Vogon Poetry

I think the MFC response, and Bugg's, has been absolutely correct and I admire them for it. There is no sensible defence of Bugg's hit. The provocation by football standards is non existent, the response totally inappropriate and disproportionate the the image of Mills being KO'd alarming. He was wrong and he represents us, the MFC. To defend him would be wrong, to use weasle words to mitigate punishment distasteful. This is the era of community education of the unacceptable nature of violence, domestic violence and one punch death. To support Buggs actions in any way or try and mitigate or excuse them would be utterly wrong. Jackson, Roos, Mahoney and Goodwin are building a culture and brand to take this football club to where we all want it to go. Bugg's actions have significantly hurt that brand and the club's response has to be to minimise that damage. They've done that. Be angry all you like at the inconsistency of the tribunal. Really does it matter if Bugg got 4 weeks or 6 weeks? Not to me. The bigger issue is we have, as a Club, made a statement that what he did was totally unacceptable and we will take full responsibility for it and behave accordingly. I think Bugg is gone. Those in outrage are now making him out to be a much better footballer than he is. He's ordinary and nowhere near my best 22 with a full and fit list. He's an employee who has acted contrary to our interest and doesn't offer much in return. I doubt he'll play for us again. Like the AFL and Fahour we have a similar decision with Bugg. And just to clarify, I'm not saying Bugg is anywhere near the ugliness of Fahour, but it's the same genre and it's a very ugly genre.

Your recognition that we may fall in a heap suggests that you find this acceptable as long as we just push through it. I happen to believe that we are a serious chance to do some damage in September if we can make finals with a fit list and that that experience will benefit us significantly more than being dumb and running the list into the ground and falling short. What I'm suggesting is not running up the white flag but just trying to be smart and give us the best chance of success this year and in the future.

Can someone tell me what skill or attribute he needs to improve to make the seniors. We saw in his first year he was super talented. He hasn't lost that talent. He's clean with the ball, he knows how to find it, he is a good decision maker, he's a great leader, he's a good kick and a good mark and he tackles well and understands the game. Why isn't he getting a game?

Our objective is to win enough games to make finals and to have as many fit and able bodies available for selection. I think we need to win 12 games, that's 4 more. We need therefore to give ourselves the best chance to win 4. We have a lot of exhausted and sore bodies on the list at the moment. It's not coincidental that we have had a spate of injuries at a time we've played 4 games in 18 days. On Friday we saw a lot of tired and fatigued players on the field. There are 8 games to go and we have a 9 day break coming up followed by yet another 6 day break and a long trip to Darwin. Adelaide will have an 8 day break. Darwin has proven to be very taxing on bodies, it's hot and humid and we are playing a top team with depleted personnel. Victory is most unlikely and the impact on our players with that schedule makes winning the PA game much harder. Our most probably wins will come against Carlton, PA, NM, Saints, Brisbane and Collingwood. We should manage our players to maximise our chances of winning 4 and hopefully more of those game. That's the philosophy. We are not in a position to know which players need a rest and my list was more by example and observation than anything else but we need to identify which players are carrying injury and use the games against Adelaide and GWS to freshen up sore players and give ourselves the best chance of winning the remaining games and making finals. Sorry if that's the dumbest thing you've ever heard.

What attribute do you think has kept him out of the seniors to date? IMO if he was quick enough he'd have played every game because he has every other skill. I'm interested in your take.

If a serial pest like Hayden Ballantyne had done to Christian Petracca what Bugg did to Mills ask yourself, and be honest, what penalty you'd think was appropriate. I'd want him out of the game for life. Bugg is a serial pest (similar to Ballantyne) and Mills is a young gun (similar to Petracca). That's the way the footy world is looking at this. If Buddy had clocked Tom McDonald in the same way the media would be saying 4 weeks, same as Houli, and probably trying to justify less. My hope is the Tribunal can divorce the incident from the emotion and if they give Bugg more than Houli they will have to go through some pretty nifty logic to get there.

It's impossible for us to pick the ins and outs this week because of so many injured players - Garlett, Hogan, Watts and Tyson all unknown. But my philosophy would be to risk nobody in this game but play best available. The following week against Adelaide I'd rest Oliver, Hunt, ANB, Harmes, Gawn Hibberd and anyone else who is sore. With our outs Adelaide in Darwin is almost unwinnable and taking tired players up there significantly reduces our chances of winning the following week and risks injury to tired bodies. We need to focus on the back end of the season starting with the PA game with an improving list and players who aren't spent. The commercial risk is of course the NT Government is a significant sponsor. This approach would not please them.

Jordan put in another shocker on Friday with 16 disposals and a single tackle. He ripped out 5 contested possessions despite going into the midfield in the second half. Jetts, who plays a much more defensive game managed 8 contested possessions and 8 tackles in his 16 possession game. I note that when TGR started this thread the vast majority supported Jordie but now it seems with the prod of TGR's post many are starting to more strongly analyse his game and understand the limitation of his offering. Many are calling for his return to the midfield but he played there for much of Friday after Viney went down and had no impact. I think the reality is Jordie doesn't like our game style, he is remembering with fondness the open keepings off style Hawthorn played for years and the prospect of the manic running pressure game we play is something he isn't suited to. He doesn't look like he's bought into it for mine. After Friday nights game Pro suggested he is collecting his super and that he has been a bitter disappointment. I agree and have believed this for some time. After snotting Cripps behind play and fracturing his jaw which resulted in a 3 week holiday he was anything but apologetic. There was an arrogance about his dismissal of the criticism. Many admired him for it. Well this week push comes to shove. He's a four time premiership player, he was bought to the Club for his leadership and experience. He was second in Hawks B&F last year, he's demonstrated good footy this year in patches, he's got a three year contract guaranteeing him in excess of $1 million I'd imagine and now is his time. Rather than wave his arms round telling others what to do I want to see him lead by example. Tackles, chases, smothers, controlled aggression, clearances, contested possessions and a genuine impact on the game. His time is now to show he is genuinely invested in this club and not just talking to his financial advisor asking where to put the money whilst picking up easy kicks and telling others what to do.

I've never had much time for the AFLPA and the last few weeks I've less time for them. Our club was required by the draw to play 4 games in 18 days. Over that period we've lost Jones, Watts, Salem, Garlett, Viney and Tyson to not insignificant injury. We don't know what toll this scheduling has had on other players who may well be carrying injury that is affecting their performance and and jeopardizing their seasons. There is no way of knowing the direct causal link between our injury situation and the work load of the players but what is irrefutable is tired and battered bodies get injured much more easily when under extreme stress. The AFL know this yet devised a draw that accentuated this danger. I hope Caro rips into the AFL for this because the sycophant at the HS won't. Where was the AFLPA in demanding that player safety be observed? A six day break should not be followed by another 6 day break. Two six day breaks should not be followed by another 6 day break but it should be mandatory to be followed by an 8 day break. This is exactly the sort of condition the AFLPA should be insisting on but they are too busy getting money in the pockets of the players. I don't mind that but it should not be at the expense of player safety. I don't want us to whinge publicly but I do want us to be making our point very strongly to the AFL and the AFLPA.

Bucks just sent Bugg a thank you letter.

My initial reaction to Bugg's punch was shock and thought he should be suspended for life. We don't want that on our footy fields. But Bub and JnrMac amonst others have offered strong defences and they are probably right to a degree. In reality Bugg will get what he gets - the admittedly inconsistent MRP will make a ruling and that will be that. You can go round in circles arguing if the hit was less or more serious than Houli and it's hard to divorce emotion from any judgement. It's also hard to divorce your like or dislike of Bugg from any evaluation of the incident. I don't like Bugg. Never warmed to him from the time he showboated against Richmond and his faux tough guy enforcer approach to the game doesn't work for me. He's certainly no wimp but he's not tough like Viney, Jones or Oliver. But my dislike shouldn't impact on a penalty for his punch on Mills. Nor should Mills so called provocation be factored in. Those arguing that defence are arguing a girl who wore the short skirt deserved to be the victim of unwanted physical attention. Bugg's punch was certainly no lesser crime than Houli and many are arguing it was worse. I think they are grasping at straws to justify a penalty they want to give him and not one he deserves for the hit. If Houli got 4 I think Bugg should get 4. I suspect he'll get more. Amongst other things his timing was terrible. That's the "justice" system penalty if you like, now for MFC response. We shouldn't impose a greater penalty in weeks served. We should publicly support him. But in the end MFC have a "brand" or "image" we want to be seen for and I'd imagine this is so far removed from that brand it's almost a deal breaker in terms of ongoing employment. In any employment arrangement the employer gives up money and opportunity in return for performance and representation. Bugg has trashed that representation and damaged the brand. To argue otherwise is silly, he has hurt the Club that gives him an AFL career. If he is to remain he must perform at a level that justifies that tarnished brand but he doesn't. In essence he is a limited footballer able to play mediocre AFL footy on a relatively inconsistent basis. He plays as much poor footy as he does good footy and has to do everything right to stay on a list. Clearly he hasn't. If I was the MFC I'd leave him at Casey when he returns and I'd not offer him another contract because in the end he is more harm to us than good. He was a marginal "keep" anyway at seasons end for me. His one punch effort on Friday KO'd MIlls but also his future at Melbourne and I'd imagine anywhere. It's a harsh penalty to pay I know but I don't want the Club I support to be represented by a person like Bugg. This was a mistake but it was a terrible one for both him and us.

Have you seen him play?

Is he in your best 22? Is he in your best 26? I like him but he needs to show a lot more to establish a permanent spot in the 22. He's good depth at the moment. Oh, and Saty, this is my opinion, no need to tell everyone it is.

1. I was right, they were naughty boys. And you were wrong on two counts - they were naughty and they didn't play in the development league. 2. Of course my post is my opinion, who's do you think it would be? 3. Where have I said others can't disagree?

Any comment on Viney, Tyson and Tommy Mac?

He wouldn't have played if Kent, JKH and Kennedy hadn't been naughty boys, as you rightly pointed out elsewhere there is a gulf between VFL and AFL and Mitch strikes me as being good at one level but hasn't got the tools for the next. And I don't agree with you on the bump. The thread serves as a narrative on his journey at MFC, the good, the bad and the ugly. It's lost (the narrative) if there are many threads on one player. I like that you can look back over a players history in one thread as it tells his story. I think we should encourage it.

It doesn't surprise me you disagree. You either didn't read and understand the argument or you're being deliberately argumentative. Danger wanted for nothing at Adelaide, Frawley left for success. I really admire Jones (and others) for sticking fat.

Danger leaving may well cost Adelaide a flag. Frawley left for success - who could blame him. I don't like Danger for the reasons I stated. I rate loyalty. I'd be [censored] if Hogan left us. I suppose you'd admire him.

Danger is a great player and an articulate person. But he doesn't have a lot of cred with me. Adelaide picked him up at pick 10, left him in school for a year for no benefit, put a lot of IP and footy smarts into him, developed him beautifully and then, I believe in the year Walsh was murdered, walked out on the club when they desperately needed him. Homesick? Give me a break. Geelong is 90 minutes away, he gets multiple weeks holiday a year to be with family, he would have been as financially successful at Adelaide and perhaps equally or more successful in his playing career if he'd stayed. There are literally tens of thousands of people in many walks of life that move from home to pursue a career and make sacrifices to achieve success. But Danger was too precious. Ran out on a club that had invested big time and done absolutely everything right by him. But he was a little homesick so walked out on those that played a big part in making him what he is. He like Judd is smart. The media won't take him on. Love watching him, respect him as a footballer but not a person.

Do we know which leg it is? I've noticed this year that Jones was kicking on his left leg much more than in past years and I suspected he was carrying something on his right. Seems to me that he may have been carrying this for some time before the Doggies game.

Am I BB or are you referring to Bub? My argument was never that Lewis wasn't best 22, my argument was that DL gave him far too much credit for our success. I'm no Kane Cornes fan but he was dead right with his criticism. Lewis gave away a dumb 50m that cost us a goal and was then petulant when he walked over the mark. Minutes later he just shoved Petrie in the back. That is not leadership and it's not great on field coaching. Nut thinks he's a good on field coach and leader. I don't and Saturdays antics are more evidence. You don't see Jones or Viney doing the sort of stupid things Lewis does. When Lewis was voted into the leadership group he hadn't played a game for us and came with a great reputation. I'll be interested to see if he's in the leadership group next year now that the players have had a chance to see what he brings week in week out. I read the posts since Saturday with interest. I thought Saturday was one of Lewis's better games for us but it seems people are now picking up on his weaknesses. He looks like a player who has been there and done that so often that despite our excitement he is uninvolved. What did he say to Burgan after St.Kilda? "It's just a win Matt". He and we are coming from such completely places he just doesn't get it.

Hmmm, pick 18 for Gus in a heartbeat. Really? Gus is a pick 3 talent who is in his third year and has suffered concussion issues. Unless his concussion issues dramatically reduce his value (and lets for the moment assume they don't) he is just as valuable now if not more so than when we drafted him. Firstly he has demonstrated he can play good AFL football (we know all too well that early picks, even the first 3, can fail). His first year was very impressive. Secondly he has now got (3) preseasons under his belt, his body has matured and he's a lot closer to producing quality football than a first round draft pick. We've added significant IP and body development to him - why would we sell him for less than we paid? Roos and Hawthorn have shown that first rounders - particularly later ones - are very overrated. If Brayshaw is traded it won't be for a draft pick it will be for a player we want and who is more value to us than Brayshaw. And Brayshaw's good so we are talking a quality footballer. If his concussion issues are a significant deterrent to others the selling price won't compensate us and he'll stay. I like him but if he was part of a trade that got us closer to a flag I'd deal. It has to be someone of Whitfield or Kelly's ilk, anything less is just nonsense.

Not everyone is as old and wise as you Nut! Some general discussion on this subject is unfortunately necessary.

My first line was in response to you and the rest a general comment. Sorry if it came across as a crack at you, it wasn't.

Your mate probably read the information on Demonland! I like rumours, they're good fun, but there are some here I'd imagine who find it difficult to judge the likelihood of rumours being right or even possible. There was a dope last year who said Rockliff was coming to MFC, had it from both the BFC and a past player. Done deal. Reading the post it was very obvious that it was rot but many believed it and when Rockliff didn't come those hopes were dashed and people bitterly disappointed. Rumours can be fun when they are rumours - "the bloke at the fish and chip shop told me". But when they are couched in "someone at the top" or "straight from the horses mouth" they move, if correct, from rumour to fact. Why GNF gets his jollies sucking passionate supporters into to believing something they really want I don't know, it says much about the person I suppose. But I think it's important to point out his charade so those people don't get disappointed. Unfortunately because we always want to believe in something we really want - Hogan will play or Roos will coach - I suspect many will dismiss the critics and still believe in him/her.