Post trade week best 22

[MadAsHell 4,212]

B: Jetta Dunn Garland

HB: Melksham McDonald Salem

C: Lumumba Vince Brayshaw

HF: Vandenberg Hogan Watts

FF: Garlett Dawes Kennedy

R: Gawn, Jones, Viney

Int: Bugg, Newton, Grimes, Stretch

If we are talking round 1, then I am a little more gun shy on blokes like Trenners and Petracca or potentials like Darcy Parish or Sam Weideman. Roos has tried to make it a policy of making the kids kick the door down before they get a game. He hasn't stuck to this dogmatically as sometimes the alternatives to the kids have been worse but I see no reason why he wouldn't maintain this policy for the draft class of this year or Petracca. I wouldn't let them straight into the team either. We have seen how allowing Christian Salem a grace period before he gained a senior berth benefited him as it has with Billy Stretch, Harmes and ANB.

Trenners is basically playing for his career this year and has yet to have a run even in the VFL yet. I would say you will see him at Casey for a bit before he comes into the seniors if his form warrants it.

That's not to say that the guys I just mentioned won't be in the starting 22 by years end but that's what I think.

It may surprise some to see that the draft class of 2008-2011 that I have decried are still in my team (namely Watts and Grimes). I suspect that Roosy will have them in round one but will basically be keeping his eye on Casey to see who their replacements will be if they don't turn it around this year.

Newton & Stretch getting gigs before the likes of Tyson & Kent? Gee!

[stuie 7,374]

Newton & Stretch getting gigs before the likes of Tyson & Kent? Gee!

None of these guys from that 22 would realistically get games ahead of Tyson and Kent: Kennedy, Bugg, Newton, Grimes, Stretch, plus probably a couple more if you were picky.

Crazy crazy team.

[Je Roos Salem 661]

Look I don't disagree we need something new, I just think Dawes is a better and more consistent option than Pedo for now, especially with the reduced interchange and no sub.

Our forward line is a problem, no doubt, but it's connected with our lack of clearances and inside 50s, you can't separate the 2.

But that's not the reason why Dawes butchers the ball and drops marks. If lack of opportunities was my concern then I'd point it out. I think we're better structured without him.

Pedo has gone from whipping boy in 2013 to respected contributor this year. People would've agreed with you two years ago on Pedersen but clearly most people have noticed his improvement. Dawes has gone the opposite way.

[CBDees 3,167]

But that's not the reason why Dawes butchers the ball and drops marks. If lack of opportunities was my concern then I'd point it out. I think we're better structured without him.

Pedo has gone from whipping boy in 2013 to respected contributor this year. People would've agreed with you two years ago on Pedersen but clearly most people have noticed his improvement. Dawes has gone the opposite way.

Maybe the recruitment of Weidemann / Curnow will make this a non-issue?

[Je Roos Salem 661]

Maybe the recruitment of Weidemann / Curnow will make this a non-issue?

Hope so. No one ever waits until the draft to make these best 22 threads though!

[stuie 7,374]

But that's not the reason why Dawes butchers the ball and drops marks. If lack of opportunities was my concern then I'd point it out. I think we're better structured without him.

Pedo has gone from whipping boy in 2013 to respected contributor this year. People would've agreed with you two years ago on Pedersen but clearly most people have noticed his improvement. Dawes has gone the opposite way.

Disagree again. The Pedo myths have grown while he has been out for most of the year. You remember last year he was dropped late in the year right? How is that improvement?

You're just seemingly sucked in by the "dud or star" crew who are generally the same ones that whinge about what they think Dawes salary is.

The fact you say Dawes "butchers the ball" just proves you have 1 maybe 2 memories sticking out and that's what you've based that opinion on, because it's simply not true. It's the same shallow analysis that sees you lay sole blame on him for our low scoring without even considering the incredibly low clearance and inside 50 numbers.

I'm happy to go on record as saying (barring injuries) Pedo will not be anywhere near regular 22 next year.

Edited October 26, 2015 by stuie

[rjay 24,851]

But that's not the reason why Dawes butchers the ball and drops marks. If lack of opportunities was my concern then I'd point it out. I think we're better structured without him.

Pedo has gone from whipping boy in 2013 to respected contributor this year. People would've agreed with you two years ago on Pedersen but clearly most people have noticed his improvement. Dawes has gone the opposite way.

Disagree again. The Pedo myths have grown while he has been out for most of the year. You remember last year he was dropped late in the year right? How is that improvement?

You're just seemingly sucked in by the "dud or star" crew who are generally the same ones that whinge about what they think Dawes salary is.

The fact you say Dawes "butchers the ball" just proves you have 1 maybe 2 memories sticking out and that's what you've based that opinion on, because it's simply not true. It's the same shallow analysis that sees you lay sole blame on him for our low scoring without even considering the incredibly low clearance and inside 50 numbers.

I'm happy to go on record as saying (barring injuries) Pedo will not be anywhere near regular 22 next year.

I'm not a fan of either.

Dawes is not mobile enough and gets exposed by opposition defenders, it would help a lot if he held his grabs but even then this would be an issue.

Pedersen has good mits but picks and choses way to much, he can be very lazy and not a smart footballer.

If we get a kid in the draft they are going to be more like McCartin and take a year or 2 to settle, we won't get another Hogan out of this draft.

So....either Dawes can get over his injuries and find some mobility or it's Frost, Tommy Mac or Dunn forward for the time being...

Then of course the other option is King improving out of sight over the preseason.

[Moonshadow 17,675]

And here we have a post that illustrates that exact points I was making.

- In Demonland you're either a spud or a star. Apparently Dawes "can't mark, can't kick" and is a spud. Shallow analysis.

- Also, here's some more Pedomyths... He's not a strong mark at all, he's a ducker who has only taken grabs by being unfit and hugging the boundary where he strikes it lucky. "A neat kick" who has only ever had to go long to the boundary, and apparently can "pinch hit in the ruck"... Meaning he can stand around in a ruck contest, but actually provides about as many useful hitouts as Dawes does in that situation.

Pedo was puffing by 1/2 time last year, how do you think he's going to go next year being 2 years older, having less spells on the bench and not being able to be subbed out?

And here we have a post of pure fiction.

Putting words into other's mouths isn't one of your strongpoints Stuart. Where did I say Dawes is a spud? I said he can't kick and can't mark, that is self evident. If Dawes' best attribute is that he has a tank and can run around a lot, then God help us! He does show some leadership qualities and Jesse apparently likes him. But yes, Pedo is a better mark than Dawes, and he can pinch hit in the ruck. Dawes changed clubs partly to avoid that. I like each of them, yet recognise that both are limited footballers. If they have a big 2016, I'd be very happy to be proven wrong, but it might also be their last year on our list.

Some seem to love banging on about player myths like a broken record. It's boring, doesn't make them right, but each to their own I suppose.

[Guest]

Newton & Stretch getting gigs before the likes of Tyson & Kent? Gee!

Fair point on Tyson. He was a bit down this year on his form of last year so I have put him on the bench. More an oversight on my behalf and I have fixed it.

On Kent, I don't tend to rate him as highly as others so I will keep him out of the team for the time being.

[Pitchy 196]

Dawes can't play in the 22 anymore. He is a big reason for our scoring constipation.

We average 66 points per game with him in the team and 80+ without him in 2015. And... he missed both miserly Freo games which flattered his stat, it's more like 90+ without tightass Freo games included.

In an increasingly difficult comp to score in, forwards need to be more deft and brilliant than ever, not dour and poorly skilled (marking). It saps team morale very quickly when good play repeatedly goes unrewarded.

Seems like a great bloke though and I'm sure he will be a very successful man in whatever he turns to next.

[Wrecker45 3,378]

Dawes can't play in the 22 anymore. He is a big reason for our scoring constipation.

We average 66 points per game with him in the team and 80+ without him in 2015. And... he missed both miserly Freo games which flattered his stat, it's more like 90+ without tightass Freo games included.

That is worrying.

[stuie 7,374]

Dawes can't play in the 22 anymore. He is a big reason for our scoring constipation.

We average 66 points per game with him in the team and 80+ without him in 2015. And... he missed both miserly Freo games which flattered his stat, it's more like 90+ without tightass Freo games included.

In an increasingly difficult comp to score in, forwards need to be more deft and brilliant than ever, not dour and poorly skilled (marking). It saps team morale very quickly when good play repeatedly goes unrewarded.

Seems like a great bloke though and I'm sure he will be a very successful man in whatever he turns to next.

Yeah and we beat Geelong without Hogan, maybe we should move him on too?

OR maybe it's a team game....

[dazzledavey36 54,201]

Yeah and we beat Geelong without Hogan, maybe we should move him on too?

OR maybe it's a team game....

And even without Hogan Dawes still couldn't even bother to hurt the scoreboard.

[Good Times Grimes 2,396]

Yeah and we beat Geelong without Hogan, maybe we should move him on too?

OR maybe it's a team game....

Not sure what your point is here. Dawes had 9 disposals and no goals as the primary target in the forward line against Geelong. Sure, the team had it's best win in years, but Dawes didn't have very much to do with it. If Hogan was playing in his place, we would've won by even more.

[stuie 7,374]

And even without Hogan Dawes still couldn't even bother to hurt the scoreboard.

Not sure what your point is here. Dawes had 9 disposals and no goals as the primary target in the forward line against Geelong. Sure, the team had it's best win in years, but Dawes didn't have very much to do with it. If Hogan was playing in his place, we would've won by even more.

Oh ok I get it, when we lose it's Dawes fault, and when we win it's Dawes fault we didn't win by more...

Makes sense, and clearly not a biased analysis at all...

[Good Times Grimes 2,396]

Oh ok I get it, when we lose it's Dawes fault, and when we win it's Dawes fault we didn't win by more...

Makes sense, and clearly not a biased analysis at all...

Dawes did very little in that Geelong game to contribute to us winning it. He has also done very little in the vast majority of games that he has played for us. It's possible to win games when players don't perform, and we have done that on several occasions with Dawes in the lineup. We need to find a replacement for him, and I'm thankful that he only has one year to run on his contract.

[stuie 7,374]

Dawes did very little in that Geelong game to contribute to us winning it. He has also done very little in the vast majority of games that he has played for us. It's possible to win games when players don't perform, and we have done that on several occasions with Dawes in the lineup. We need to find a replacement for him, and I'm thankful that he only has one year to run on his contract.

Annnnnnnd you funnily enough missed the point totally in your haste to post yet another Dawes is a spud comment... Yawn...

Roos as players play roles + Roos keep picking Dawes = Dawes must be doing his role.

Not saying we shouldn't be trying to get someone better, but this whole "Dawes is a spud" thing is incredibly typical of the black and white mentality of footy analysis on social media.

[jumbo returns 6,737]

Dawes has been injured for a while now - his calf is dodgy and the wrist is iffy.

When he's fit, best 22.....I hope he's given time to get his body right.

[Good Times Grimes 2,396]

Annnnnnnd you funnily enough missed the point totally in your haste to post yet another Dawes is a spud comment... Yawn...

Roos as players play roles + Roos keep picking Dawes = Dawes must be doing his role.

Not saying we shouldn't be trying to get someone better, but this whole "Dawes is a spud" thing is incredibly typical of the black and white mentality of footy analysis on social media.

Can you please tell me what his role is? He's been played as a key forward and has averaged less than a goal a game in his 3 years at the Dees. I've heard people go on about how he plays his role, but I just can't understand what it is. I don't think that he gets enough of the footy to compensate for his lack of scoreboard damage, and I really think that Pedersen offers more in the forward line/backup ruck role.

[stuie 7,374]

Can you please tell me what his role is? He's been played as a key forward and has averaged less than a goal a game in his 3 years at the Dees. I've heard people go on about how he plays his role, but I just can't understand what it is. I don't think that he gets enough of the footy to compensate for his lack of scoreboard damage, and I really think that Pedersen offers more in the forward line/backup ruck role.

Judging by the fact Pedo has been dropped for Dawes but not vice versa, I would say Roos doesn't agree with you there.

I know a few others are stuck in the 90s, but not all forwards are there to actually kick the goals these days. You'd have to ask Roos what Dawes exact role is, but my opinion is his job is as a high half forward/wing link up forward who is meant to apply pressure, a big presence, and create space for our scoring forwards in Hogan and Garlett to work. It's not ideal, and I'm not saying it's our future or it's how it should be, but it's the reality of our list and how Roos is working with it.

[jötnar 25]

Judging by the fact Pedo has been dropped for Dawes but not vice versa, I would say Roos doesn't agree with you there.

I know a few others are stuck in the 90s, but not all forwards are there to actually kick the goals these days. You'd have to ask Roos what Dawes exact role is, but my opinion is his job is as a high half forward/wing link up forward who is meant to apply pressure, a big presence, and create space for our scoring forwards in Hogan and Garlett to work. It's not ideal, and I'm not saying it's our future or it's how it should be, but it's the reality of our list and how Roos is working with it.

Which forwards at Hawthorn and Freo are there not to kick goals?

[stuie 7,374]

Which forwards at Hawthorn and Freo are there not to kick goals?

[jötnar 25]

That's your answer! back to the 90's

Perhaps you could count the flags won by Hawthorn since the nineties and add the finals played by Freo and subtract the flags we have won since then and voila a number that is almost exactly double your IQ

[jumbo returns 6,737]

I never got those 'Back to the Future' films....

[stuie 7,374]

That's your answer! back to the 90's

Perhaps you could count the flags won by Hawthorn since the nineties and add the finals played by Freo and subtract the flags we have won since then and voila a number that is almost exactly double your IQ

Ahhhhh didn't take you long to go to the insults hey... About as quality a post as your previous one, but at least your previous one vaguely attempted to talk footy