Martin can't hit a target so even if he does spoil a contest he will turn it over.

Aren't we talking about playing a key defensive role? Who cares if he can't play "catch the ball" for that? He just needs to be able to play "not get outbodied, then punch the ball away from the other guy". I think he can cope with that; he showed this year that he could.

Yeah-who needs to hold a mark.

It's out of fashion.

Yeah-who needs to hold a mark.

It's out of fashion.

Martin is right out of fashion because he doesn't hold them. He's athletic but cant impact the centre bounce. He cant play forward and cant play back. I have seen what Martin gives and he does not have the tools to be a first ruck. With the existing options we have for first ruck (Jamar, Spencer, Gawn), we should seek to get something for Martin.

Martin is right out of fashion because he doesn't hold them. He's athletic but cant impact the centre bounce. He cant play forward and cant play back. I have seen what Martin gives and he does not have the tools to be a first ruck. With the existing options we have for first ruck (Jamar, Spencer, Gawn), we should seek to get something for Martin.

What if Gawn is an absolute retard for the next three years-which is likely to be the case.

Martin can mark and kick ,handball ,run and tackle!

Jamar cant-so lets trade Martin .

Jump on the wagon Quick-its leaving .

What if Gawn is an absolute retard for the next three years-which is likely to be the case.

Martin can mark and kick ,handball ,run and tackle!

Jamar cant-so lets trade Martin .

Jump on the wagon Quick-its leaving .

And in 3 years time we might be celebrating a 3rd premiership! You can't say Gawn will be an absolute retard. Based on his handful of games he looked "ok". Nothing better, but ok. He's big, he knows how to ruck. Martin is big, looks great, has no footy smarts, lacks stamina and rarely impacts a contest.

Right now Martin has value to other clubs. Morton had that a couple of years back and we resigned him and now look what we are left with. If we move him and he turns into someone who can play (as yet he's done nothing to prove that) then we were wrong. We've been there before.

What if Gawn is an absolute retard for the next three years-which is likely to be the case.

Martin can mark and kick ,handball ,run and tackle!

Jamar cant-so lets trade Martin .

Jump on the wagon Quick-its leaving .

Martin cant do any of those skills sufficiently to play first ruck.

Jamar won an AA for being a first ruck and has proven that he does possess the tools! MFC have signed Jamar to a 3 year deal so they are going to back him.

If they deal with Martin now at 27 then they lose their window.

Right now Martin has value to other clubs. Morton had that a couple of years back and we resigned him and now look what we are left with. If we move him and he turns into someone who can play (as yet he's done nothing to prove that) then we were wrong. We've been there before.

At his age he might just be a punt for a club. On what he has shown to date I am not sure he will make MFC regret its decision.

And in 3 years time we might be celebrating a 3rd premiership! You can't say Gawn will be an absolute retard. Based on his handful of games he looked "ok". Nothing better, but ok. He's big, he knows how to ruck. Martin is big, looks great, has no footy smarts, lacks stamina and rarely impacts a contest.

Right now Martin has value to other clubs. Morton had that a couple of years back and we resigned him and now look what we are left with. If we move him and he turns into someone who can play (as yet he's done nothing to prove that) then we were wrong. We've been there before.

all Big men are absolute retards for the first few years.

My point is that we are going to have to endure more pain with Gawn.

Jamar was uninspiring in 2012.

Moloney was a gun in 2011 also.

What if Gawn is an absolute retard for the next three years-which is likely to be the case.

Martin can mark and kick ,handball ,run and tackle!

Jamar cant-so lets trade Martin .

Jump on the wagon Quick-its leaving .

What if Gawn isn't a "retard" for the next three years?

Fact is we have Jamar, Martin, Spencer and Gawn as ruck options; and Clark, Sellar, Fitzpatrick and Dawes (possibly) as players who can pinch-hit in the ruck if required.

Martin is not a massive loss to our ruck options.

We have Frawley, McDonald, Sellar, Garland, Dunn, Watts, Pederson (possibly) and Rivers (possibly) as 190cm+ defenders. Plus the options of Davis and Sheahan.

Martin is not a massive loss to our defence options.

Clearly you rate Martin quite highly (as do I) and can understand why he might have some currency at the trade table.

If we can bring in a type of player that we are in desperate need of, at the expense of Martin, then that is a win for the MFC.

Please tell me I missed the bandwagon.

If we get a decent off for a trade for Stef, take it and run as we won't get better. Reminds me of Paul Johnson - no idea how to use his size. Massively over-rated here

I would like to see one more pre season in Martin. He is borderline but he COULD be such a good player.

Confidence.

It's amazing how many times you hear, "just give him one more season.." Everyone's been guilty of it.

I'm a Martin fan but I'm resigned to the fact that he should probably be traded now while he has some value, particularly with the likes of Pedersen and Gawn in the frame.

We must keep Martin on our list as a permanent key back and not trade him.

Look at the power forwards of the top teams, Hawthorn, Sydney, WCE and Collingwood and tell me who from the MFC are going to play on their power forwards.

Collingwood - Cloke & Lynch

WCE - Kennedy, Darling & Cox/Naitinui

Hawthorn - Franklin & Roughead

Sydney - Reid & Tippett

IMO Martin is clearly the best option to take each teams biggest/strongest key forward (Franklin, Cloke, Cox/Natinui, Tippett) with Frawley taking the 2nd biggest/strongest.

I thought Martin played some really good footy 2-3 years back when he played as a permanent key back.

MacDonald maybe in 2 or 3 years, but definitely not next year or the year after.

It also gives us some flexibility with him to pinch hit in the ruck.

I couldn't disagree more! First of all I will state I like and rate Martin, although he is a B+ ruck and C+ to B- forward. He should not be getting played in the back line and besides we have Frawley, T Mac, and potentially Pedersen on the way.

Secondly he is currently in contract, therefore if he is traded there will be some form of agreeance with him. We hear Neeld saying he wants 100% compliance, this is because not all players over the past year agreed with his game plan and methods, like Moloney. This doesn't mean that Martin was one, but for all we know he may want out.

Finally if we can get Dawes, Ray and pick 39 for Martin, pick 20, pick 45, I would consider that a pretty big trade WIN!

It's amazing how many times you hear, "just give him one more season.." Everyone's been guilty of it.

I'm a Martin fan but I'm resigned to the fact that he should probably be traded now while he has some value, particularly with the likes of Pedersen and Gawn in the frame.

its because he looks so fit and agile. Somebody could flick that switch in his head and he has the capability to be a Top Shelf big man.

Stef has a laconic streak in him...holds him back...

pure athlete in my opinion, can jump and run, and he's big.

would be good to see what he can do if given the opportunity to solely play back.

We must keep Martin on our list as a permanent key back and not trade him.

Look at the power forwards of the top teams, Hawthorn, Sydney, WCE and Collingwood and tell me who from the MFC are going to play on their power forwards.

Collingwood - Cloke & Lynch

WCE - Kennedy, Darling & Cox/Naitinui

Hawthorn - Franklin & Roughead

Sydney - Reid & Tippett

IMO Martin is clearly the best option to take each teams biggest/strongest key forward (Franklin, Cloke, Cox/Natinui, Tippett) with Frawley taking the 2nd biggest/strongest.

I thought Martin played some really good footy 2-3 years back when he played as a permanent key back.

MacDonald maybe in 2 or 3 years, but definitely not next year or the year after.

It also gives us some flexibility with him to pinch hit in the ruck.

I still dont see how Martin is going to stop a gorilla.

I mean a silverback gorilla weighs around 185 to 230kg, has the power of around 5 grown men. Martin only weights 103kg, and whilst he has the height advantage is seriously out muscled...

I would prefer to see Martin take the gorilla and Chip take the 3rd best defender, to allow him to play the 3rd player up and play a more creative run out of defence game, like Scarlet and Fletcher do these days.

You don't see them taking the best forward these days do you?

And Chip always gets smashed by Frankiln anyway.

Martin is perfect in terms of pace and body size for Franklin, Natinui, Tippett and Cloke.

I would prefer to see Martin take the gorilla and Chip take the 3rd best defender, to allow him to play the 3rd player up and play a more creative run out of defence game, like Scarlet and Fletcher do these days.

When Chip's confidence is up he can be creative. Martin defensively is just ok, nothing special (unlike Chip) and would be a major worry for the coach in being accountable against the like you mention.

You don't see them taking the best forward these days do you?

It depends upon matchups. When you have the likes of Lonergan and Taylor in your team, you can mix and match. And sometimes Scarlett and Fletcher do take the best forward.

And Chip always gets smashed by Frankiln anyway.

Chip has held Franklin before for majority of games, but like Franklin does against other top line defenders he only needs a 5 or 10 minute purple patch and can put 3 goals on in no time.

Martin is perfect in terms of pace and body size for Franklin, Natinui, Tippett and Cloke.

Pace and body size is one thing, nous and agility and defensive techniques without giving away frees is another.