NFL

[Macca 16,971]

2 minutes ago, layzie said:

Yeah look there have been plenty of deficiencies in the Packers roster over time no doubt about it. I think McCarthy is generally a decent coach but has lost his way over the last few years and there is not a perfect fit right now with him and Rodgers.

And of course you're a big fan. The truth is that when Jimmy G went down I gravitated to this GB team this year. I've have been taking a keen interest and almost barracking for them in the NFC believe it or not. So when they lost to the hated Seahawks I actually felt like a frustrated Packer fan. I rate this roster they got good defensive talent, need a better running game. Get Mike out and the best guy for AR.

 

We really should be known as the 'Green Bay Rodgers' as Rodgers virtually calls the shots ... but the organisation allows McCarthy to allow Rodgers to call the shots.

I am obviously not talking about every play but come crunch time,  it's Rodgers at play.  Which doesn't really work in terms of having a great team.  About 3 or 4 years ago someone here on this thread said the same thing and I didn't argue with them because that poster got it right.  The truth hurt and I couldn't argue.

McCarthy isn't really clueless but he is miles off Belichick.  And he is a SB winning coach so there are points in the bank.  The Packers won't dump him and I don't want him dumped either.  An 'Agreement' can be made however.  If we miss the playoffs (as seems likely) he'll get another year.  That's how I'm seeing it. 

[Dr. Gonzo 24,219]

Steelers Panthers Texans

[Gorgoroth 12,954]

McCarthy is the problem I see, he seems to think that Rodgers will get them out of every hole he gets  them in.

[Macca 16,971]

1 minute ago, Gorgoroth said:

McCarthy is the problem I see, he seems to think that Rodgers will get them out of every hole he gets  them in.

It has been that way for longer than I was prepared to admit previously ... but the Packers won't dump him like what happens in soccer (Leicester/Ranieri springs to mind)

There has to be an air of respect and responsibility attached .. the previous GM's are to blame as well.  It is not just 1 bloke as we found out at the Demons with our coaching.  Others are at fault so a full review and do-over is needed. 

The season isn't quite over but we'll probably have to win-out to have a chance at winning the division.  And that is a tall order,  all things considered.  Lose at Minnesota in week 12 and it is all over.

[Dr. Gonzo 24,219]

@Macca I always thought you were a 49ers fan but sounds like you're a cheesehead?

[Macca 16,971]

2 minutes ago, Dr. Gonzo said:

@Macca I always thought you were a 49ers fan but sounds like you're a cheesehead?

What's a cheesehead?  Not me.

The term is used as an insult by fans of other teams disguised as a term of endearment ... all because a small percentage of Packer fans tried to turn the insult around. 

Don't care for it Gonzo.  And I know the history of it - annoys me.

[layzie 33,805]

2 hours ago, Macca said:

We really should be known as the 'Green Bay Rodgers' as Rodgers virtually calls the shots ... but the organisation allows McCarthy to allow Rodgers to call the shots.

I am obviously not talking about every play but come crunch time,  it's Rodgers at play.  Which doesn't really work in terms of having a great team.  About 3 or 4 years ago someone here on this thread said the same thing and I didn't argue with them because that poster got it right.  The truth hurt and I couldn't argue.

McCarthy isn't really clueless but he is miles off Belichick.  And he is a SB winning coach so there are points in the bank.  The Packers won't dump him and I don't want him dumped either.  An 'Agreement' can be made however.  If we miss the playoffs (as seems likely) he'll get another year.  That's how I'm seeing it. 

Yep and that’s a big thing right now and when you look at a stat sheet it looks like all is ok and Aaron is playing well, which he is. However the devil is in the detail.

Yep, he’s miles off Belichick. Most are but he is not close to the same post code. I do think he can coach but I also think after this amount of time that the same voice can get old. I do think there is some frost between Rodgers and him as well. Holmgren used to get frustrated with Favre but you always got the sense that Favre believed Mike could make him better. Just don’t see it with these two. 

 

[layzie 33,805]

2 hours ago, Macca said:

It has been that way for longer than I was prepared to admit previously ... but the Packers won't dump him like what happens in soccer (Leicester/Ranieri springs to mind)

There has to be an air of respect and responsibility attached .. the previous GM's are to blame as well.  It is not just 1 bloke as we found out at the Demons with our coaching.  Others are at fault so a full review and do-over is needed. 

The season isn't quite over but we'll probably have to win-out to have a chance at winning the division.  And that is a tall order,  all things considered.  Lose at Minnesota in week 12 and it is all over.

Maybe he needs to do a Wenger ?

They would need to review, they should be better. The one thing I’ll say is that the Packers are anything but a dysfunctional organisation in my time. Obviously I missed the 70s and 80s so it could have been then but this is still a premier organisation.

If you want dysfunction look at us! 

[layzie 33,805]

2 hours ago, Macca said:

What's a cheesehead?  Not me.

The term is used as an insult by fans of other teams disguised as a term of endearment ... all because a small percentage of Packer fans tried to turn the insult around. 

Don't care for it Gonzo.  And I know the history of it - annoys me.

I liked the cheesehead! Always thought it was because of the heritage and Wisconsin being the largest producing cheese state in America but I think you’re right about the term being an insult originating in the height of the Bears rivalry.

Remember in the 90s the guy in the plane crash and the cheesehead saved his life? 

[Macca 16,971]

4 minutes ago, layzie said:

Yep and that’s a big thing right now and when you look at a stat sheet it looks like all is ok and Aaron is playing well, which he is. However the devil is in the detail.

Yep, he’s miles off Belichick. Most are but he is not close to the same post code. I do think he can coach but I also think after this amount of time that the same voice can get old. I do think there is some frost between Rodgers and him as well. Holmgren used to get frustrated with Favre but you always got the sense that Favre believed Mike could make him better. Just don’t see it with these two.

I am sure that opposition fans would like nothing better than Green Bay to sack McCarthy with no beg your pardons ... but the cynic in me sees that as a way of destabilising the club.  As an example ... the England supporters got stuck into Mitch Johnson because thay saw him as a threat - but Mitch turned the tables on them and sent the Poms into orbit.

I am not a big wrap for McCarthy but we could end up in a worse situation if we sack him much as the Demons were when we went from Bailey to Neeld.  Who wants that?

I'd rather the Packers do a full review like the Pies,  Tigers & Cats did with Hardwick,  Buckley & Thompson.  It is entirely possible that McCarthy can coach better and that we build a different game-style moving forward.  A shot across the starboard bow might be the tonic. 

Elway used his power to use Peyton in a more effective way and it worked spectacularly ... Rodgers needs to be used as Brady is used by Belichick.  And we need a stellar running game to match the passing game.  It hasn't been the Green Bay way previously but the formula we're using right now just isn't working.

We've got a great QB and to not make the playoffs in that scenario is diabolical.  However,  you don't ever make panic moves.

[DeeSpencer 25,711]

7 hours ago, Gorgoroth said:

A lot of tips against my Rams...

Question for those, is it their offence is better than ours, you think their D will cover our O better especially without Kupp?

Very interested to hear.

 

Me, I think our D is better than theirs, I don’t think KC have a good enough D to get to th3 AFC championship game if they face either Pats or Steelers, but their offence is great. Hunt and Hill are tearing it up, but I would try and limit them as much as you can but clamp down hard on Kelce, I still think he is key. 

If the Rams D steps up to what their individual talents suggest they could I see us winning by 3pts or under. If Rams D plays as it has KC win by 14.

I wouldn't tip the Chiefs because come crunch time the Rams have the smarter head coach. That said, I think right now the Chiefs offense is more explosive which gives them a better chance in a straight out shootout.The counter to that is the Rams can use Gurley to kill the clock and ice it that way.Will be interesting to see if the Rams are impacted by the fires and all the disruption, I wouldn't blame them.

[DeeSpencer 25,711]

Pittsburgh, Houston, Carolina

[Macca 16,971]

1 minute ago, layzie said:

I liked the cheesehead! Always thought it was because of the heritage and Wisconsin being the largest producing cheese state in America but I think you’re right about the term being an insult originating in the height of the Bears rivalry.

Remember in the 90s the guy in the plane crash and the cheesehead saved his life? 

I don't remember that layz but I'll google it some time. 

NFL Nicknames

[titan_uranus 25,020]

Panthers, Titans, Steelers

[layzie 33,805]

1 hour ago, Macca said:

I am sure that opposition fans would like nothing better than Green Bay to sack McCarthy with no beg your pardons ... but the cynic in me sees that as a way of destabilising the club.  As an example ... the England supporters got stuck into Mitch Johnson because thay saw him as a threat - but Mitch turned the tables on them and sent the Poms into orbit.

I am not a big wrap for McCarthy but we could end up in a worse situation if we sack him much as the Demons were when we went from Bailey to Neeld.  Who wants that?

I'd rather the Packers do a full review like the Pies,  Tigers & Cats did with Hardwick,  Buckley & Thompson.  It is entirely possible that McCarthy can coach better and that we build a different game-style moving forward.  A shot across the starboard bow might be the tonic. 

Elway used his power to use Peyton in a more effective way and it worked spectacularly ... Rodgers needs to be used as Brady is used by Belichick.  And we need a stellar running game to match the passing game.  It hasn't been the Green Bay way previously but the formula we're using right now just isn't working.

We've got a great QB and to not make the playoffs in that scenario is diabolical.  However,  you don't ever make panic moves.

Yeah true plus which offensive gurus are out there currently available? 

I would like to throw up a hypothetical though and I’m prepared to get laughed out of the building for it. Jim Harbaugh. 

 

[layzie 33,805]

1 hour ago, Macca said:

I don't remember that layz but I'll google it some time. 

NFL Nicknames

No Dallas in that list? What a joke.

Cheesehead story:

http://www.columbusalive.com/news/20160803/massillon-man-recalls-when-green-bay-packers-cheesehead-saved-his-life

[Macca 16,971]

7 hours ago, layzie said:

No Dallas in that list? What a joke.

Cheesehead story:

http://www.columbusalive.com/news/20160803/massillon-man-recalls-when-green-bay-packers-cheesehead-saved-his-life

Bit lame that story ... but whatever floats your boat

You do know that the clowns at San Fransisco could have easily drafted Rodgers when they were screaming out for a QB ... and he was a local.  Aaron reminds the 49ers whenever he gets a chance.  What could have been hey?

An irrelevant organisation your mob though ... losers.

[Clintosaurus 7,848]

Steelers can get [censored]. So can the referees - only look one way. Almost cheating.

[Macca 16,971]

17 hours ago, layzie said:

Yeah true plus which offensive gurus are out there currently available? 

I would like to throw up a hypothetical though and I’m prepared to get laughed out of the building for it. Jim Harbaugh.

You can have that nutjob ... no thanks

By the way,  a 43/44 W/L record on the road converts to 4 & 4 W/L average road record over a 10 year period. Roundabout.

And if a team is good enough to win 4 games on the road then those teams are generally good enough to win  at least 6 games at home as well

Playoffs or close to playoffs every year for 10 years straight.

Who would pass up on that?

San Fran?

[DeeSpencer 25,711]

20 hours ago, Macca said:

I am sure that opposition fans would like nothing better than Green Bay to sack McCarthy with no beg your pardons ... but the cynic in me sees that as a way of destabilising the club.  As an example ... the England supporters got stuck into Mitch Johnson because thay saw him as a threat - but Mitch turned the tables on them and sent the Poms into orbit.

I am not a big wrap for McCarthy but we could end up in a worse situation if we sack him much as the Demons were when we went from Bailey to Neeld.  Who wants that?

I'd rather the Packers do a full review like the Pies,  Tigers & Cats did with Hardwick,  Buckley & Thompson.  It is entirely possible that McCarthy can coach better and that we build a different game-style moving forward.  A shot across the starboard bow might be the tonic. 

Elway used his power to use Peyton in a more effective way and it worked spectacularly ... Rodgers needs to be used as Brady is used by Belichick.  And we need a stellar running game to match the passing game.  It hasn't been the Green Bay way previously but the formula we're using right now just isn't working.

We've got a great QB and to not make the playoffs in that scenario is diabolical.  However,  you don't ever make panic moves.

Roll the dice and fire him Macca. What's the point in investing 30 million + a year in Rodgers and saddling him with a play caller he doesn't get on with? I've been critical of Rodgers for a long time being amazing at big plays and the scramble drill but lacking the consistent marching drives with high percentage throws. Yeah the TE and WR spots aren't good but there's enough to create some sort of scheme to get guys open.

I'm a big believer in Mike Pettine coaching the D. Mike Daniels is a star. Blake Martinez is a really solid middle line backer. Jaire Alexander is a star. This is a defense that can be sustainable. Not world beaters but good enough. They made Brady look very shaky before the momentum changed with the fumble a few weeks ago. Held the Rams as well. 

Plus aside from that small stretch of slimmer Eddie Lacy the Pack finally have a running back - one that looks adept at getting yards on the ground and in the passing game. 

The easy choice on who to hire - John DeFillipo the Vikings OC. Worked wonders in Philly and doing well with a bad O line at the Vikings. You'd weaken a main division rival and get a very modern offense in.

Lincoln Riley would be a bold choice that could work wonders.

The Packers have the right veterans and organisational culture to make a change and not lose out. Hire an offensive guy and the offense surely can improve. Hire any other quality head coach and the game management can't be worse than some of the things McCarthy has done recently - punting, not throwing a challenge etc.

[Macca 16,971]

2 minutes ago, DeeSpencer said:

Roll the dice and fire him Macca. What's the point in investing 30 million + a year in Rodgers and saddling him with a play caller he doesn't get on with? I've been critical of Rodgers for a long time being amazing at big plays and the scramble drill but lacking the consistent marching drives with high percentage throws. Yeah the TE and WR spots aren't good but there's enough to create some sort of scheme to get guys open.

I'm a big believer in Mike Pettine coaching the D. Mike Daniels is a star. Blake Martinez is a really solid middle line backer. Jaire Alexander is a star. This is a defense that can be sustainable. Not world beaters but good enough. They made Brady look very shaky before the momentum changed with the fumble a few weeks ago. Held the Rams as well. 

Plus aside from that small stretch of slimmer Eddie Lacy the Pack finally have a running back - one that looks adept at getting yards on the ground and in the passing game. 

The easy choice on who to hire - John DeFillipo the Vikings OC. Worked wonders in Philly and doing well with a bad O line at the Vikings. You'd weaken a main division rival and get a very modern offense in.

Lincoln Riley would be a bold choice that could work wonders.

The Packers have the right veterans and organisational culture to make a change and not lose out. Hire an offensive guy and the offense surely can improve. Hire any other quality head coach and the game management can't be worse than some of the things McCarthy has done recently - punting, not throwing a challenge etc.

The issue for me and the organisation is that he won a SB ... if not,  then it would be a far easier parting off the ways.  GB are big on tradition and to say that they are conservative would be understating things. 

If it was me I'd offer a parting handshake deal where McCarthy wasn't put out too much or disenfranchised down the track.  How you do all that is tricky but the organisation does need to go in a different direction so I don't disagree with your thoughts.

As for Jones and the running game,  I'd like to see us build a running game like the Saints have to compliment a top-liner like Brees is.  Ingram & Kamara are staples with some decent back-up.  They combined for 174 yards today yet they have a terrific passing game.  That is the offensive model I want at GB.

The Saints are the team to beat in the NFC.  All-powerful.

And the NFC North is now for the Bears to lose ... Chicago dismantled the Vikes today and you should be able to go on with it from here on in.  I listened to the game and the Vikes could not get going all day - good win. 

Win 4 of your last 6 and the division is yours.  3 of 6 probably does it though.  I can't see the Vikes or GB getting to 10.5 wins so 10 wins should do it.   The +99 points difference tells a story too. 

 

[DeeSpencer 25,711]

1 hour ago, Macca said:

The issue for me and the organisation is that he won a SB ... if not,  then it would be a far easier parting off the ways.  GB are big on tradition and to say that they are conservative would be understating things. 

If it was me I'd offer a parting handshake deal where McCarthy wasn't put out too much or disenfranchised down the track.  How you do all that is tricky but the organisation does need to go in a different direction so I don't disagree with your thoughts.

As for Jones and the running game,  I'd like to see us build a running game like the Saints have to compliment a top-liner like Brees is.  Ingram & Kamara are staples with some decent back-up.  They combined for 174 yards today yet they have a terrific passing game.  That is the offensive model I want at GB.

The Saints are the team to beat in the NFC.  All-powerful.

And the NFC North is now for the Bears to lose ... Chicago dismantled the Vikes today and you should be able to go on with it from here on in.  I listened to the game and the Vikes could not get going all day - good win. 

Win 4 of your last 6 and the division is yours.  3 of 6 probably does it though.  I can't see the Vikes or GB getting to 10.5 wins so 10 wins should do it.   The +99 points difference tells a story too. 

 

I think if you can bump Favre for Rodgers you can probably move McCarthy on! The man is surely set for life financially and in time should be honoured as a SB winning coach. 13 years is a long stretch, it's not like he's been replaced in a hurry.

Today was an unusual game for the Bears. The defense absolutely dominated for a large part and get out to an early 2 TD lead, somewhat similar to the Bears v Packers in round 1. Trubisky made 2 head scratching intercepted throws which he hasn't been doing lately. Then Cohen has a really bad fumble. Just when you think the Vikings should get back in to it they give up some soft penalties. Bears kick a field goal to all but seal it but then let the Vikings drive on them just to keep it interesting.

The Bears biggest issue right now is they have a thunder back - Howard and a lightening back - Cohen but the thunder back can't catch it and the lightening back can't make those down hill yards up the middle. O line isn't helping either, they're good in pass pro but can't get the running game going. If they could run the ball far more efficiently then they could ride out games getting the bare minimum from Trubisky. Right now they can't so they put him in some tricky spots. With Nagy's play calling he'll torch bad defenses but the good ones can adapt. The Vikings defense looked confused for a half today before looking in total control.

Not overly impressed by the point differential, that is overhyped by blowing out Tampa, NY Jets and Buffalo - 3 teams that crapped the bed when faced with our defense. Beat Seattle when their defense was a mess with injuries. Scraped passed the Cardinals. Narrow loss to the NE Pats. Blew a game in Miami.

2-1 in the Division now. A final record of 3 and 3 in the Division wouldn't shock me, a tough back up for the Lions on Thanksgiving won't be easy and then Packers/Vikings down the stretch might depend on where those teams are at. .500 in the division is more of what the Bears are I think. Defense that starts absolutely great but can fade late if the pass rush is worn down or made obsolete by good play calls. Offense that looks great with trickery but where the QB struggles under pressure.

That might be enough to win the NFC North this year due to the Packers malaise and the Viking's O line but it's a long way from the class of the NFC.

[Macca 16,971]

6 minutes ago, DeeSpencer said:

I think if you can bump Favre for Rodgers you can probably move McCarthy on! The man is surely set for life financially and in time should be honoured as a SB winning coach. 13 years is a long stretch, it's not like he's been replaced in a hurry.

Today was an unusual game for the Bears. The defense absolutely dominated for a large part and get out to an early 2 TD lead, somewhat similar to the Bears v Packers in round 1. Trubisky made 2 head scratching intercepted throws which he hasn't been doing lately. Then Cohen has a really bad fumble. Just when you think the Vikings should get back in to it they give up some soft penalties. Bears kick a field goal to all but seal it but then let the Vikings drive on them just to keep it interesting.

The Bears biggest issue right now is they have a thunder back - Howard and a lightening back - Cohen but the thunder back can't catch it and the lightening back can't make those down hill yards up the middle. O line isn't helping either, they're good in pass pro but can't get the running game going. If they could run the ball far more efficiently then they could ride out games getting the bare minimum from Trubisky. Right now they can't so they put him in some tricky spots. With Nagy's play calling he'll torch bad defenses but the good ones can adapt. The Vikings defense looked confused for a half today before looking in total control.

Not overly impressed by the point differential, that is overhyped by blowing out Tampa, NY Jets and Buffalo - 3 teams that crapped the bed when faced with our defense. Beat Seattle when their defense was a mess with injuries. Scraped passed the Cardinals. Narrow loss to the NE Pats. Blew a game in Miami.

2-1 in the Division now. A final record of 3 and 3 in the Division wouldn't shock me, a tough back up for the Lions on Thanksgiving won't be easy and then Packers/Vikings down the stretch might depend on where those teams are at. .500 in the division is more of what the Bears are I think. Defense that starts absolutely great but can fade late if the pass rush is worn down or made obsolete by good play calls. Offense that looks great with trickery but where the QB struggles under pressure.

That might be enough to win the NFC North this year due to the Packers malaise and the Viking's O line but it's a long way from the class of the NFC.

Yeah you're not really a threat for the NFC title but you're a real chance  for the 3 seed with the NFC East being a bit of a lottery.  The 3 seed gets you a home final and that might mean a win and another game in week 2 of the playoffs.  And in the playoffs sometimes everything can go well or go badly.  1 interception is often magnified in big games.  It's that kind of sport.

I'm talking in this fashion because the Vikes & Packers are both not playing very well at all and neither team looks like it either.  Both have been very disappointing where as the Bears have worked their way into a 7 & 3 position by doing a lot of the basics well.  Nothing spectacular but the wins have come.

I'd be reasonably confident of some January football if I was a Bears fan (god forbid)

[layzie 33,805]

15 hours ago, Macca said:

Bit lame that story ... but whatever floats your boat

You do know that the clowns at San Fransisco could have easily drafted Rodgers when they were screaming out for a QB ... and he was a local.  Aaron reminds the 49ers whenever he gets a chance.  What could have been hey?

An irrelevant organisation your mob though ... losers.

The cheesehead saved his life! Never has a stupid piece of foam been so important.

Oh ouch Macca, just ouch! 

Edited November 19, 2018 by layzie

[layzie 33,805]

5 hours ago, Macca said:

You can have that nutjob ... no thanks

By the way,  a 43/44 W/L record on the road converts to 4 & 4 W/L average road record over a 10 year period. Roundabout.

And if a team is good enough to win 4 games on the road then those teams are generally good enough to win  at least 6 games at home as well

Playoffs or close to playoffs every year for 10 years straight.

Who would pass up on that?

San Fran?

Really? We’re doing his again are we?

A 50-50 road record is nothing to sneeze at, but when we talk about the guy being one of the best ever I expect a bit better than average and I’d expect a few more wins in games like those on the road. 

I’d also be expecting GB to make the playoffs often with a QB like Rodgers. So it’s not really surprising.