Engorged Onion

Momentum? Well that's an etheeral construct. Momentum in sport is about a set of behaviours...but [censored] it..let me bore you in game. If a team doesnt have momentum from a commentators/specatators perspective perspective. its because they're doing the wrong thing... systems, personal behaviours, yadda yadda yadda. Momentum is a [censored] construct. .its about choice.. he [censored] up on a few... he'll be right, as the evidence is this year, he is more consistent. Best predictor of future behaviour, is past behaviour.

Mate, i would have waited for that ball to bobble up also...

Mmmm, I was up at Metricon last year, with a couple of mates from here in Vicco, geez what a slog that match was. No turning point last year. But, the team does have ability to pull victories out of defeat. Lovely goal by Marty Hore, set up by some hardness from Hunt. It genuinely feels it wont take much to fix, the conundrum is that it has felt like that for 18 months, so why hasn't it happened early. The amount of I50's means we're not actually getting smashed around the park... which is some light relief.

I love the idea of Brad Green, no idea how is as a communicator or a coach, I'm just going by how he played. Mind you, judging by his posts on twitter, both the AFL and he are done with each other. .... ya need to tow the party line, if you know what I mean?

There is zero irony in that @At the break of Gawn...

Whom @praha?

Loving the sunshine lollypops and rainbows @PaulRB!

I really like your analysis @Pennant St Dee . My question about Goodwin and co, is what does he genuinely see as our strengths, and what system is he trying to play, and how does he see these strengths complimenting the style of play. Coaches are not THAT arrogant to pursue a plan when it's obvious that it doesn't work over a 20 something game period. (besides there are a range of other staff that have input). Are they all drinking the Goodwin kool-aid? Is Goodwin an adversarial kind of leader? Do they all legitimately believe the game style will work with continuity of time together? The stats that were pulled up last night, would have been available into last season for them...so aside from the optics of what we/they see on tv and at the ground, that data would have been front and centre for a long time. So what is it that they all see, that perhaps we can't? And beyond commentary around his stubbornness, why is it persisted with?

How lovely it was to come on to the site after a pretty deflating loss, and find this thread. Lovely in the fact that there is no anger, just acceptance of the inevitable of the cycle of this club. I cannot be bothered to dissect individual players, critique Goodwin and the FD, or even analyse the game plan. It genuinely genuinely genuinely feels like we've gone back 8 years. Not that anyone knows me, or care really, but I'm opting out of the rest of the season, and the reason I am expressing this, is that I dare say I will not be the only one. Are we at our lowest ebb? Probably not, but jeez, as a country member who has only a few links to the Melbourne City itself... I seriously need to ask myself why would I choose to continue to fund an entity that gives very very little joy.

I will be pleased if Dangerfield fails to get the ultimate glory. Mind you, living in Moggs is pretty glorious on the flip side.

It'll still be Goodwins fault though ?

"spicy"

Sure... I can't be bothered arguing it. But walk me through your stats @Fat Tony God, i dont even know Jake, or care for him that much.. I just think he is been unfairly represented. He is Alex Rance's height, 10kg lighter and im pretty sure Alex Rance was not fetted on as a 23year old, and he is on par with Sir Alex I'd be pretty sure in 2013/14 he wasn't the full back...happy to be proven wrong though. I may have just turned in to this bloke...

@Watts the matter For $800+k on the surface I would agree - it feels like he needs to be on the elite players, or he needs to dominate offensively. But perhaps he dominates DEFENSIVELY, it just doesn't look like it, in the way that it used to with man on man. I'm thinking with Scarlett, or even Danny Hughes (yeah, [censored] joke) The stats from the chart before you dismissed are still accurate. The bloke has had knee reco's and he still performs at that level, he is ahead of Rance in some areas. Was Rance an offensive weapon, nope, he drifted (or more precisely accelerated from contest to contest)...we forget that Lever is 6 years younger. 6 [censored] years... that's 100 odd games. I don't know your age, but we used to be in awe of Schwarz of what he could do on the field pre knees and even post knees sometimes and gave due regard to the fact that he had done his knees... it's just the Lever isn't in the sexy part of the ground to be celebrated. He is solid, and he will [censored] up, just like Schwarz dropped marks, Lever will mistime things. Now for $800k, what do I want? I would have paid $800k for Rance and Lever is 6 years younger and on track for that. ps... he points better than anyone I know, aside from Steven May.

Just so I am clear, you asked me a question... I answered it (in the best way that I could) and then you come back with a different statement/argument. You've asked about 'restricting having a big impact on games'. I'd say he and his colleagues have done that pretty well. BUT, now you're stating, it's about his offence. I dont know mate about the backline providing all that much offence.. Maybe that's Hibbered's, Rivers's Jett's, Salem's job, rather than May, OMac, Lever, Smith's job... but Im just guessing. Ps... good job on the bloke for negotiating his pay, so that he and his family are protected, when his knees blow out in Rn 12 and his career is over. His market worth, is what the market is prepared to pay.

Ok @Watts the matter for clarities sake and the fact that we play a zone defence, let's look at the forward line (as named) for all 3 clubs that we have played, as Lever plays in the back line So for Geelong G B Disposals Hawkins 1 3 13 Ratugolea 1 1 5 Dalhaus 14 Other goals all came from midfielders (aside from Parfitt) Any big impacts on the game? Wouldn't have thought so from my optics This is part of a team/zone defence right? You know how that works right? For Carlton it was G B Disposals Betts 1 2 8 McKay 1 10 Cunningham 1 11 *McGovern 1 10 half forward line *Caboult 1 6 half forward line Any big impacts on the game? Wouldn't have thought so from my optics For WCE it was G B Disposals Cripps 12 Kennedy 4 Ryan 3 3 14 *Darling 1 8 half forward line *Redden 9 half forward line Ah Chee 2 1 12 half forward line Now, I'd argue that's pretty good going, aside from Ryan in the WCE game, whom I am sure due to size, speed wouldn't have been a direct match up. His role never has been to dominate individual players but to play as part of a system. The system, as part of the back line is doing fine.

Yeah it's tough one @old dee, and I guess if I was a coach, I'm looking for a few things. Positional roles, and can those vying for a spot - can they supplant the incumbent through what is seen in training? In training, who can execute skills, and roles irrespective of notoriety (and then getting a bank of those in training before pulling the trigger for match selection) *see Bennell, but his is also rehab based. Essentially when the injuries occur, it's the same process, with whatever ceiling you as a coaching department see as an acceptable level. OR at least trade of the positive attributes vs the negative attributes and hope for the best. Interstate? FIIK *If my name was Alex, I would be feeling very unclear as to why I am not in the team. (But we know he can fudge his finishing, despite his workrate)

@Hogan2014, I hear what you are saying, tall forwards (our) tall forwards are ordinary at marking at the moment. Even Bailey Fritsch dropped a few he should have snavelled. Mark of the day should have gone to Kossie, he dropped it too. The tall forward option is not the remedy until they are in form. Snavalling your marks as they present is the remedy..

@Watts the matter From your perspective, what does one have to do to 'shut down a player'? Breakdown the stats that 'said' player can reach, before the threshold is that he has not been shut down. Now, I am genuinely not trying to be a smartarse, I want to know what you look for as an acceptable pass mark. When you give me that, I will seriously go and research it, as I have had a skinful. Also my point is that optics are not metrics. And you my dear poster, do not have all the metrics.(nor do I)

Ahh, well, we've all lived it for 40 years (give or take 20, depending on where you are at). I love the tease this team gives. Just the pure [censored] tease of it all. Nothing more nihilistic than being a Melbourne supporter. As Badly Drawn Boy once sang. "The joy is not the same without the pain".

Kiss. Of. Death.

Thought this was an interesting chart re: Lever. Just wait until he gets 2.3 more spoils/intercepts a match, channel 7 will FAAAAWN over him like Rance.

They probably would @Lord Nev - they know that Goodwin has favourites, what would I know? ? Anyway, context matters.

So when do you give blokes a chance to settle... only when they're 18-21yo's? Context matters Sorry but I cant find a way not to do this with sarcasm... Think about this...no seriously, think about this. What do players learn, if they are dropped after a [censored] match? They learn never to [censored] up of course..never ever [censored] up, just don't do it, don't have a bad game, don't make individual errors, because your career (employment) is on the line. And we all intuitively understand, that that is not the reality of sport. BUT, what do humans do all the [censored] time. They make errors. Now your threshold as a viewer of this great team of ours, is clearly less, due to the context of the the W/L ratio. But not the FD... there must be something that they know, that you don't. What could it be? What you don't do, is punish someone who makes errors, you don't just drop them...because what do they 'actually learn'? They learn, it's never appropriate to make mistakes, ever, never ever. Thus, how do they play? They play safe, so so so [censored] safe, that they never take risks... just look at old mate Billy Stretch. They'll stop, they'll prop, they'll slow the game down, just so they feel safe enough to execute a 16m pass and not [censored] it up. Oh... and go against the team plan...taking the game on etc etc. All clubs are willing to give personnel another chance due to circumstance, need etc (some would call it favourtism, or lack of integrity I suppose)

@La Dee-vina Comedia, perhaps you could attend the next Zoom meeting, or presser and ask these questions