If your talking about leaders I'd rather have Johnathon Brown @ our club. Both the others are superstars, But, neither are Loved by the players, IMO. They're liked & admired by there peers, but maybe not loved.

Give me a J Brown or Kirk or Hayes, elitist leaders I think lead with players in spite of them, rather than for the love and admiration & respect of them.

Those elite players should be just elite players rather than captains.

Just as IMO Hayes should be captain of the Saints or Goddard, someone who's in the trenches at ground level.

*BUMP*

Anyone want to change their mind from last year ?

At time of bump it was 47-20 Gazza's way.

I think Juddy is the most complete player I have ever seen, I think he will win a third brownlow this year. He must already have 12+ votes as he would have polled in 5 of the first 6 rounds with three shoe in BOGS and one other likely. I put $100 on at $9.50 and barring injury, I expect I will win. I think he is the best player in the competition.

*BUMP*

Anyone want to change their mind from last year ?

At time of bump it was 47-20 Gazza's way.

Fair Bump.

Judd may poke at the ball at times when kicking but he is a generational superstar. His ability to impact and influence a game off his own effort is outstanding. Thats not to take anything away from Ablett who is one of the best of his era. But Judd is like having 4 extra players when he is on. And he is the first tagged by a mile at CFC. At Geelong, Ablett is the best of great midfield of Bartel, Chapman, Corey and Selwood.

By many posters assessment, Judd was a shadow of his past WCE era in 2010 and still won the B'low. How good is he?

Judd is a shadow of the player he was at West Coast.

Post how can you say this?? he has won every B&F for the club and a brownlow and has got them to the finals.. He is a champion player and his performance on the weekend was propably his best yet..

Judd is a shadow of the player he was at West Coast.

You obviously did not see his game last Friday.

One of the Greatest games by a Captain i have ever watched...He is still a dead set Champ. So is Ablett Junior, it's mighty close. As both stand up in tackles.

Toss of the coin Truly. B)

Judd.

I remember watching him in the 2005 grand Final and thinking ... "this bloke is on another planet". Same sort of reaction I have now when I watch Messi at Barcelona, or Usain Bolt blow past the best sprinters in the world.

Once he lost that turbo jet speed at the end of 2007 he came back to the field. But for those couple of years he was in his prime, Judd was untouchable.

You obviously did not see his game last Friday.

One of the Greatest games by a Captain i have ever watched...He is still a dead set Champ. So is Ablett Junior, it's mighty close. As both stand up in tackles.

Toss of the coin Truly. B)

CB wrote his comment in July 2010, so it is very obvious he hadn't seen last Friday's game when he posted his comment

CB wrote his comment in July 2010, so it is very obvious he hadn't seen last Friday's game when he posted his comment

What a classic A Bumped thread, didn't notice i am so sorry.

Still say last Friday night was just purely superb!!!

What a classic A Bumped thread

I've done the same sort of thing

Still say last Friday night was just purely superb!!!

Absolutely.

I'd still take Ablett. While that quarter was scintillating, I honestly think Ablett really offers more around the ground, can crack a contest open more than Judd can and such. I also find some of Judd's kicking oddly suspect for a player of his calibre. Don't know why that is, but just is =/

I'd still take Ablett. While that quarter was scintillating, I honestly think Ablett really offers more around the ground, can crack a contest open more than Judd can and such. I also find some of Judd's kicking oddly suspect for a player of his calibre. Don't know why that is, but just is =/

Judd gets into busier packs i reckon, line ball busier but busier!!! Gary seems to run the Flanks a little more...so has that millisecond longer to Balance.

*BUMP*

Anyone want to change their mind from last year ?

At time of bump it was 47-20 Gazza's way.

Irellevant.

If Garry was at another club pushing for top 4, he would be going like his life depended on it.

Neither as i would pick Ian Stewart

Neither as i would pick Ian Stewart

Really...He was that good...I remember him winning the 71 Brownlow but i can't remember seeing him play live.

Irellevant.

If Garry was at another club pushing for top 4, he would be going like his life depended on it.

It wasn't that long ago, that Judd started his career at Carlton. And Carlton were no where near "pushing for top 4".....

Poor argument.

Fair Bump.

Judd may poke at the ball at times when kicking but he is a generational superstar. His ability to impact and influence a game off his own effort is outstanding. Thats not to take anything away from Ablett who is one of the best of his era. But Judd is like having 4 extra players when he is on. And he is the first tagged by a mile at CFC. At Geelong, Ablett is the best of great midfield of Bartel, Chapman, Corey and Selwood.

By many posters assessment, Judd was a shadow of his past WCE era in 2010 and still won the B'low. How good is he?

Judd - and can't add anymore to this.

How good was he Friday night.

I'll stick with Judd. He was a Dees supporter after all!

Without the bias I still say Judd. Geelong's midfield has much more depth than West Coast's when they played off in GF's which is of greater benefit to Ablett.

IMO players like Selwood for example take a fair bit of pressure off by getting in for the hard balls at stoppages where Judd ALWAYS seems to be the one that has to instigate this, especially so at Carlton as they have many more midfielders that play the outside and kick. Ablett certainly wins his share of his OWN ball but he gets a lot of help in this area.

There have been a few games this year (V Melbourne for one) where Judd has taken Carlton to victory, I think it was in Adelaide his first game back after suspension and he took that side to another level.

If Ablett goes to Gold Coast I'm not so sure he could do this. There is some suggestion here that Judd is past is best, he does seem to get agitated more often, simply because of what I outlined above. I see that similar to a big CHF like Brereton & Carey, his body has taken a heap of punishment and some of that is taking a toll.

Both champions, for mine Judd is a superstar.

*BUMP*

Anyone want to change their mind from last year ?

At time of bump it was 47-20 Gazza's way.

Nice bump HT.

I'm more than comfortable with my thoughts from nearly a year ago.

Judd is a superstar.

Neither. Would rather Bartel, Hodge, Selwood, hayes any day

Really hard to choose, but will go with Judd.

Judd is probably the best midfielder I have ever seen, with stiff competition from Leigh Matthews, Michael Voss, James Hird , Tim Watson, Robert Harvey and Gary Ablett jnr.

.

Really hard to choose, but will go with Judd.

Judd is probably the best midfielder I have ever seen, with stiff competition from Leigh Matthews, Michael Voss, James Hird , Tim Watson, Robert Harvey and Gary Ablett jnr.

WOuld you put Nathan Buckley in that same group ? I would.

WOuld you put Nathan Buckley in that same group ? I would.

Greg Williams anyone? Paul Kelly?

Would you put Nathan Buckley in that same group ? I would.

Not quite. Don't get me wrong, Buckley was a gun but he lacked an important quality:

He was rarely creative. He did the regular things better than most and was strong in every skill area but he rarely produced those magic, creative things of Hird, Matthews or Judd.

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