On 09/09/2023 at 02:11, sue said:

It's partly wearing thin because every time we find a forward they get injured.  Frisch out for many games, Petty out just as he shows he's a forward after coming back from injury, Melksham just as he shows he still a forward to be reckoned with.  And to top it off our two old blokes, Brown and Tmac, who maybe just had a bit more in them ended up injured for most of the year.    And now JVR out.  How much of this is Goodwin's fault?   You need a lot of things to win a premiership. Luck is one of them.

It's just dumb luck.

However the constant slow starts and errant goal kicking has never been arrested. 

So many teams come out of the blocks this year while we just watch them and take half a game to apply ourselves. 

 

  On 09/09/2023 at 21:55, Demon Dynasty said:

HAS THE 2020 RED MIST REARED ITS UGLY HEAD AGAIN!?

Gazza spoke about this issue three years ago when we were having trouble finishing our work off coming inside 50 and / or missing opportunities to connect in general as we transistion the ball out of D50...

https://www.foxsports.com.au/afl/afl-2020-melbourne-problems-analysis-demons-on-the-couch-garry-lyon-red-mist-bad-kicking-playing-too-fast/news-story/8350ba20fe8a6cdc618b51cae33c412f

For the last two seasons i've watched a number of our players completely ignore an open/ better option as they come out of D50 or approach our 50.

It's the usual culprits and the ones i've noticed who are regular offenders (i'm sure they're not alone) are...

Tracc, Clarry, Lingers, Chandler & Rivers.

To a lessor extent Viney, Hunter & Gus. They sometimes lower their vision and spot an option, then attempt to kick on 45s occasionaly but it's just that they aren't necessarily very good at it and often miss the target that will sometimes result in a slingshot turnover.

Sometimes Viney, Hunter & Tracc will hit targets so not all their efforts are a dead loss.  I'm sure Gus & Clarry also connect on odd occasions but i doubt their numbers would be all that great comparatively speaking.

Tracc & Clarry our two biggest serial offenders.  Not enough poise and too often just play on immediately without assessing / scanning the field ahead, even from a mark or free kick, and just kick / bomb blindly up the field or deep inside 50.

I can't recall which game it was, earlier this seaaon or late in 2022 but we basically lost the game through our own ineptitude with players being very open (even through the corridor) as we transistioned out of D50 being completely ignored both by hand and foot.  The two major offendors in that match were Chandler & Rivers.

When i say open i'm talking overlap open either laterally or forward of the carrier being completely missed / ignored.  Instead we'll just kick straight down the line to a 1 v 1 or worse.... a 1 v 2 or 3!  Killing off the chance of quick  overlap run through the corridor and a lethal entry inside 50.

Same with open targets up the field or off the line on 45s who are obvious better options if we look for them (scaning the field instead of just looking straight ahead) and (at least) kick it to their advantage.

Instead we are ignoring them (or don't look for them!) and just blindly kick down the line to a 1 v 1 or worse... an outnumbered contest.

Since 2021 we seem to have regressed in general play and are now playing more like we did in 2020.

Unfortunately the Red Mist appears to be back.

I'm not saying every player should be perfect either.  Much more difficult on the field looking at options from the grass vs sitting in the stands from a height or when watching the box.  All players miss better opportunities from time to time.  Always room for improvement though and for some players alot of improvement needed!

This article also infers the same looking at the QF inside 50 debacle (courtesy of Superunknown)...

https://www.theroar.com.au/2023/09/07/finals-fix-magic-magpies-expose-dees-massive-flaw-but-heres-why-they-should-have-to-win-it-all-without-maynard/

I think it was the GWS game. Simple kicks to open targets being totally ignored and just blazing away. If there's two games where we beat ourself it's the GWS game and this one. 

I know we are not playing as well as we'd like and starting games too slowly (though that is hardly a manifistation of complacency as some have written). But heck, we almost beat the flag "favourites" despite that and a forward line consisting of last men standing, and the loss of one of our most important players for most of the match.  We must be doing something right in all the things we are doing wrong.     We are up against it, but some hope remains.

  On 09/09/2023 at 23:24, layzie said:

I think it was the GWS game. Simple kicks to open targets being totally ignored and just blazing away. If there's two games where we beat ourself it's the GWS game and this one. 

Possibly LZ but that's not the game i recall as i never got to see it.  Only listened on radio.

Sounded like a very similar output to the QF though.  Apparently we didn't take enough learnings from that match.  Either that or we just revert back to poor decision making / execution under pressure.  To be expected to some degree in a final but unfortunately we seem to go right off our game once the pressure is up.

The match i recall was at the G earlier this season.

I did raise it at the time and gave clear examples and the times in the quarters that the red mist was happening with certain players.

I still recall Rivers running out of our 50, through the middle to the right of the square heading to the Punt Rd end.  He had someone running alongside through the middle on his left.  A quick glance, shoot off the handball and that player was clear to run the ball deep inside 50 or maybe hit up a leading target.

Instead Rivers blindly bombed it to a contest outside of the arc and i can't recall what happened thereafter but i do remember it was a no gain result for us.

Spargo and Chandler were the two other offenders in the same quarter off HB.

A free option was on offer upfield but Spargo chose to go short with a 20 meter (ish] kick trying to thread the needle between about 2 oppo players.  Turnover.

Chandler the same coming off HB but instead of shooting it to a CHF option at the top of the square he kicked it to a 2 v 1 nearer the boundary (southern side Punt Rd end).  Another turnover which came straight back again.

  On 10/09/2023 at 01:11, Demon Dynasty said:

Possibly LZ but that's not the game i recall as i never got to see it.  Only listened on radio.

Sounded like a very similar output to the QF though.  Apparently we didn't take enough learnings from that match.  Either that or we just revert back to poor decision making / execution under pressure.  To be expected to some degree in a final but unfortunately we seem to go right off our game once the pressure is up.

The match i recall was at the G earlier this season.

I did raise it at the time and gave clear examples and the times in the quarters that the red mist was happening with certain players.

I still recall Rivers running out of our 50, through the middle to the right of the square heading to the Punt Rd end.  He had someone running alongside through the middle on his left.  A quick glance, shoot off the handball and that player was clear to run the ball deep inside 50 or maybe hit up a leading target.

Instead Rivers blindly bombed it to a contest outside of the arc and i can't recall what happened thereafter but i do remember it was a no gain result for us.

Spargo and Chandler were the two other offenders in the same quarter off HB.

A free option was on offer upfield but Spargo chose to go short with a 20 meter (ish] kick trying to thread the needle between about 2 oppo players.  Turnover.

Chandler the same coming off HB but instead of shooting it to a CHF option at the top of the square he kicked it to a 2 v 1 nearer the boundary (southern side Punt Rd end).  Another turnover which came straight back again.

Yeah fair. The Giants game was the last time Gaz brought all this up and pointed out times where cool heads were needed to take the best option. Not a great time to revert to this.

  On 09/09/2023 at 12:31, Demon Disciple said:

Absolutely we did. Took us 45 minutes to get going. Unacceptable in a QF.

yes we arent hunting like 2021. We have to smash into Carlton at 100 miles an hour on Friday night. nothing to lose type attitude and put them on the back foot for a change. Carlton smashed us early last time. time to enact revenge. 

  On 09/09/2023 at 22:02, ElDiablo14 said:

And this could indicate it's a coaching issue.

Unless we think our players are rogue and don't listen to their coaches and do whatever they want on the field.

I doubt it Diab.  Appears to be a lack of composure under pressure or when on the big stage.

That happens of course.  All players / teams are impacted by pressure.

My worry is we just don't have even one or two that seem capable of bucking the trend and deliverimg under this environment in terms of composure and finesse / finish.

At times in 2021 this was Salem and Gus but it appears Salem has regressed here.

Gus also no longer playing the defensive wing role he was back then with occasional forays forward.

That's why i've been keen to see Bowey get a trial run as a HHF but unfortunately that would take a pre-season of training in that role and isn't happening this year.  Probably won't happen going forward either.

Edited September 10, 20231 yr by Demon Dynasty

  On 10/09/2023 at 03:01, Demon Dynasty said:

I doubt it Diab.  Appears to be a lack of composure under pressure or when on the big stage.

That happens of course.  All players / teams are impacted by pressure.

My worry is we just don't have even one or two that seem capable of bucking the trend and deliverimg under this environment in terms of composure and finesse / finish.

At times in 2021 this was Salem and Gus but it appears Salem has regressed here.

Gus also no longer playing the defensive wing role he was back then with occasional forays forward.

That's why i've been keen to see Bowey get a trial run as a HHF but unfortunately that would take a pre-season of training in that role and isn't happening this year.  Probably won't happen going forward either.

McVee and Bowey could go forward?

In theory both ANB and Chandler should also offer some link up.

  On 09/09/2023 at 10:52, The heart beats true said:

I thought your response wasn’t very kind.

I know you and I don’t always see eye to eye, but you add heaps to this community, particularly with your knowledge of junior footballers. I like it when different people engage on here, and making fun of someone trying to start a new conversation seemed counterproductive. 👍

I wish I was as patient and magnanimous as you, THBT. I’m way too hotheaded. Your tempered response is to be admired and despite the fact that you’ve not played 10,000 games of footy I still love you and I’ll humour you regardless  🥰😂🙃

  On 10/09/2023 at 03:35, WalkingCivilWar said:

I wish I was as patient and magnanimous as you

I sat with some really nice, passionate Melbourne supporters on Thursday night and it gave me good perspective on what football offers us beyond wins and losses. The young Demons fans in front of me wanted it so bad I really felt for them.

I walked from the G to Southern Cross after the game because I was so disappointed, but when walking I was thinking about all the stuff I’m grateful for because of the MFC. Demonland is definitely one of them.

This year I realised that football always hurts. It hurt when we were terrible, it hurt when we couldn’t get it together, and now it hurts because we are so close. It’s easy to forget on here when emotions run hot, but we all love and want the same thing.

  On 10/09/2023 at 03:35, WalkingCivilWar said:

I wish I was as patient and magnanimous as you, THBT.

And, when you called me magnanimous by instant reaction was ‘I’m big boned, and have a glandular problem!’, but then I googled it. 🤣

  On 09/09/2023 at 12:37, binman said:

I'm going to back them now. I'll get a top price.

Put a grand on for me, you can take it out of the winnings