Salem maybe. Toumpas doesn't have the defensive skills, doesn't really have any natural aerial ability or tackling ability. His kicking is also more effective in space running forward and spearing it on to forward's chests. Salem not only has the left foot that we need from half back but also a quick release, good balance and can hit targets short or long.

Agreed. The more we can get Salem behind the ball and kicking in, the less we will have to rely on macdonald and others moving the ball forward.

As much as I would like to see toump played off the hbf, I don't think he will ever be able to defend in the air well enough to play on most hff.

How is toumps leg speed going? Will he ever recover from those hip oppos?

Thanks for the report TDI.

It is ridiculous however the way each and every thread is derailed into personal attacks and vendettas against other posters.

For the vast majority, the training reports are fantastic no matter who they are from and all different views and opinions are great.

Just because someone doesn't agree with you however or you dislike the way someone describes something doesn't mean you need to start attacking them again and again thread after thread. It is tedious.

TDI- great work in general, can you refrain from the constant lemon suckers etc jibes as they just inflame things with some posters unnecessarily.

Others- can you stop constantly slaying TDI for sharing his opinion on what he views and the answers he provides to questions asked directly of him by other posters. If you don't agree with his opinion then simply move on or go watch yourself.

Mods- perhaps time to crack the whip on the constant derailing of threads (I do appreciate that you guys have lots to do already but it is getting ridiculous).

Thanks for the report TDI.

It is ridiculous however the way each and every thread is derailed into personal attacks and vendettas against other posters.

For the vast majority, the training reports are fantastic no matter who they are from and all different views and opinions are great.

Just because someone doesn't agree with you however or you dislike the way someone describes something doesn't mean you need to start attacking them again and again thread after thread. It is tedious.

TDI- great work in general, can you refrain from the constant lemon suckers etc jibes as they just inflame things with some posters unnecessarily.

Others- can you stop constantly slaying TDI for sharing his opinion on what he views and the answers he provides to questions asked directly of him by other posters. If you don't agree with his opinion then simply move on or go watch yourself.

Mods- perhaps time to crack the whip on the constant derailing of threads (I do appreciate that you guys have lots to do already but it is getting ridiculous).

No, the mods don't need to crack the whip, the mods just need to let it go, they do a tremendous job.

Let's not have Demonland regulated to the point of big footy - where indepent thought is frowned upon, and results in suspension.

Demonland is a great place. The Devil Inside is an 'all time great' member, I am sure he will be ok.

Thank you for the consistent reports TDI, they are much appreciated.

TDI- great work in general, can you refrain from the constant lemon suckers etc jibes as they just inflame things with some posters unnecessarily.

I'll try, but the constant carping irritates me, by the way I don't read Mach's posts, stopped a couple of months ago

Toumpas doesn't have the defensive skills, doesn't really have any natural aerial ability or tackling ability...this is based on how many games?, I'll try and get a picture of both for you on Wednesday, know it's only training but practice makes perfect

As for Vandenberg, he is what it says on the tin, a big bodied midfielder, knows where to run, hasn't been doing much inside work, only cleared for full contact this week, spent a good 20 minutes at the end of the session testing his shoulder out on a tackle bag

No, the mods don't need to crack the whip, the mods just need to let it go, they do a tremendous job.

Let's not have Demonland regulated to the point of big footy - where indepent thought is frowned upon, and results in suspension.

Demonland is a great place. The Devil Inside is an 'all time great' member, I am sure he will be ok.

Thank you for the consistent reports TDI, they are much appreciated.

I agree I am a big boy, will try and curb the sarcasm, know it irritates some that can actually recognise it, I think they just want to be miserable, which is rather sad, me I am optimistic, I may have my optimism in pieces by Rd 4, but hey that's why you support footy and your team

Think Roos' plan with Salem, is to give him responsibility, Salem is so naturally gifted think he tends to coast some times

As for Viney, he is just one midfielder competing for a spot, I think the only one guaranteed a spot in the midfield is Nathan Jones, but even he will have to be fit and in form come Rd 1

Agreed. The more we can get Salem behind the ball and kicking in, the less we will have to rely on macdonald and others moving the ball forward.

As much as I would like to see toump played off the hbf, I don't think he will ever be able to defend in the air well enough to play on most hff.

How is toumps leg speed going? Will he ever recover from those hip oppos?

His leg speed is really good, his running style is horrible, bit it is effective, he is also better in the air than given credit for, now he is fully fit he is showing that

Most are faster, even Nev Jetta who told me he tries to keep body contact, coz he hasn't got the speed to catch, agrees he is faster than ever, one drill today had the backline coming out of the fifty at speed with handballs and kicks, must have repeated the drill at least 20 times, saw only two fail due to a poor kick or handball

Edited February 2, 201510 yr by The Devil Inside

Reasons for optimism

1. About 34 of the squad did the whole session again today

2. The ruck division is all fit

3. There is serious competition for spots

4. Watching and listening to Roos and the coaches coach, every single one is on the same page, which is headed KISS

5. The skills at training actually improving

6. Jeff Garlett, some of his work today had me drooling, complimented him on his quick hands, intercepting handballs or just getting a hand in the way, answer "that's part of my job'

Somebody asked about Brayshaw,still working his way into AFL footy, still looks a player, Roos pulled him up for the wrong option, but it was more of chat rather than berate, Stretch surprised me today in the match sim, and as I said Petracca put in the best shift I have seen from him

Just on Salem again, he took on Daniel Cross in a goal kicking comp at the end, three from each pocket and 3 from 40 out in front, Cross had him sweating but he beat him with last kick, Cross just missed

Just on Salem again, he took on Daniel Cross in a goal kicking comp at the end, three from each pocket and 3 from 40 out in front, Cross had him sweating but he beat him with last kick, Cross just missed

TDI you certainly made up for your late start to your commentary by an extended session. Thanks for the perserverence!

A golden [censored] tiger

TDI- great work in general, can you refrain from the constant lemon suckers etc jibes as they just inflame things with some posters unnecessarily.

I'll try, but the constant carping irritates me, by the way I don't read Mach's posts, stopped a couple of months ago

Toumpas doesn't have the defensive skills, doesn't really have any natural aerial ability or tackling ability...this is based on how many games?, I'll try and get a picture of both for you on Wednesday, know it's only training but practice makes perfect

As for Vandenberg, he is what it says on the tin, a big bodied midfielder, knows where to run, hasn't been doing much inside work, only cleared for full contact this week, spent a good 20 minutes at the end of the session testing his shoulder out on a tackle bag

Saty, I love your use of the expression "he is what it says on the tin..."

Mind you, I hope we've stopped buying our product from the Reject Shop.

I hope that the likes of Bail, McKenzie and Terlich have improved out of sight.

I consider these players real tryers with some weaknesses in their disposal (and in McKenzie's case - getting involved).

I want these players to improve so much that it gives the selectors headaches and it gives what I consider the naturally talented footballers the impetus to make the most of their natural abilities week in and week out.

There was a reason that Bail played most games last season - he regularly did the job that Roos asked of him and there wasn't a footballer doing a better job at Casey, knocking the door down to take his spot.

We laud Cross and we rightly should - not overly quick, not overly good overhead and adequate by foot and hand. He plays smart and he plays to 100% of his ability most weeks. He screams out " if you want my place in team, play better than me".

For us to rise to the top we do need better players than Bail. McKenzie and Terlich. For us to rise to the top we need Bail, McKenzie and Terlich playing well to force the better players to actually play better and take their spots. ( then we need the likes of Bail. McKenzie and Terlich to believe that if they play at the top of their game they can get a gig - think Cameron Ling at Geelong)

(and in McKenzie's case - getting involved).

Over the last 2 seasons Ryan Crowley has played 49 games for 719 disposals at an average of 14.67.

Jordie McKenzie has played 21 games for 314 disposals at an average 14.95.

I agree with all you say Nut, I want Jordie to get involved and be let off the leash but in a team that was getting flogged on a regular basis where defense was the mantra it's interesting to note that Jordie's disposals per game is equal to the games best.

The battle for places in the midfield will fascinating.

Over the last 2 seasons Ryan Crowley has played 49 games for 719 disposals at an average of 14.67.

Jordie McKenzie has played 21 games for 314 disposals at an average 14.95.

I agree with all you say Nut, I want Jordie to get involved and be let off the leash but in a team that was getting flogged on a regular basis where defense was the mantra it's interesting to note that Jordie's disposals per game is equal to the games best.

The battle for places in the midfield will fascinating.

Maybe I should say that I want him to get some "easy ball".

Crowley does a fantastic shutdown job but he also has the nous ( or the licence ?) to run off his opponent when he doesn't have the ball.

Getting 5 metres clear and giving out an easy handball or chip kick would make Jordie a more effective footballer - I did notice he was doing that a little more last year than in the Neeld era ( and getting hung for THAT shot on goal).

Over the last 2 seasons Ryan Crowley has played 49 games for 719 disposals at an average of 14.67.

Jordie McKenzie has played 21 games for 314 disposals at an average 14.95.

I agree with all you say Nut, I want Jordie to get involved and be let off the leash but in a team that was getting flogged on a regular basis where defense was the mantra it's interesting to note that Jordie's disposals per game is equal to the games best.

The battle for places in the midfield will fascinating.

The problem Jordie faces is that midfielders now need to be role players and a midfield with Cross and McKenzie has too much of a negating feel. Nathan Jones and Bernie Vince were also asked at stages throughout the year to run with/against opposition better players.

I hope Mckenzie can improve enough to warrant a spot, but i personally think he is a bit further back in the queue than starting 22.

Not really a big call but I think Newton will play 22 games this year barring injury and will help to improve the quality going through the middle of the ground for us.

Whilst it is great to see the skills are good at training, lots of the training sessions i have attended over the years had pretty good skills and the team looked like world beaters, throw in the pressure of match day and zoning opposition, the simple/most dangerous option is often covered by opposition players, which is why unlike others I am not opposed to the notion of moving the ball backwards or sidewards to create space, other wise we will turn it over much more easily with score of turnover being a massive stat in modern football. This was partially one of the reasons that Dean Bailey didnt succeed because the game plan was when at half back move the ball forward at all costs which resulted in either a massive win (sydney) or a massive loss (geelong)

Jordie is a good kick, Watts hard at it, Toumpas is quick.

Top 4 beckons.

Will be bitterly disappointed if it doesn't happen.

Over the last 2 seasons Ryan Crowley has played 49 games for 719 disposals at an average of 14.67.

Jordie McKenzie has played 21 games for 314 disposals at an average 14.95.

I agree with all you say Nut, I want Jordie to get involved and be let off the leash but in a team that was getting flogged on a regular basis where defense was the mantra it's interesting to note that Jordie's disposals per game is equal to the games best.

The battle for places in the midfield will fascinating.

http://www.footywire.com/afl/footy/ft_player_compare?tid1=9&pid1=1349&tid2=12&pid2=3185&type=A&fid1=C&fid2=C

The stats come out fairly similar, Crowley ahead in most, but not by much.

It'd be nice if there was somewhere supporters could access the premium/ boutique statistics such as metres gained.

Did the players have numbered singlets at training? I went last week and complained to Josh Mahoney that it was really difficult to recognize the players given the number of new blokes and the changes to their appearance.

Then I noted that someone said they had numbers on Friday - well done Josh. Hope the trend continues. I don't know about others but I have terrible trouble recognizing some of the players during preseason.

Did the players have numbered singlets at training? I went last week and complained to Josh Mahoney that it was really difficult to recognize the players given the number of new blokes and the changes to their appearance.

Then I noted that someone said they had numbers on Friday - well done Josh. Hope the trend continues. I don't know about others but I have terrible trouble recognizing some of the players during preseason.

Put your glasses on BB, yes they did but they cocked it up, Vandenberg has been training in 9 and Frost in 21 and 47 which I think is Max King, they must have forgotten them or something

......

Cool story...

Needs more dragons and stuff.

Come on mate, comparing Jordie McKenzie to Brett Kirk is drawing a very long bow. Look at what each achieved at the mid way point of their careers. I'd take Kirk's kicking any day over Jordie's. It's great to see him putting in everything on the track, good on him, but the reality is he's a battler with poor kicking when it matters, during games.

Not comparing them as players. Commenting on the fact that Kirk was a very ordinary kick but managed to be a great player. So saying McKenzie can't make it because he is an ordinary kick doesn't hold water. His kicking is becoming adequate if he doesn't make it, it will be because he isn't good enough not just because he's a bad kick.

Garlett will be a massive steal. If we have some

Luck with injuries he will go close to 40+ goals for the year.

TDI- great work in general, can you refrain from the constant lemon suckers etc jibes as they just inflame things with some posters unnecessarily.

I'll try, but the constant carping irritates me, by the way I don't read Mach's posts, stopped a couple of months ago

Toumpas doesn't have the defensive skills, doesn't really have any natural aerial ability or tackling ability...this is based on how many games?, I'll try and get a picture of both for you on Wednesday, know it's only training but practice makes perfect

As for Vandenberg, he is what it says on the tin, a big bodied midfielder, knows where to run, hasn't been doing much inside work, only cleared for full contact this week, spent a good 20 minutes at the end of the session testing his shoulder out on a tackle bag

How many games does a player need to be assessed upon? I still think he'll be a good player. But his strengths are work rate, reading the play to get in to space and accurate spearing kicks. Young players improve but they usually keep the same strengths and weaknesses through their careers. I don't think that's a controversial statement.

I don't know what the picture will be? They are of similar height and shape is that your point? But half the AFL is made up of 185cm 80kg players. You can play inside mid, outside mid, forward or back at that size and shape depending on what other attributes you bring. Given their attributes I'd much rather see Salem play half back than Toumpas.

Which part? Machsy trying to pose as an intellectual by using big words or the fact that his dislike of TDI's reports has him wishing players of the Team he follows are failures (almost), but only at this time of year.

The words too big for you?

Just because you don't know what they mean, doesn't mean they weren't the appropriate words to use in this instance.

Now because some are not good with subtlety... I wish Saty would be proved conclusively wrong in some way, so he'd cut back on the overzealous support he has for anything MFC. Much like when Neeld was sacked, but nothing lasts forever.

At this time of year, when there's little else to read, the posters from Maroochydore were a god-send with their honest and pragmatic views of training in comparison to his sickeningly sweet chocolate coated reports.

I won't hold my breath waiting for you to get it.

What does another person's enthusiasm have to do with you? No one is here to please you, and if you don't like or accept what someone else is posting, too f**king bad. Its your choice to read it and your choice to post a message sooking about it like you're some kind of authority around here.