yep I think Frawey or Garland will get Medhurst with Rivers or Carroll to play.

yep I think Frawey or Garland will get Medhurst with Rivers or Carroll to play.

Gee, I loved to know the story on Newton....surprised his name isn't in the team !!!!!

I was talking about Whelan.

I agree with you re: Bell, though

sorry that's just my bad re forgeting to remove quoted text.

We're gonna get spanked.

Whoever wrote the names of these players in the positions is on something. But we have no backline, and yes i know Junior played on Rioli, but come on! No small defenders of note, Rivers named on the bench. Even then if he plays, that's 4 tall defenders. No Davey, No big body to win the forwardline duels in Holland. Excited to see Sylvia up forward with Dunn and Bate, and i'll be curious to see how Johnson goes.

But hate to say it, i don't think it'll be a good day for us

I would like Bailey to tell C.J and Bode that they have 3 games in a row.

hopefully getting there nerves about being dropped out the door.

If they play well keep them. if they play as bad as normal, drop them after the 3 and never re-select.

Its time to see if these boys can play. I find it frustrating to see them in, out, in, out.

Buckley should have stayed.

Yze and Holland should not play.

Clearly Newton must have attitude problems, the coaches seem not to like him.

We're gonna get spanked.

But hate to say it, i don't think it'll be a good day for us

Agree. I can handle getting thrashed by other teams for the sake of 'development' but it really sticks in my craw that we'll be doing well to lose to the filth by less than 10 goals.

I don't believe Bailey has a game plan, players are always playing different roles, how can you put a game plan into effect if the players are constantly changing around, players are in and out of the side like yo yo's. i think we should put all our players in the back line and run like fark when we move forward to open space, atleast we wouldn't get belted with this gameplan

This is the worst side weve had all year and that is saying something. If Collingwood can't beat us by over 100 points there is something wrong with them. Holland still can't get a game so we have to rely on Miller and P.J to kick us a winning score well good luck they are going to need it. Bartram and Frawley continue to play after performing poorly every week and Valenti and Whelan can't get a game. What the hell is going on Bailey? it's hard to believe but your team selections are getting worse.

Surely Bartram will be retained to play a tagging role on Heath Shaw? He starts all of Collingwoods attacks with his drive, and I went to the Collingwood-West Coast game last week (call it forward scouting), and Wet Toast played Selwood on Shaw as a forward-pocket tagger, kept him to 4 posessions in the first 3 qtrs before being shifted down back to his more natural position. While it didnt affect the result, it made the Pies clearances from their defensive half more unorthodox than normal.

You'd think we'd learn after last weeks debacle in the first half of Gram and Fisher roaming free that dominant attacking half-back flankers need to be accounted for. Bartram had a go for a short while last week, but it was too late, the Saints defenders already had a full head of steam up.

So no Davey, Valenti, Holland, Whelan or Newton = easily our worst side on paper for the year. Lucky for us Weetra wasnt picked as well.

Surely Bartram will be retained to play a tagging role on Heath Shaw? He starts all of Collingwoods attacks with his drive, and I went to the Collingwood-West Coast game last week (call it forward scouting), and Wet Toast played Selwood on Shaw as a forward-pocket tagger, kept him to 4 posessions in the first 3 qtrs before being shifted down back to his more natural position. While it didnt affect the result, it made the Pies clearances from their defensive half more unorthodox than normal.

You'd think we'd learn after last weeks debacle in the first half of Gram and Fisher roaming free that dominant attacking half-back flankers need to be accounted for. Bartram had a go for a short while last week, but it was too late, the Saints defenders already had a full head of steam up.

I once suggested Daniel Bell for that role of 'negating half-forward' here, and was laregly shut down by the majority of posters, who felt it was an unneccessary role. I agree that Shaw, and players of his type in modern-footy (with attacks being launched off HB more than ever), need to be shut down. Would certainly have been a handy ploy last week with Gram and Fisher doing as they pleased off HB and thru the corridor. FWIW i think Bell would be more suited to the HF flank-tag-role than Bartram-- as he has the size, a better mark and more reliable skills-- to make himself dangerous the other way. But he is not in the side, so Bartram would probably be best bet for that role. I'm not surprised that Bell was dropped, but Bartram has to be on thin ice too after recent performances (apart from his good game on McLeod).

PJ could very well go back onto Rocca

PJ could very well go back onto Rocca

I've thought the same thing a couple of times this week, and with Ben Holland not named in the squad, it now seems more likely. Bar Ben Holland, PJ is physically our best defensive option for Rocca. Warnock/Rivers/Garland are nowehere near strong enough, and Carroll doesn't have the height to compete overhead.

Having said that, PJ was one of the first named by DB to be given an opportunity in the forward half in his press-conference. Although i suppose you cant believe everything AFL coaches say in the press.

Rivers must play forward. PJ too rest there when not rucking.

Bell has been awful people, get over it.

No Newton, hmmm. Whelan - gone.

Rivers must play forward. PJ too rest there when not rucking.

I'm not competely against the idea, and if we're gonna try radical things, 2008 is the time to do it.

But Rivers has never shown any real promise as a forward, played all his junior footy down back, and would be "robbing Peter to pay Paul" so to speak, as he is too important and too good in his role in the back half, to be played in the forward half as a mediocre forward.

I've thought the same thing a couple of times this week, and with Ben Holland not named in the squad, it now seems more likely. Bar Ben Holland, PJ is physically our best defensive option for Rocca. Warnock/Rivers/Garland are nowehere near strong enough, and Carroll doesn't have the height to compete overhead.

Having said that, PJ was one of the first named by DB to be given an opportunity in the forward half in his press-conference. Although i suppose you cant believe everything AFL coaches say in the press.

People keep saying that Benny is our best option on Rocca, but he's only beaten him once to my knowledge and that was in the same game last year when Rocca played on only one leg. Benny is far too slow and immobile to play in defence any more. His biggest weapon (besides his heart) is his contested marking. His only position now is in the forward fifty.- still he's not picked so it's irrelevant, and so for that matter is Rocca, who the Pies no longer rely on.

I think the days of the big bodies KPP are nearly over, flexibility and endurance are the key. Blokes like Bate, Morton, Dunn etc are the future. Carlton have the best forward in the league and aren't in the eight. The Swans have been playing better without Barry Hall in the side. Hawthorn have Franklin and Roughhead, but they move up and down the the ground and the Bulldogs CHF is Robert Murphy. Geelong have the likes of Mooney and Hawkins, but they'd be far more worried about losing either of Chapman and Ablett. Brisbane etc...

I once suggested Daniel Bell for that role of 'negating half-forward' here, and was laregly shut down by the majority of posters, who felt it was an unneccessary role. I agree that Shaw, and players of his type in modern-footy (with attacks being launched off HB more than ever), need to be shut down. Would certainly have been a handy ploy last week with Gram and Fisher doing as they pleased off HB and thru the corridor. FWIW i think Bell would be more suited to the HF flank-tag-role than Bartram-- as he has the size, a better mark and more reliable skills-- to make himself dangerous the other way. But he is not in the side, so Bartram would probably be best bet for that role. I'm not surprised that Bell was dropped, but Bartram has to be on thin ice too after recent performances (apart from his good game on McLeod).

Although terrible for my dream team side, Heath Shaw has shown tightly checked, he doesn't get the footy. Perhaps Dunn is the best option. Has had quite a few run with roles in the middle and has also had the experience of playing up forward, which adds the potential of hurting Shaw the other way.

Although terrible for my dream team side, Heath Shaw has shown tightly checked, he doesn't get the footy. Perhaps Dunn is the best option. Has had quite a few run with roles in the middle and has also had the experience of playing up forward, which adds the potential of hurting Shaw the other way.

I like it. Dangerous up forward, but can play defensively too... Would be hard for Shaw to match him in the air... And if we send the ball into the forward line like we did against the Saints Shaw will get 40 posessions unless we play tight on him...

Although terrible for my dream team side, Heath Shaw has shown tightly checked, he doesn't get the footy. Perhaps Dunn is the best option. Has had quite a few run with roles in the middle and has also had the experience of playing up forward, which adds the potential of hurting Shaw the other way.

Now that i think about, is probably the most likely reason Dunn was not dropped this week. He hardly did enough to warrant automatic selection IMO, for reasons other than match-ups.

People keep saying that Benny is our best option on Rocca, but he's only beaten him once to my knowledge and that was in the same game last year when Rocca played on only one leg. Benny is far too slow and immobile to play in defence any more. His biggest weapon (besides his heart) is his contested marking. His only position now is in the forward fifty.- still he's not picked so it's irrelevant, and so for that matter is Rocca, who the Pies no longer rely on.

I agree wholeheartedly. The days of Ben Holland playing on the gorrilla's down back are over. The rest of his season should be about fast-tracking our young KPP's as much as possible. However, i thought selection may have had other ideas as there is still no-one else on our list who could physcially match Rocca one-on-one strength-wise, other than PJ, who Bailey has named as a possible full-time forward this week.

Gee, I loved to know the story on Newton....surprised his name isn't in the team !!!!!

Newton hasn't played for about a month now so probably needs some game time. Hopefully he lines up for Casey, opps, I mean Sandy this week.

People keep saying that Benny is our best option on Rocca, but he's only beaten him once to my knowledge and that was in the same game last year when Rocca played on only one leg. Benny is far too slow and immobile to play in defence any more. His biggest weapon (besides his heart) is his contested marking. His only position now is in the forward fifty.- still he's not picked so it's irrelevant, and so for that matter is Rocca, who the Pies no longer rely on.

I think the days of the big bodies KPP are nearly over, flexibility and endurance are the key. Blokes like Bate, Morton, Dunn etc are the future. Carlton have the best forward in the league and aren't in the eight. The Swans have been playing better without Barry Hall in the side. Hawthorn have Franklin and Roughhead, but they move up and down the the ground and the Bulldogs CHF is Robert Murphy. Geelong have the likes of Mooney and Hawkins, but they'd be far more worried about losing either of Chapman and Ablett. Brisbane etc...

The days of big bodied forwards are NOT over.

Jonathan Brown, Travis Cloke, Pavlich, as well as Hawkins, Lynch (although not nearly the standard of the others mentioned) are all 100+ kilograms

The days of big bodied forwards are NOT over.

Jonathan Brown, Travis Cloke, Pavlich, as well as Hawkins, Lynch (although not nearly the standard of the others mentioned) are all 100+ kilograms

True.

But one thing that Brown, Cloke and Pavlich, and Richo, have that sets them apart from the big forwards the game's seen in the past, and what makes them great now, is they are athletic, have big motors and are willing to run and present up the ground all day, and push back towards goal just as hard. Key position defenders at AFL level, more than ever, need athleticism and endurance over bulk. Gorrilla FB's like Ben Holland are a thing of the past, because gorilla forwards like Rocca and Q.Lynch are becoming rarer and rarer...

Just to help those who haven't seen it.

Collingwood

B: Heath Shaw, Shane Wakelin, Tarkyn Lockyer

HB: Martin Clarke, Nathan Brown, Heritier O’Brien

C: Scott Pendelbury, Scott Burns, Rhyce Shaw

HF: Leon Davis, Shane O’Bree, Travis Cloke

F: Alan Didak, Anthony Rocca, Paul Medhurst

Foll: Josh Fraser, Dane Swan, Dale Thomas

Int (from): Nick Maxwell, Shannon Cox, Ben Reid, Sharrod Wellingham, Ben Johnson, Ryan Cook, Chris Bryan

In: Ryan Cook, Ben Reid, Anthony Rocca

Out: -

Milestone: Leon Davis (150 games)

Melbourne Squad

Backline: J.McDonald, C.Garland, J.Frawley

Half Backs: B.Green, M.Warnock, P.Wheatley

Centreline: C.Morton, B.McLean, C.Bruce

Half forwards: M.Bate, B.Miller, L.Dunn

Forwards: P.Johnson, C.Sylvia, A.Wonaeamirri

Followers: J.White, B.Moloney, N.Jones

Interchange from: C.Bartram, J.Bode, N.Carroll, M.Jamar, C.Johnson, J.Rivers, A.Yze

Team Changes

In: J.Bode, N.Carroll, M.Jamar, C.Johnson, J.Rivers,

Out: R.Robertson (injured) , D.Bell, S.Buckley ( omitted)

Hoping the side lines up as this.

Bartram Warnock Rivers

Wheatley Garland Mcdonald

Morton Jones Green

Bate Miller Bruce

Johnson Sylvia Wonaeamirri

White Mclean Mcdonald

Yze CJ Moloney Jamar

So final ins: CJ, Jamar, Morton, Rivers

Final outs: Robbo (inj), Dunn, Frawley, Bell

Bartram to not let Medhurst get a touch.

Warnock to take Rocca.

Garland to take Cloke.

Wheatley to take Didak and make him accountable the other way.

Mcdonald to shut down Davis.

CJ to stop Daisy, big job, only something I want.

Rivers to spend his day playing his zone and helping out as much as possible.

Although terrible for my dream team side, Heath Shaw has shown tightly checked, he doesn't get the footy. Perhaps Dunn is the best option. Has had quite a few run with roles in the middle and has also had the experience of playing up forward, which adds the potential of hurting Shaw the other way.

Good idea: considering Dunn isn't even on the bench (which I guess means he's most likely going to play), maybe he's gonna run with Shaw. Hopefully fast enough, definitely should be strong enough. I originally thought Bartram to Shaw, but maybe Bartram will run with Thomas.