http://www.heraldsun.news.com.au/footy/com...5E19742,00.html

Quite frankly I was going to subtitle this as "When will we ever learn?? "

Here's a great opportunity to reap some divident from his contract...by trading him..hell he would go !!...and we still do the same ol ' dumb things !!

Got nothing peronal against Ooze...wish him well. Wish by christ he'd play decent footy!! His best days are way behind him.. He is now injury prone...and we're gunna keep him !! FFS how dumb can this club get at times.

CAC youve lost me on this.. If this is your idea of sound reasoning and planning going forward then Ive had you wrong all along...sorry mate, this just isnt clever at all !!

Its OK for us to honour his contract but we dont care if he honours his end of the bargain ??? what a joke !!

http://www.heraldsun.news.com.au/footy/com...5E19742,00.html

Quite frankly I was going to subtitle this as "When will we ever learn?? "

Here's a great opportunity to reap some divident from his contract...by trading him..hell he would go !!...and we still do the same ol ' dumb things !!

Got nothing peronal against Ooze...wish him well. Wish by christ he'd play decent footy!! His best days are way behind him.. He is now injury prone...and we're gunna keep him !! FFS how dumb can this club get at times.

CAC youve lost me on this.. If this is your idea of sound reasoning and planning going forward then Ive had you wrong all along...sorry mate, this just isnt clever at all !!

Its OK for us to honour his contract but we dont care if he honours his end of the bargain ??? what a joke !!

i reckon about 80% of all melbourne supporters will disagree with ur lack of respect.... been far better player than most....

the type of football club u seek barley exists....

22 players under the age of 26 ....

oh sorry if I seem a little niggled..

Respect.. lol.. Apparently your unable to critique people is that what you summise ??

We must all tippy toe around.. Well I for one will call a spade a spade. Adem Ooze has been one of the greatest trangressors in NOT living up to his ability. His is not a great team player. he is often lazy and goes for the "heroe " shots when a hand off /pass forward set up would be far more effective !! Some of his efforts are mecurial... many are downright wasteful. He seemed ( and I am far from alone here ) far more concerned wqith the club record at any costs raahter than getting fully fit and honouring his end of the bargain.

He held the club to semi ransom some years back and has hardly been value for dollar since.

If thats disrepectful than quite frankly I couldn't give a rats. He's a professional..He gets paid. He can take the cirique as well as far as Im concerned.

far better player than most?? lol.. thats not altogether a big rap when discussing a team thats effectively failed, with some notable exceptions, for 43 years now is it.

Respect is something earned, not dished out with his oversized pay packet !!

oh sorry if I seem a little niggled..

Respect.. lol.. Apparently your unable to critique people is that what you summise ??

We must all tippy toe around.. Well I for one will call a spade a spade. Adem Ooze has been one of the greatest trangressors in NOT living up to his ability. His is not a great team player. he is often lazy and goes for the "heroe " shots when a hand off /pass forward set up would be far more effective !! Some of his efforts are mecurial... many are downright wasteful. He seemed ( and I am far from alone here ) far more concerned wqith the club record at any costs raahter than getting fully fit and honouring his end of the bargain.

He held the club to semi ransom some years back and has hardly been value for dollar since.

If thats disrepectful than quite frankly I couldn't give a rats. He's a professional..He gets paid. He can take the cirique as well as far as Im concerned.

far better player than most?? lol.. thats not altogether a big rap when discussing a team thats effectively failed, with some notable exceptions, for 43 years now is it.

Respect is something earned, not dished out with his oversized pay packet !!

u speak as if u know the bloke....

u are alone as far as im concerned...... minority

fail or not i will continue to support players of his status.....

the only thing that is oversized is ur head..... and the rubbish u build up in side.

this year its yze..... in 2-3 it will be bruce and tj

then 5-6 green

but i guess im only agreein with somone that works at the club so wat would i know

what would we get if we traded him? a third round pick? might be worth looking at.

'belzebub59' post='96720' date='Aug 20 2007, 01:10 AM'

CAC youve lost me on this.. If this is your idea of sound reasoning and planning going forward then Ive had you wrong all along...sorry mate, this just isnt clever at all !!

Its OK for us to honour his contract but we dont care if he honours his end of the bargain ??? what a joke !!

Look to be blunt - Yze isn't worth anything to trade for. He won't retire gracefully with a year to run on his contract like Nico. CAC is just stating the obvious... the club has a contract it is bound to honour... I think what was said in the article, the way it was said and the gaps in between indicated that the Yze would leave us for greener pastures if the opportunity presents itself, the club would let him, but that there is basically no interest from anyone else so he will stay.

Here's a great opportunity to reap some divident from his contract...by trading him..hell he would go !!...and we still do the same ol ' dumb things !!

Cameron didn't say we would not trade Yze, but simply that we'd not be dumping him as he has a contract.

IF a decent trade came up, I'm sure we'd take it. However...

Wish by christ he'd play decent footy!! His best days are way behind him.. He is now injury prone...

...it doesn't sound like he's going to be on too many Clubs' wish lists.

u speak as if u know the bloke....

u are alone as far as im concerned...... minority

fail or not i will continue to support players of his status.....

the only thing that is oversized is ur head..... and the rubbish u build up in side.

this year its yze..... in 2-3 it will be bruce and tj

then 5-6 green

but i guess im only agreein with somone that works at the club so wat would i know

how can you say this? i can't remember the last time yze contributed to any sort of on-field success, i'm not even sure if he's still playing for us? if he's still got a couple of years left in him, we should be offering him very little to try and motivate him, e.g. 1 year performance based contract, or indeed try and pick up someone with a spine, some courage and desire to run out there and win!

Look to be blunt - Yze isn't worth anything to trade for. He won't retire gracefully with a year to run on his contract like Nico. CAC is just stating the obvious... the club has a contract it is bound to honour... I think what was said in the article, the way it was said and the gaps in between indicated that the Yze would leave us for greener pastures if the opportunity presents itself, the club would let him, but that there is basically no interest from anyone else so he will stay.

Correct Graz.

Yze is not worth a cracker to another club. Unless he retires (I doubt it) he will finish 2008 on the MFC list.

He's certainly not worth the trade we might have got for him last time, but he will get something..if even a top up style late 2nd round or thrird round pick. This in turn might be tradable in the great scheme of thimgs etc etcv. His value may not be directly what we get for him but what he may help facilitate.

That and the freeing up of a spot..and the saving of how ever many hundred G he is costing us ! That would be the smart move going forward.. get whatever you can and use it wisely as inverstment in a player who WILL give us more than the likely handful lof efforts we may see out of 13 in 08.

Why did CAC have to say any of that at all..Ooze is contracted to Melb.. if he wanted to to be allowed to be traded all CAC had to say was..whatever !! By saying he is a needed player it infers to me he isnt on teh choipping block.

We havent learnt to be brutal at Melbourne.,other clubs have.. we havent.

Why did CAC have to say any of that at all..Ooze is contracted to Melb.. if he wanted to to be allowed to be traded all CAC had to say was..whatever !! By saying he is a needed player it infers to me he isnt on teh choipping block.

Wasn't the context of the comment Yze fearing he'd be delisted?

I think you're on the wrong track here.

He's certainly not worth the trade we might have got for him last time, but he will get something..if even a top up style late 2nd round or thrird round pick. This in turn might be tradable in the great scheme of thimgs etc etcv. His value may not be directly what we get for him but what he may help facilitate.

If we got offered that for him, I would take it in an instant! Unfortunatety he aint worth it

That and the freeing up of a spot..and the saving of how ever many hundred G he is costing us !

If he is on large dollars (He was 2003 to 2005, I dont think he is now), do you think a club will gladly pay the full sum of that when Yze's value has deteriorated further since 2005.

Wasn't the context of the comment Yze fearing he'd be delisted?

I think you're on the wrong track here.

Spot on.

CAC i believe is a little silly for not honouring last years superdraft. We were soft in trading for picks last year and now that we have finally decided to get soume youth we wait for a bad draft to arrive. We will be lucky to find a decent play beyond pick 10 in my opinion. Just look at the 02 draft. The only decent players out of that draft were Wells, Goddard, Brennan, Salopek, McIntosh, Rivers, Simpson, Crowley, Malceski and Brad Fisher.

compare that to the 2001 superdraft and the good players that came out of that included; Hodge, Ball, Judd, bartel, Dal Santo, Maguire, Steve Johnson, Campbell Brown, S.Mitchell, Montagna, Ash Hansen, Ablett Junior, Waite, Dane Swan, Schneider.

In conclusion, if you are going to make the decision to top up with youngsters...DON'T pick a dud of a draft!

CAC i believe is a little silly for not honouring last years superdraft. We were soft in trading for picks last year and now that we have finally decided to get soume youth we wait for a bad draft to arrive. We will be lucky to find a decent play beyond pick 10 in my opinion. Just look at the 02 draft. The only decent players out of that draft were Wells, Goddard, Brennan, Salopek, McIntosh, Rivers, Simpson, Crowley, Malceski and Brad Fisher.

compare that to the 2001 superdraft and the good players that came out of that included; Hodge, Ball, Judd, bartel, Dal Santo, Maguire, Steve Johnson, Campbell Brown, S.Mitchell, Montagna, Ash Hansen, Ablett Junior, Waite, Dane Swan, Schneider.

In conclusion, if you are going to make the decision to top up with youngsters...DON'T pick a dud of a draft!

Firstly, last years superdraft has yet to establish itself beyond the hype!

Secondly, how do you know other clubs were gladly trading picks in the superdraft for established and more often NQ players?

Thirdly, the decision may be to clean out players but not necessarily select any more young players than we would have other wise.

Finally, how do you know how this draft will turn out?

Finally, how do you know how this draft will turn out?

From watching over the under 18's you can see it hasn't got the same talent pool it had last year.

However it does not mean there wont be some diamonds in the seemingly rough.

I'll add my two cents to the discussion.

- Yze has been a wonderful player for Melbourne during his career

- Recently his form has slipped, perhaps to due age, perhaps other reasons.

- If his contract ended this year it would be likely that he'd retire.

- He has little or no trade value

On the draft those in the know claim it's not very deep. Very good rucks (quite deep with rucks) and KPP's, with a handful of excellent midfielders. If we end up with 3 picks in the top 25 we should have 3 quality kids.

I'll add my two cents to the discussion.

- Yze has been a wonderful player for Melbourne during his career

- Recently his form has slipped, perhaps to due age, perhaps other reasons.

- If his contract ended this year it would be likely that he'd retire.

- He has little or no trade value

I certainly agree with the first and fourth points there Jarka. With point 2, his form did slip, he was dropped but came back and was very good except probably against Sydney and Richmond (the latter of which he was injured).

The facts are that he is contracted for another year and adds polish to a side desperately lacking in it. He won't be traded and he won't be delisted. It is pretty easy to find 8-10 players on the MFC list who would go before Yze.

The issue and the vendetta gainst Yze is ridiculuos and stems from percipient comments made by Spunjy, who I might addis a very good judge, that were latched onto by imbelices. Yze has weaknesses in his game that have become glaring as he has aged and been ravaged by injury and it is a fair point to criticise him on this, but to then say he hasnt been outstanding in other areas is to blight what has been a very good and effective career. Other clubs have had similar players and these have been lauded for what they did - Mercuri, Rohan Smith are examples - so I just say cope with the fact he is still here, because I can tell you from the horses mouth, that if he is fit he will be firing next year!!!

What so many seem incapable of is extracting themselves from sentimentality and viewing things in the here and now.

Given the limited scope of any real input by Adem in the coming year ( and in all likely hood his last at Melbourne whichever way you look at it ) why would you go all out to keep him. Forget all the mumbo jumbo ..oh he "WAS" this or that!! What is he now. What does he bring to the game, what value can be placed on his services, what level do you regard them as etc.

Then in this cold hard light make an informed apprasial of 1) where Melbourne is going and 2 ) what is his role in it.

He is at the end of a career. he is half the player he was. You can argue til the cows come home but his performances are there to be scrutinised. In the first half of his career he was great.. in teh middle he started to meander. In latter games he waxed an ained with occasional glimpses of "that " talent. Lately he's a shadow of teh initial persona. Injury and possible indifference have taken its toll. In any team going forward he wont be in our first 22. He is of limited value at present to the club. He is paid by the club. Its a job. A job he cant do at the elite level in a sustained manor any more..

This isnt any personal vendetta etc.. its juts reality. Too often the club is seen as some sort of nefarious football goodtimes extravanganza. Its not..its a business. Its mission is to win games. It does this by employing the best it can to carry out the various tasks. When you cant you move on. Its as simple as that.

People then attach "conditions" to all this..."oh but he was this.. or "but he's given so much etc"...Given ?? no he's paid....They are all PAID !! ( 'cept thearious volunteers etc , but we're talking players , professionals etc )

You have to be a tad brutal in business. No one in sport comes into with any llusions that its a "love-in".. Its competition. The best survive.( well ought to ) to play and compete. Thats all. It really gets no more complex than that.

When the ol' grey mare cant run no more.. its not given another race for ol' time sake. Its retired. The new colts etc take over.

So to my original displeasure with the article and its reproted comments to Yze. Al that ought have been said to Adem in response to his possible asking of any looming delisting is.. ' Youre contracted for 2008 " that's it.. no qualifiers.. no allusions as to reasons, or posible inferred expectations of the club, simply ..you still have a job for now.

Without a payout he wasnt going to be delisted. He had expreseed at various times over his career his preparedness to change clubs. So the club must have known he was still up for a move should push come to shove.

It just seems like this club has no idea about bargaining etc. you dont play trumps that early.

What so many seem incapable of is extracting themselves from sentimentality and viewing things in the here and now.

Given the limited scope of any real input by Adem in the coming year ( and in all likely hood his last at Melbourne whichever way you look at it ) why would you go all out to keep him. Forget all the mumbo jumbo ..oh he "WAS" this or that!! What is he now. What does he bring to the game, what value can be placed on his services, what level do you regard them as etc.

Then in this cold hard light make an informed apprasial of 1) where Melbourne is going and 2 ) what is his role in it.

He is at the end of a career. he is half the player he was. You can argue til the cows come home but his performances are there to be scrutinised. In the first half of his career he was great.. in teh middle he started to meander. In latter games he waxed an ained with occasional glimpses of "that " talent. Lately he's a shadow of teh initial persona. Injury and possible indifference have taken its toll. In any team going forward he wont be in our first 22. He is of limited value at present to the club. He is paid by the club. Its a job. A job he cant do at the elite level in a sustained manor any more..

This isnt any personal vendetta etc.. its juts reality. Too often the club is seen as some sort of nefarious football goodtimes extravanganza. Its not..its a business. Its mission is to win games. It does this by employing the best it can to carry out the various tasks. When you cant you move on. Its as simple as that.

People then attach "conditions" to all this..."oh but he was this.. or "but he's given so much etc"...Given ?? no he's paid....They are all PAID !! ( 'cept thearious volunteers etc , but we're talking players , professionals etc )

You have to be a tad brutal in business. No one in sport comes into with any llusions that its a "love-in".. Its competition. The best survive.( well ought to ) to play and compete. Thats all. It really gets no more complex than that.

When the ol' grey mare cant run no more.. its not given another race for ol' time sake. Its retired. The new colts etc take over.

So to my original displeasure with the article and its reproted comments to Yze. Al that ought have been said to Adem in response to his possible asking of any looming delisting is.. ' Youre contracted for 2008 " that's it.. no qualifiers.. no allusions as to reasons, or posible inferred expectations of the club, simply ..you still have a job for now.

Without a payout he wasnt going to be delisted. He had expreseed at various times over his career his preparedness to change clubs. So the club must have known he was still up for a move should push come to shove.

It just seems like this club has no idea about bargaining etc. you dont play trumps that early.

It is a vendetta, use Jaded for example, who consistently besmirches the man at every opportunity, yet will be bestow effusive praise on the execrable Chris Johnson, who is pittifully soft. Yze has played injured for the last three years and has a forward goal sneak been as useful as any in that role. And how people bring up that he negotiated for a better contract is beyond me - a heap of MFC players have done it, Tingay, Schwarz etc, its a point of football to get the best deal and he earnt it. I;m happy to say Yze has been under par, but he has been a lot better than most and has deserved some time to get right. Moreover he is still easily in our best 22.

http://www.heraldsun.news.com.au/footy/com...5E19742,00.html

Quite frankly I was going to subtitle this as "When will we ever learn?? "

Here's a great opportunity to reap some divident from his contract...by trading him..hell he would go !!...and we still do the same ol ' dumb things !!

Got nothing peronal against Ooze...wish him well. Wish by christ he'd play decent footy!! His best days are way behind him.. He is now injury prone...and we're gunna keep him !! FFS how dumb can this club get at times.

CAC youve lost me on this.. If this is your idea of sound reasoning and planning going forward then Ive had you wrong all along...sorry mate, this just isnt clever at all !!

Its OK for us to honour his contract but we dont care if he honours his end of the bargain ??? what a joke !!

INJURY PRONE? hes had 1 injury in ten years mate. Im for keeping yze. all we need is a good coach who knows where his best spot is. In the forward pocket.

A strong pre-season = $50,000

Injury free 15-19 games = $200,000

A fit and firing Adem Yze playing within 60 metres of goal = PRICELESS

The bloke has given blood, sweat and tears for this club!

Show some respect!

It just seems like this club has no idea about bargaining etc. you dont play trumps that early.

Eh? What exactly are you upset about?

"He's contracted and I don't see any reason why he wouldn't be around," Cameron said.

"It's as simple as that. We honour our contracts. He has been injured and hasn't been able to show his wares properly. So, hopefully, he can have a full pre-season and get back somewhere near his best."

Do you want Yze delisted, with his contract paid out? I take it you don't.

Thus, I fail to see why you're making a mountain out of this particular molehill. We certainly didn't say that Yze would definitely not be traded or whatever.

if you were to consider trades for him...you wouldnt start telling him he's a monty to remain in red and blue...You say nothing more than you need to