On 30/06/2011 at 02:55, La Dee-vina Commedia said:

Are you serious? Do you think he had a choice? The drafting process did somewhat limit his options.

A choice? No, thats not what I'm saying. I'm saying we made the wrong Pick taking him.

I'm saying we should have taken another player, as I thought at the time. And, as I thought after seeing his first handful of games I thought shiit, what have we got here.

I think Robbo sumed it up pretty well in the HS this morning:

"He doesn't play football, he sashsays around a footy field, playing his style of footy and not what the team needs. He's laid nine tackles this year in nine games. Last year it was 21 in 10. Hate to say it, but he plays like he does not want to be there. Hasn't he ''put off contract negotiations until the end of the season''?"

http://www.heraldsun.com.au/sport/afl/the-tackles-round-14-all-australian-team/story-fn5937w8-1226085457619

I agree with WYL, Cale should be played forward of centre where his elusiveness and reach can hurt teams on the scoreboard.

I think since Davey got injured the FD figured they could slot Cale into a QB sweeper role like Flash had been doing but it hasn't worked. He doesn't man up, struggles to put his body on the line and fluffs disposal under even minimal pressure.

I can recall Cale kicking multiple goals as a floating HF against the Cats and maybe 1 other (swans?), for now this remains his best position.

On the Davey topic, personally I think even he was struggling in this role before he got injured due to press football, maybe Tapscott's return will offer us another option.

The issue with Cale is he doesn't have a defensive bone in his body. The club has been trying over the past 3 years to get him to improve on this but he isn't learning. You can't put him on the Wing he just stands by himself, you can't put him in the back line as he doesn't like the contest, and you can't put him up forward we already have enough forwards that don't chase and tackle.

  On 04/07/2011 at 03:20, Dee*ceiving said:

I agree with WYL, Cale should be played forward of centre where his elusiveness and reach can hurt teams on the scoreboard.

I think since Davey got injured the FD figured they could slot Cale into a QB sweeper role like Flash had been doing but it hasn't worked. He doesn't man up, struggles to put his body on the line and fluffs disposal under even minimal pressure.

I can recall Cale kicking multiple goals as a floating HF against the Cats and maybe 1 other (swans?), for now this remains his best position.

On the Davey topic, personally I think even he was struggling in this role before he got injured due to press football, maybe Tapscott's return will offer us another option.

I think our young side going forward is fast taking shape.

Strauss has been pleasantly surprising in recent weeks with increased composure and one on one competitiveness.

Tapscott will be back probably next game I imagine.

Davis and McDonald are going well @ Casey, & Cook is looking alright in the heat of the kitchen, Nicholson & Evans have been great assets to the club.

I think we'll see a few trade outs @ years end.

Good call dee-luded, and you're forgetting young J Howe who looks to be a real find.

If there is 1 big bonus to the season so far its what we have managed to find out about players initially thought to be outside or at best just in the best 22.

Stef Martin has grown considerably in Jamar's absence

Nicholson has a good burst of speed and hunger for the ball

Strauss is settling in down back by the week

Howe looks to be a hard worker and a good mark for his size

Tapscott (the bull) now appears a critical aspect of our defensive 6

Out of those, I would have picked only Martin as in our best 22 for round 1 and only just.

  On 04/07/2011 at 03:40, Dee*ceiving said:

Good call dee-luded, and you're forgetting young J Howe who looks to be a real find.

If there is 1 big bonus to the season so far its what we have managed to find out about players initially thought to be outside or at best just in the best 22.

Stef Martin has grown considerably in Jamar's absence

Nicholson has a good burst of speed and hunger for the ball

Strauss is settling in down back by the week

Howe looks to be a hard worker and a good mark for his size

Tapscott (the bull) now appears a critical aspect of our defensive 6

Out of those, I would have picked only Martin as in our best 22 for round 1 and only just.

What you have said is right, but lets say you put Morton, Maric, Bate and Warnock on the trade table to me the only playere with any currency is Warnock. There would be a number of clubs looking for a big body defender. The other three I can't imagine there would be much interest, all three have the same issue great attacking players but limited defense, today's game you have to be able to go both ways or you are a liability.

  On 04/07/2011 at 03:40, Dee*ceiving said:

Good call dee-luded, and you're forgetting young J Howe who looks to be a real find.

If there is 1 big bonus to the season so far its what we have managed to find out about players initially thought to be outside or at best just in the best 22.

Stef Martin has grown considerably in Jamar's absence

Nicholson has a good burst of speed and hunger for the ball

Strauss is settling in down back by the week

Howe looks to be a hard worker and a good mark for his size

Tapscott (the bull) now appears a critical aspect of our defensive 6

Out of those, I would have picked only Martin as in our best 22 for round 1 and only just.

Yep, your right, he's just about my favorite of all the young ones. I love the way he uses the ball with great composure and vision, then finishes really well. And he chases and tackles too!

  On 03/07/2011 at 02:12, Ned said:

By that logic, Jack Watts would've played less than 10 games in his career.

Sometimes backing a player whose confidence is shot is the best strategy. Work out which you actually believe champ. You like to call people keyboard warriors but your line of thinking is about as fickle as a that of a teenage girl.

I wouldn't have thought so 'champ' but logic doesn't appear to be one of your strong points.

Cale played 50 games to the end of 2010 after being drafted at no 4 in 2007.

Jack played 18 games to the end of 2010 after being drafted at no 1 in 2008.

Jack was later to start than Cale due to school commitments but has showed continual improvement. Cale peaked at around game 20 despite being given every opportunity to show improvement.

No comparison between the two. Nothing fickle here. Try a mirror if you want to see that.

  On 29/06/2011 at 08:36, dee-luded said:

He should have stayed in Perth with the Big WACA ground that suited that style.

They havent played footy at the WACA since the year 2000. The Wiz was still playing for us and Tony Modra was playing at the Dockers?

  On 04/07/2011 at 04:26, DemonWA said:

They havent played footy at the WACA since the year 2000. The Wiz was still playing for us and Tony Modra was playing at the Dockers?

Whats it matter the name of the stadium when the context of the message is obvious? I haven't been to Perth since I stayed with a couple of Airline beauties over there, in 1985.. So forgive my poor geographical terminology.

The point remains, Morton is Useless without open paddocks.

Details, dee-luded, details! And don't hold back

This could be a more entertaining diversion to the Scully thread

  On 04/07/2011 at 06:38, daisycutter said:

Details, dee-luded, details! And don't hold back

This could be a more entertaining diversion to the Scully thread

They stayed on the second floor. Dee-luded camped out in the lobby.

  On 04/07/2011 at 06:38, daisycutter said:

Details, dee-luded, details! And don't hold back

This could be a more entertaining diversion to the Scully thread

Hmmn, I was a father to be but didn't yet realize it. Till got back to Melbourne.

A mate and I were set up with a couple of regional hosties. A gay guy took a liking to us at the perth cup, and realising @ afterparte' that we were straight, he promptly set us up for the holidays. Ah, freedom.

Getting back to Melbourne there was the Ph: call you don't want from an acquaintance.

30 Yrs on & not much has changed Daisy.

Definately not an 'outside player', I like to mix it up in the scrums. B)

  On 04/07/2011 at 09:10, dee-luded said:

Hmmn, I was a father to be but didn't yet realize it. Till got back to Melbourne.

A mate and I were set up with a couple of regional hosties. A gay guy took a liking to us at the perth cup, and realising @ afterparte' that we were straight, he promptly set us up for the holidays. Ah, freedom.

Getting back to Melbourne there was the Ph: call you don't want from an acquaintance.

30 Yrs on & not much has changed Daisy.

Definately not an 'outside player', I like to mix it up in the scrums. B)

Wow an inside player who kicks goals

Very impressive dee-luded

P.S. good decision making too re the gay guy

LOL

  On 04/07/2011 at 10:25, daisycutter said:

Wow an inside player who kicks goals

Very impressive dee-luded

P.S. good decision making too re the gay guy

LOL

HaHa, he wanted me to join his escort business. Hmm, ah, no. He had me worried for a while.

Still what a Xmas holiday that was. Flew us to rotnest Island in his hired Cessna & everything. And there was another slender beauty from queensland, a Uni student who wa over to stay with her father, (separated) for Hols. Phew, slender like a mermaid with dark tanned skin & lots of freckles, but gorgeous.

  On 04/07/2011 at 11:41, dee-luded said:

HaHa, he wanted me to join his escort business. Hmm, ah, no. He had me worried for a while.

Still what a Xmas holiday that was. Flew us to rotnest Island in his hired Cessna & everything. And there was another slender beauty from queensland, a Uni student who wa over to stay with her father, (separated) for Hols. Phew, slender like a mermaid with dark tanned skin & lots of freckles, but gorgeous.

Settle down now dee-luded

I'd love to hear this story in another ten years

  On 04/07/2011 at 12:13, daisycutter said:

Settle down now dee-luded

I'd love to hear this story in another ten years

What kind of chatroom have I stumbled in to???

  On 26/06/2011 at 07:36, sylvinator said:

He's still very young, has plenty of talent, has some elite attributes, and was drafted as a long term project considering how skinny and undersized he was at 18.

People on demonland will write him off.... of coarse... just like they wrote off Watts and Frawley and Garland early in their careers.

Sometimes 194cm+ players take some time! patience is required

He is in what, his fourth year?

He hasn't filled out, and unlike Watts, Frawley, Garland who you mentioned he has not developed, or at least shown, the slightest desire to get involved in the physical aspects of the contest in what is really still a physically brutal game. How long FCS do you carry an unproductive person in a 21 1/2 man team? He still looks actually scared, as most of US would, when confronted, but we are not highly paid athletes who should, in this game, know and certainly show no fear.

Where does he actually contribute?

Name some memorable (positive) moments in his 59 games? I can honestly think of none. You say players of his size "take some time" - how much more can we afford?

  On 04/07/2011 at 19:18, monoccular said:

He is in what, his fourth year?

He hasn't filled out, and unlike Watts, Frawley, Garland who you mentioned he has not developed, or at least shown, the slightest desire to get involved in the physical aspects of the contest in what is really still a physically brutal game. How long FCS do you carry an unproductive person in a 21 1/2 man team? He still looks actually scared, as most of US would, when confronted, but we are not highly paid athletes who should, in this game, know and certainly show no fear.

Where does he actually contribute?

Name some memorable (positive) moments in his 59 games? I can honestly think of none. You say players of his size "take some time" - how much more can we afford?

People have very short memories.

His first 2 seasons he played over 40 games as a skinny bugger, regularly picking up 25+ possessions and 6+ marks. He showed a great ability to find space, to use his running ability to provide an option when others couldn't. I remember his kicking some very nice goals on the run from 50m out as well

In his first 2 seasons, everybody assumed he's bulk up and improve his physicality, and the only real criticism of him was his overhead marking. Now his overhead marking has improved out-of-sight.

His 3rd season was severely affected by injury.

Now his 4th season, we are all getting impatient (myself excluded), but we should remember that he's still young. While he has taken longer than most to bulk up, he should hit 95kg by the start of next season.

He needs to improve his intent to tackle and apply pressure and his physicality. no doubt. but... not worth writing him off just yet

  On 04/07/2011 at 21:42, sylvinator said:

........

He needs to improve his intent to tackle and apply pressure and his physicality. no doubt. but... not worth writing him off just yet

If he won't get involved in contests in his fourth season, when the hell will he??

You also mention him making space.....I could and probably would...just keep away from all contests!

We deserve to get a high draft pick for him ,although it will hurt to let such a talent go .I'll never forget his crashing through packs ,strong marks ,pinpoint disposal and the general intimidation and aggression he always shows .Love the way he fights his own team to get at the ball .Not like those players that hang off the play a few metres waving their arms around waiting for a cheap receive .

We will miss you Cale .And yes ,I am on drugs (to cope with bi-polar disorder) .The teams-not mine .

10 tackles in 9 games... 'nuff said.

Won't be missed unfortunately. Has not come on. A wasted top 5 pick...

The "lets not get rid of him just yet" argument is ridiculous IMHO.

He is a downhill skier that has shown very little and lacks serious heart.

The concern that he may be worth something in the future is just wishful thinking. More likely he would be better in a developed midfield where he has protection and doesn't have to go hard.

He's not going to suddenly grow a heart. If he has currency then trade him now.

  On 04/07/2011 at 21:42, sylvinator said:

People have very short memories.

His first 2 seasons he played over 40 games as a skinny bugger, regularly picking up 25+ possessions and 6+ marks. He showed a great ability to find space, to use his running ability to provide an option when others couldn't. I remember his kicking some very nice goals on the run from 50m out as well

In his first 2 seasons, everybody assumed he's bulk up and improve his physicality, and the only real criticism of him was his overhead marking. Now his overhead marking has improved out-of-sight.

His 3rd season was severely affected by injury.

Now his 4th season, we are all getting impatient (myself excluded), but we should remember that he's still young. While he has taken longer than most to bulk up, he should hit 95kg by the start of next season.

He needs to improve his intent to tackle and apply pressure and his physicality. no doubt. but... not worth writing him off just yet

Great post, I'm with you 100%.

As for his physicality, I've seen him run back with the flight of the ball to mark or spoil more than any other Melbourne player this year, so I don't think it is a problem.

If it wasn't for the peanuts on the footy show taking footage out of context I don't think that many people would have a problem with him. It seems that no matter what he does now some people want to believe that he is no good and never was.