Tom McDonald - How long do we wait?

[Wiseblood 24,637]

14 hours ago, Pennant St Dee said:

Let's not rewrite history to suit the narrative

Our defence badly needed fixing, defence is what wins you premierships, we went on a nice run in 2018  without Hogan but let's be honest we weren't really up there with the top 3 other sides.

Spot on, Pennant.  How many people were still bemoaning our lack of good, defensive players even when we made the prelim?  Heaps.

So what do we do?  We added Lever prior to that season and managed quite well without him.  Then, when Hogan agitates to leave (and I'm sure we were happy to oblige), we turn that into Steven May.  Tom McDonald was fresh off a 50 goal season, Weideman had just had a terrific finals series and we were looking the goods.

Things haven't panned out how we wanted since then, but you can't blame the club for fixing what many believed was our main deficiency - defence.

[Sir Why You Little 37,193]

12 hours ago, Satyriconhome said:

 

Agree, the number of premiership flags they have between them is staggering

Typical insightful comment

[Satyriconhome 10,880]

3 hours ago, TheKozzieExperience said:

What does this even mean?

Comprehension not your strong point

It means that even when these 'superstar' forwards were playing, it didn't necessarily equate to successful, flag winning seasons

Got it now?

All this negativity is tiresome

[Satyriconhome 10,880]

14 minutes ago, Sir Why You Little said:

Typical insightful comment

It is fact, something in short supply on here, too busy with the constant negativity

So have Nietz or whoever would change the game?

Thought we just bombed it in and our forward 50 entries were crap, can't have it both ways

[TheKozzieExperience 258]

2 minutes ago, Satyriconhome said:

Comprehension not your strong point

It means that even when these 'superstar' forwards were playing, it didn't necessarily equate to successful, flag winning seasons

Got it now?

All this negativity is tiresome

 

 When those guys were playing we were missing other ingredients as we obviously had the forward firepower.    Now we are missing a star key forward or two. 

Hence me saying it would be great to have one of them in the team these days.

Do you comprehend or is that a little too much for you?

[BenF 56]

31 minutes ago, BrisbaneDemon said:

Jump onto google mate, you’ll find them, I’m sure Demonland don’t want them mentioned on here.....

Yeah they probably don't like unsubstantiated bigfooty related hear-say stuff that's right.

[Sir Why You Little 37,193]

7 minutes ago, Satyriconhome said:

It is fact, something in short supply on here, too busy with the constant negativity

So have Nietz or whoever would change the game?

Thought we just bombed it in and our forward 50 entries were crap, can't have it both ways

Blah Blah Blah

You are like Charlie Brown’s Teacher....

It appears there’s more of a focus on running patterns, structures and set plays rather than the most important skill of all.

Kicking and Scoring....

[Watts the matter 1,235]

3 hours ago, dazzledavey36 said:

May was a power full forward back in his under 18's days. 

I remember I was watching the 2009 under 18 championships at Etithad Staduim at the time and I remember watching a 18 year Steven May absolutely dominate from full forward.

He reminded me so much of David Neitz in his ability to crash pack and lead straight and hard.

I'd love Goodwin to try it, but he won't.

May looked pretty good last year when he went forward for us late in a game. If we continue to struggle I wouldn't mind it, but don't want McDonald anywhere near the backline.

I've always thought Mitch Brown played his best footy as a defender.

[rjay 25,158]

21 minutes ago, Satyriconhome said:

It is fact, something in short supply on here, too busy with the constant negativity

So have Nietz or whoever would change the game?

Thought we just bombed it in and our forward 50 entries were crap, can't have it both ways

Having Neitz would at least make sense of a game plan that has us bombing the ball forward.

His ability to mark or at least crash the packs and bring the ball to ground would be a bonus.

Do we win a flag? maybe, maybe not but we do win more games.

Would I like a Neitz type at the moment? Yep, only a fool wouldn't...

[BrisbaneDemon 1,572]

33 minutes ago, BenF said:

Yeah they probably don't like unsubstantiated bigfooty related hear-say stuff that's 

Edited June 20, 2020 by BrisbaneDemon

[Little Goffy 14,661]

Personally, I'm willing to give Tom McDonald a couple more rounds to see if he can find his true self.

There's the full variety of types of tall defender to match up on by the time you get through Essendon, Geelong and the Swans.  None are a walk in the part (although the Swans don't seem to have the veteran height of the other two) but if by the end of that set McDonald isn't performing strong, not just adequately, then he should spend at least that amount of time off AFL level to rediscover form and/or take a good hard look at himself.

So, short version, I'm in the 'give every realistic chance, but then seriously hold to account' group.

[BenF 56]

26 minutes ago, BrisbaneDemon said:

 

You're the one with the narrative 'champ'. Apparently one player with photos all the over the internet means Goodwin "has a habit of getting rid of players with off-field issues." What was Watts' issue at Melb exactly? Ideally without bringing up the text messages.

Who else has Goodwin turfed out because of off-field issues?

Edited June 20, 2020 by BenF

[Satyriconhome 10,880]

23 minutes ago, rjay said:

Having Neitz would at least make sense of a game plan that has us bombing the ball forward.

His ability to mark or at least crash the packs and bring the ball to ground would be a bonus.

Do we win a flag? maybe, maybe not but we do win more games.

Would I like a Neitz type at the moment? Yep, only a fool wouldn't...

The game plan is not to bomb it forward, not sure which bit you lot are not getting, the players lapse into old habits, we didn't bomb in 2018 we did in 2019, we did it for a couple qtrs in 2020, team is afraid to lose

1st qtr against Carlton is how Goodwin wants them to play

Nietz may or may not be able to handle the game in 2020,

A fool, it is always a childish riposte when somebody has the temerity to offer another opinion 

 

[Satyriconhome 10,880]

42 minutes ago, Sir Why You Little said:

Blah Blah Blah

You are like Charlie Brown’s Teacher....

It appears there’s more of a focus on running patterns, structures and set plays rather than the most important skill of all.

Kicking and Scoring....

Differing opinion, of course you can't have that

It's the modern game Foss, get the fundamentals right the scoring will happen

Seems we got it right in 2018, if you can bring your love for the old forward a few seasons or so

[layzie 34,038]

2 minutes ago, BenF said:

You're the one with the narrative 'champ'. Apparently one player with photos all the over the internet means Goodwin "has a habit of getting rid of players with off-field issues." What was Watts' issue at Melb exactly? Ideally without bringing up the text messages.

Who else has Goodwin turfed out because of off-field issues?

Well I guess Dean Kent, Ben Kennedy and a few others had that infamous drinking session and weren't around for much longer. 

[Sir Why You Little 37,193]

Just now, Satyriconhome said:

Differing opinion, of course you can't have that

It's the modern game Foss, get the fundamentals right the scoring will happen

Seems we got it right in 2018, if you can bring your love for the old forward a few seasons or so

No idea what you are talking about and i couldn’t care less

Walk on and keep going...

[Satyriconhome 10,880]

52 minutes ago, TheKozzieExperience said:

 

 When those guys were playing we were missing other ingredients as we obviously had the forward firepower.    Now we are missing a star key forward or two. 

Hence me saying it would be great to have one of them in the team these days.

Do you comprehend or is that a little too much for you?

So the team wasn't perfect then but we had forwards who could score, so it was alright

Would any of the players mentioned be able to handle the modern game  particularly the defensive side

Tommy Mc was well held by Weiering, but we found other avenues to score

What is this fascination with pack marking, I prefer the one on one of the free man

 

[Satyriconhome 10,880]

1 minute ago, Sir Why You Little said:

No idea what you are talking about and i couldn’t care less

Walk on and keep going...

Good answer, walk away, can't you actually debate the points you are trying to make

If you don't care, why reply?

[Sir Why You Little 37,193]

Just now, Satyriconhome said:

Good answer, walk away, can't you actually debate the points you are trying to make

If you don't care, why reply?

I can debate. But with you it is a waste  of time. 
You are only interested in taking photos of young men in shorts

Winning Games js not important to you

 

[BenF 56]

6 minutes ago, layzie said:

Well I guess Dean Kent, Ben Kennedy and a few others had that infamous drinking session and weren't around for much longer. 

That doesn't mean anything.

[TheKozzieExperience 258]

10 minutes ago, Satyriconhome said:

What is this fascination with pack marking, I prefer the one on one of the free man

 

Well I hate to break it to you but we arent winning a thing without a power forward  who can take a pack mark.

The basics of Aussie Rules.

[rjay 25,158]

17 minutes ago, Satyriconhome said:

The game plan is not to bomb it forward, not sure which bit you lot are not getting, the players lapse into old habits, we didn't bomb in 2018 we did in 2019, we did it for a couple qtrs in 2020, team is afraid to lose

1st qtr against Carlton is how Goodwin wants them to play

Nietz may or may not be able to handle the game in 2020,

A fool, it is always a childish riposte when somebody has the temerity to offer another opinion 

 

I get that we are being told it's not the plan to bomb.

...but despite this we still do it.

The first Q against Carlton was so good to see the players lowering their eyes and looking for targets.

...but as soon as the pressure came on we reverted to type...we did the same in 2018 by the way.

So where is the problem?

You're around the club enough.

Does Goodwin have a communication problem?

He's been at the Helm for what, coming into his 4th year.

Surely that's long enough for players to understand the game plan or move those on who don't want to play it.

The players seem to go back in their shells as soon as they come under pressure.

I had heard 2nd hand from one of the previous coaches that players weren't doing what they were told and this would seem to be the case going by your post.

What's the issue?

As far as Neitz goes you and I both know that if he were to come along now at the peak of his powers he would be a great acquisition. Of course it's not going to happen so we do with what we've got and work at improving the list..

 

[MyFavouriteMartian 572]

_

Edited June 20, 2020 by MyFavouriteMartian

[MyFavouriteMartian 572]

23 hours ago, BrisbaneDemon said:

MFC were more then happy to move him on to get May.  Goodwin has made a habit of getting rid of players that have off field issues (Watts, Hogan).  I agree with everything you have said above, the thought Tmac was the way of the future (maybe we thought Weid would come on as well) but it clearly hasn’t works over the past 1.5 years.  We need to trade in a decent forward next year to ease that pressure.

Actually I think we need to draft a young Tall Defender to be a running CHB.   A dasher in the old mold of Knights,  or a Hardeman if you prefer.

 I think our key forwards are missing the physical support of the Ruckman pushing up and assisting from time to time. or assistance from one another.  Too often out tall forwards have to do it all themselves against numerous players ganging up.

 

Maybe this is why our key tall forwards are struggling.

Edited June 20, 2020 by MyFavouriteMartian

[layzie 34,038]

8 hours ago, BenF said:

That doesn't mean anything.

Instead of telling us what everything aint how about telling us what it am ?