supporters after doing the same through the 70's/early 80's. We can't afford to bleed support but the way we are going we will have less members than the Dogs in 10 years, we already have less than North now. I remember back to when I was 6, 7, 8 years old going to the footy (1988, 89, 90) and believing we could win every week and getting to see us not only win but make and win finals although falling short of the premiership. I can't imagine having to keep the faith as a kid that young watching this crap for 7 years going on 8. That's an entire lifetime of watching footy as a youth and I think if I were that age I would have lost all interest in footy by now or at least the Demons and just watch the big games on TV.

I'm glad I booked tickets to the Haw/Geel Easter Monday game at the start of the season so I'll get to see at least 1 good game live this year. The competition has been great for the last 10 years unfortunately we have been so bad during that whole period that we have missed out on seeing some genuinely great modern footy live. Watching on TV is one thing but nothing beats the atmosphere of a big game where both clubs know they are a chance at winning. How long has it been since that happened for us? The Richmond/Carlton Elimination Final last year wasn't a great game but being there live the atmosphere was cracking. I think I'm going to start using my AFL membership to attend more neutral games this year because I'm sick of taking about 5 hours (including travel etc) out of my weekend to be bored, frustrated, disappointed and depressed for another year.

I also took my son to his first game yesterday, fortunately he's only 1 so has no idea of the lifetime of torment I've inflicted upon him. When I got home my wife said she actually felt sorry for our son and not in a condescending or mocking way, she was being heartfelt. The best part of the day was when he saw the camels outside gate 3, should have gone home after that.

You'd rather see ridiculous contracts given to guys who were never good enough rather than guys who are nearing the end of their careers. I get it.

When did that happen? I saw the pic in the other thread from AFL.com.au but must have missed it at the game (or I had already left).

We'll just have to agree to disagree. I think it comes down to the fact I would rather see players on our list who are actually capable of performing at AFL level whereas you don't care we play as long as they do not cost us too much.