NeveroddoreveN

The message got through to at least one player! But No is the answer..... Paul Roos was an amazing player who got the best out of himself regardless of where his team was at. Simon Goodwin was a player who also got the best out of himself, especially for guy that was considered too short and against all odds made it. We just don't seem to demand excellence with our mob. Near enough is quite often good enough. To get the best out of players needs a plethora of motivational techniques. Each player requires something slightly different when it comes to motivation/fear/instilling confidence, and when they need a whack individually, or as a group. Last year should have really stung the entire playing group into action. Now it will have to be this year that stings them into action. Roos walked away, i would say Goodwin will likely get sacked. i wish more players would "choose" to be great and put in the required effort. When careers end many will be able to look back on their time at Demons and know within themselves they never gave their all. It is sad. At least Goodwin/Roos can rest easy knowing during their playing careers they chose to be great. I still question many of our players output.

This lays squarely on on our coaches. We had no game plan at all. We believed our list was better than Sydneys and just expected to win with talent on paper. Could count on one hand the times this year we had a game plan. We don't seem to respect opposition, always just play our way. The players are following a gameplan, or lack there of and we reap the rewards. All clubs prepare and have opposition analysis, i actually wonder whether we do!?

The excuses were there and pretty much have been throughout. It is like it just gets too hard for us at times, dealing with adversity is not our thing! I feel he has put it back on the players with comments like if they are good enough to compete for finals they will. Personally i like the selections this week! Bedford should have been given many opportunities this year....came 2nd to ANB in time trials and was obviously a bolter this year. Has skills, determined to make it, one of fittest at club. He would have gelled nicely with Kozzie and we may have had some pressure up forward. Baker has been tearing it up for last month in the praccy games, has a few tricks and is quick. Hunt i am never sure, athletic, fast, can mark, can kick, not a natural football player i think is the issue, similar to Harmes/Smith. Play Max 80% of game forward, let Preuss take the ruck and lets see what he has got... We have way too many favourites of Goody who just get rewarded for sub standard games for way too long. There are fringe players busting their guts to get there. When players are not getting rewarded for effort, or adversely others are getting rewarded for lack of effort, you have to wonder what is the selection criteria? It is not rewarding hard work, nor are there consequences for having bad games/seasons...Melksham/Mcdonalds of the world. If i was fringe player i would be pulling my hair out. As it is i am just a balding supporter scratching my head once again.

The tackling or lack thereof is an interesting discussion. Hearing many of you say you can "tell" by our start we are going to put in a stinker. I feel the most important stat in footy nowadays is the pressure gauge. This comprises 6 areas of the game. Physical Pressure - Any time physical contact is made on a disposal or a tackle is laid. Closing Pressure - Coming at a player just as he is about to dispose the ball. (includes smothers) Chasing - Running with intent to catch the opposition with the ball. Corralling - Can't lay a tackle but can still pressure player with ball into a more confined situation, or wrong foot them, etc No Pressure - Can't see opposition player on Tv screen vs ball carrier. Set Position - Basically manning the mark stat. Would love to see this stat throughout the season and the differential to our opponent in each game. Can remember the vs Carlton game where our first quarter had pressure up over 200 which is where Geelong was first half last night. We seem to fall off a cliff though when it comes to putting pressure on the ball carrier or next possession and i believe this is reason why supporters can see we are having another off day. Hawthorn is an example of a team that put very little pressure vs us when we played and we looked amazing. Vice versa we make other teams look amazing when we put on very little of this thing called pressure, perceived or actual!

The title of this thread is misleading. I was expecting some substance to it at least....this type of venting could/should be posted anywhere on Demonland....Does it really require it's own thread lol?!

We don't see the need for a kicking coach or forwards coach either.....Simon will be gone from head coaching roles if he does not get real. Keep treating anything he does not like hearing as "noise" and he will will not prosper. Seems to be a zero acceptance policy which is just fraught with delusion. Accept the positives and ignore the negatives....continue on Demons! No wonder we get dished out rubbish quite often. There is so little acceptance or accountability. If small business was run like this they just die. This is a large corporation. Are we ever going to start accepting that this is not good enough and we just have to change?

Tami was not particularly specialising in sports psychology and agreed it sounds quite different to Richmond. Goody may not be a fan but i will extract this piece and say definitively we need this and it starts from the coach...i think you could change coaches names and it still makes perfect sense of where Richmond were at post 2016...and where we are currently. At the end of the 2016 season, coach Damien Hardwick reviewed his and the team's performance. One reaction to the horror of 2016 could have been denial or avoidance of reality, perhaps shifting blame to injuries or other external factors. Instead, Hardwick reported that he took himself to task, writing down his strengths and areas for improvement. Through accepting and acknowledging the reality of the situation, Hardwick could recognise an over-reliance on micromanagement and a failure to listen to others when times were tough. By recognising this, he was then able to change and improve his coaching style.

The biggest change they made was getting a good sports psychologist imo.....i linked this few posts back but read through this article and see if you get the similarity of our clubs current position. It is an absolute no brainer to at least try something outside the box. Mindfulness is the difference between a lot of these teams. Adelaide also point out what a "bad" mindfulness camp can do. We need complete honesty from our playing list. If Goodwin and Gawn comments is the standard and they praise half hearted efforts, we will be satisfied with half hearted efforts. We soooooooo need to get real. Link to article below. https://www.smh.com.au/opinion/mindfulness-was-a-key-factor-in-richmonds-grand-final-victory-20171002-gysjwv.html

We are not all that different to Richmond in a lot of ways....older article but i think this type honesty is what we need to start. https://www.smh.com.au/opinion/mindfulness-was-a-key-factor-in-richmonds-grand-final-victory-20171002-gysjwv.html

Getting someone who actually was a leader throughout his career and did wonders for Brisbane in short stint is not practical? We seem pretty devoid of this thing called leadership ....I think we need tangibles but Luke Hodge would be a great get for leadership/tactics/smarts...probably good enough to be our kicking coach on the side too. Is there a downside to trying someone like this??

We will win this in style! We will then proceed to lose the next two matches in a very ugly fashion! Praying for a 4 quarter effort from EVERY player. The distance between our best and our worst football is staggering, who knows what to expect!? Go you erratic Demons! Wagner to surprise today and kick 2 or 3 goals and set up others.

Agree with all of this but I see a massive issue that we seem to go away from on a regular basis. We don't pressure the ball carrier, we fall off in waves to flood defence....even man on mark turns his back to run away lmao. Our game style is beyond flawed...we are the best team at defending grass and making opposition look sublime through very little pressure all across the ground.

I wonder whether Goodie actually listens to ANY of our assistant coaches....Clearly wants to do things his own way! Buckley/Hardwick both learned to use their assistant coaches and make it a team effort all across the board. Petracca has improved his game through an individual realisation he wanted better out of himself. We really don't seem to develop our players at all well, quite often they go backwards within our system. Something is just horribly wrong...Usually the fish rots at the head

We really need to recruit that psychologist that helped get to the bottom of years of failure over at Tigerland. We played with no pressure across the entire park. There were a few individual efforts and one good team passage of play. They just decide after first few minutes that this was too hard? I really would like to know why it takes an absolute roasting in the press for them to play half decent football. Then after said good game (or 2 if we are lucky) we get content, think we are good, pats on the back all around and complacency sets in again. Get out of this cycle Demons, get the best sports psychologist to help retrain some of the carp that seems to be inbuilt into players across our club. I think most would agree we are simply not getting enough out of a really decent list. I doubt we even reviewed our loss vs Brisbane because it was a "decent effort". It was actually a precursor to an even quicker side by foot in Port doing exactly the same tactics 4 days later and we actually had no answers. It was hot potato panic stations all night long! Let us win the contest and outnumber on the outside. We win the ball, get tackled, cough ball up and they are off to the races with players running freely with no pressure. This team is so darn frustrating, on so many levels!!!

No need to fear, our forwards coach is all over this.....oh wait!! I think the changes are a bit dodgy if I am totally honest. TMac seems to have a habit of crowding areas in our forward line and has zero defensive pressure. Sparrow I am rapt for him to get a game but I expect he will have minimal impact. Having watched all of Ports games I am highly concerned on a dry pitch they are going to run us off our feet rebounding from our backline with pressure from Tmac/Weids/LJ?/Fritta/Melksham.....who is going to stop them.....Kozzie or Hannan? It seems we are going with a high risk structure, great if clunking marks but when the ball hits the ground I think we are going to be found wanting extra smalls. For this to work all across the field we are going to have to pressure, pressure, pressure. Much more nervous about this game than against Brisbane. Against Brisbane we had way too many passengers...this week we can't afford so many to have an off day. Will yourselves into the game Demons, find your form through repeated efforts and this is ours for the taking!

I always loved your training reports! These days it seems like you are all about point scoring against posters. How are you to know he did not get some information that was highly pertinent? You think you are the only Melbourne supporter out there in close enough proximity to get privileged information from a club source? Your source is a public one where Chaplin told other members and you think that honestly has more validity? Sorry to get involved her but these type comments from you are really tiring. You are adding nothing.

I am not sure it was sustainable either tbh! Now we have a fit team and 16 minute quarters I really think it could be. The main issue was always the balance of guys in at the contest, it felt like an under 12's approach where we all hunted the ball, once teams started letting us have +1 or +2 at the stoppages we simply just coughed it up time and time again. It really needed tinkering, keep hunting the ball carrier just don't overcommit to every contest! With adding players like Langdon who runs all day looking for easy outlet passes I really believe we'd have much better balance to actually do it for longer periods. It is not the players, our current gameplan is the easiest to coach against for a heap of reasons currently. Lack of pressure all over the ground really just allows opposition to display sublime skills, yet we look scared to make mistakes or take the game on. I am not sure we even have a gameplan!! We just want to play our way with no respect for opposition tactics. I bet today Goodwin backs us to beat Gold Coast with no noticeable changes to style. Seeing SImon say with a cheeky little grin we are ignoring the "noise" and working on it fills me with no confidence whatsoever. I don't even think he realises how in jeopardy his career currently is. We lose today and how long can he continue to ignore that "noise"!? You would think to be flexible, would be a given to be an AFL coach....Managing 40+men with different personalities and motivations....Is our coach flexible? I have seen so few moves on gameday or between games I am not sure he has it in him. I can only imagine there are lots of ideas getting thrown at Goodie from our coaching department. Not much is being implemented though is it? He wants to do things his way to get all the acclaim? Stubborn? I don't get why we are not changing things up!!!

If I was Goodie I would start by being honest to his players and say something like "I am so sorry guys, I have actually hampered a lot of your development as players by sticking to a game plan that simply does not work, or is not working currently. We have been trying so hard to implement this zone that we have actually gone away from something that was "starting" to make us look a good team. Remember when we used to all frenetically chase and tackle? We are going back to that, I demand that we at least have players in the vicinity impacting contests. And if a tackle is missed, there should be a 2nd wave coming in to help their mate, and a 3rd or a 4th. You get the picture. We need to have purpose in what we do, hunting the ball when you don't have it. when we win the ball spread and run forward, create options. Shepherds, smothers, tackles, tap-ons. Oh and put your hands up on the mark too guys! We all do these things unconditionally and when it's our turn to go, we go ok??! Talk! Impact contests! Run, create and overlap, tackle like you mean it! Help your mates always, lets light a fire team. We have been to Hell and Back. And i'll admit I could not quite put my finger on why, I had so much information but basically I got overloaded with information and forgot some of the simple things that good teams do. We are the fittest we have ever been, this is a crazy season, I am sorry have been a crazy coach. From today we change the way we play. We will be far less predictable. Let's give it a real crack team, this season is far from over with this new gameplan the competition may not even know what hit em!" He definitely needs to work it out soon, I am not sure why so reluctant to change things up, different personnel but same game plan has stalled us badly. I like the 4 changes this week but honestly until the gameplan is adjusted, we will still play ugly, uninspiring football. Become the hunters again and we could be anything. It really is not that complicated, things need to be simplified where everyone knows their role, currently we have guys busting a gut for not much result. Our team would have much better skills with new, simplified, attack ball, game plan. Watching them at training most of their skills are up to scratch, the ball barely hits the ground. It falls apart on weekends because our gameplan is way out of whack. They train hard, they are perhaps fitter than they have ever been, there may be inequalities with selection and paychecks, all sorts of reasons to underperform as a team/individual. As a club we really could be so much better if we did the simple things half well. If you are fit, you can pressure. Have 20 blokes pressuring and all of a sudden we look like a completely different team. We caught Carlton napping in the 1st quarter but our pressure on the ball carrier and pressure in general was off the charts. We stopped pressuring and the game rapidly changed. This should have been worked out like round 4 last season, not to sound too condescending. I would actually like to see Goody and Melbourne have success though, it is really up to him and the coaching staff/players to do something daring and a bit different. Recognising where it went wrong is where to start. Show the player 2018 and what they were doing right....encourage to do that again, the balance at the contest we can work out later. Let the back 6 worry about keeping some sort of shape to our back half, the rest need to start hunting again.

I reckon they are doing what they are told. His messaging must be very inconsistent or we have the dumbest players ever to play AFL.. I know it is highly unlikely to be the latter, we got some fairly smart players on our list! Do this, but don't do this, but if this happens do this! The messaging of a coach can be insightful or debilitating. When it al goes pear shaped, strip it back and simplify it. Currently we are devoid of plan and I am not sure our coaching department have really gotten close to the issue in the last 18 months or so. Around the same time we stopped attacking the contest and manically hunting the ball carrier. Sure we needed more balance with not everyone jumping in but that was just a part of OUR style that needed to be tinkered with. After that West Coast match we been trying to play zone the whole time. Enough time has been wasted on something that has made us easy to play against whatever style you choose. The zone needs to die to fairly large degree and players start becoming accountable.

Haha yeah it would be easy enough to question whether he does when he talks constantly of this thing called connection. He knows what the problem is though rest assured. He just chose not to tell any of us in case he was in fact wrong. Hunt the ball carrier is the start of it for us I can almost guarantee it. Shuffling deck chairs so to speak is going to make zero difference until we start pressuring....all across the field. Would be lot more fun for players, we'd kick goals and the players would start playing for each other/their coach/us. Footy can be fun if you get the basics right. We just went away from the basics running back to some zone so we don't occasionally get scored easy goals out the back. The players clearly hate it, the supporters hate it. Be attacking when you don't have the ball and watch the chaos rewards that come. Shackles need to be released! The pressure builds because we see the same game plan, the tweaks revolve around our dysfunctional zone currently. Let them attack the ball with no fear for stuff ups because they will get plenty of chances to make up for it if they keep bashing and crashing in to support their team to create the next contest. We are fit, You'd think we'd be hungry. I just don't think we are all that smart currently. We look reactive, it just makes us look bad. Must stop guarding grass. It is so bad

Long suffering/supporting Demon whose heart beats red and blue. I reckon I been reading this forum pretty avidly for last five to six years, was certainly overdue to subscribe! I watch every Melbourne match twice. Somewhat glutton for punishment, but I find I see quite a bit more second time around without the vested emotion of win or a loss on the line. It actually baffles me as to why our coaching collective can't find a solution to ignite this team. There is a fairly simple solution that I can see that would change the whole vibe of the way we play. Our transition since 6-6-6 has been fairly abysmal, our fall since then or maybe that Prelim vs West Coast has been on a downward trajectory. Short of Petracca there does not seem to be much individual improvement. Our team looks great on paper this year. Our game style, not so much..... Until we fix what we seem to have seemingly forgotten what made us a revelation in 2018. In all the analysis I have seen of Melbourne lately I am gobsmacked they do not offer any real solutions. Our disposal as a team has always been hit and miss. 2018 chaosball when we scored highly, and played an inspiring style of football should have been the new standards. The messaging must be confused. We try to play a zone, which all teams must do to a degree, our team is one of the best at keeping a structure in the back half. As a team trying to play a zone though, what are we actually doing? We run frantically back towards the opposition goal once the opposition have possession, trying not to give up easy goals, and by doing this we actually give up pretty easy goals ironically. Time, and time and time again. Solution?? Pressure the ball carrier. It is basic football, and we are the worst team at it. In 2018 we had waves of players attacking the ball carrier, why have we as a collective stopped doing this? Nowadays we are so busy running backwards to guard grass. Opposition gets the ball and you are within 5-30m of that ball, get proactive Demons, attack that ball carrier, there are so many positive flow on effects from doing this. Don't turn your back to on player who has ball to run and guard grass. Hands up on mark. Simon this IS the problem. We don't attack the ball carrier. We allow other teams to display exquisite skills either by hand or foot, yet ours looks so bad because hey no one is ever pressuring the ball carrier or even has their hands up on the mark. Chinese checkers is an easy game to play for most AFL teams. Geelong played something far worse against us. Chip checkers i'll call it. We got beaten by a garbage tactic which should have been easy to punish but all day we ran to guard grass. Please Simon for the love of God go back to instilling into this team to attack the ball carrier. Your job Is to get the best out of these guys. They, mostly...are fit. We have close to a full list. Picket our newest recruit get it. He scampers to pressure the ball carrier, Hannan is another who also has laid some crunching tackles, and runs as fast as he can to pressure the ball carrier. Our whole team needs to start getting inspired by their teammates actions of creating pressure/turnovers. Start pressuring the ball carrier as a collective and we will improve overnight. Scrap this zone BS. No one is responsible for anything currently. Hunt the ball barrier, handball or kick forward a lot more often. Sense your teammate is going to win the ball and you don't need to be that second man in to pressure? RUN. Create an easy option for your teammate who just did a great job. Get involved. There needs to be more shepherds. Now I am confusing the messaging. Adding layers to this team we seem to have forgotten the basics. Kicking and handballing skills are dependent on the pressure being applied. The best teams, the best players all succumb to pressure occasionally. We need to start applying it as a collective when we don't have the ball. That includes pressuring the ball carrier at all times. If you are not pressuring the ball carrier you should be trying to shut down their next option. Get on a man or close enough to intercept should there be turnover. Help your teammates. Shepherd. Give them that split second more to dispose of the ball better. Create options. Create pressure. Create chaos. Play on when you have options streaming forward, don't be afraid to take the first option, reward your teammate running past if he has momentum and running into space. Don't be afraid to take the game on. So our attack starts from the contest. Attack it, hunt the ball carrier, shepherd your mates, run and create options when we got the ball. Hunt the ball carrier when we don't. The skills will then be able to be seen from our list. Currently this zone thingy is a disgrace and has never quite functioned right, it has flow on effect where nobody is responsible. Scrap it Goody, your back 6 can keep the shape but have to go when required is their turn, that part just requires a tinker. The rest of the team need to be hunting the ball or creating options, the rest really would look after itself. Sorry for the long winded first post and emphasis on this whole hunt the ball carrier thing we did for parts of 2018. Our skills and personnel are much better now . It's been driving me madder than isolation that this is not where our game plan starts. Add or take layers but we need to start being uncompromising again. Currently we are the opposite. Pressure!! PS. Still get a forwards coach next year.