btdemon

Because it was one of those capitulations that only happen when there is something wrong with the players. Like the 186 against Geelong. I'm not saying that we won't get badly beaten again but after half time it was evident that the players just didn't know how to stop the onslaught and lacked the emotional energy.

Pretty spot on i reckon. Hopefully the "new culture" will see us setting our own media agenda in the future.

FWIW I tink we will get a shellacking next week and possibly a couple more this season, but we won't play as badly as we did in the 2nd half on Saturday again.

Maybe, just maybe, in the context of Jimmy's death, it was more important for the club to feel it and acknowledge it properly, and possibly lose as a consequence than shield the players. In the History of the club and minds of everyone involved, the loss will pale into insignificance compared to what they learn from it. It is about where we go from here that will be important.

I agree.

Like everyone else here I have experienced the bleakest time (football wise), in the last few days. Like most melbourne supporters I am so used to disappointment and sub-par performance that I could see another disastrous season ahead and bemoan our inability to draft the best players. It's important to keep it in perspective. We support a club that has had a traumatic decade. Tragedy, near bankruptcy, a divided board and administration, two dramatic coach sackings, and a player awaiting the results of a court hearing. This has culminated in the passing and funeral of it's shining light and saviour in the last week. To think that this would not have an impact on the performance this week is unrealistic. I would also say that looking at the recent culture of the cub in the last decade it has displayed ridiculously inconsistent form, and dare I say it, a soft mental attitude. there is evidence that the players have thought that they were better than they are. The culture needed to be turned around. I like many, am not sure whether Neeld's hard-arsed approach will turn achieve it or kill the spirit of the players but I have to hope we are on the right track. I have read much of the wailing and gnashing of teeth on this site and admit that I also indulge in it. We Demon supporters are now so reactive and willing to see a catastrophy at every turn. If we bury ourselves in this site and whip each other into a negative frenzy it can have a multiplying effect and be very bad for our mental health. These articles may help explain what happened on Saturday and what is happening at the club. http://www.heraldsun...q-1226315845268 http://www.theage.co...0401-1w6nl.html http://www.theage.co...0331-1w5ii.html http://www.theage.co...0331-1w5cs.html http://www.theage.co...0401-1w6jc.html http://www.theage.co...0331-1w5kr.html http://www.heraldsun...f-1226315687415 As much as the coach and the players say that Jimmy's passing was no excuse, its obvious that it had an enormous impact on the preparation and the performance. Malthouse's comments were very revealing. It shows how important the control of the emotional energy levels is when leading into a game. What I saw after half time on Saturday was a tired team who couldn't respond with any team cohesion. We saw players who are normally smart, like Frawley, do dumb stuff. Jamar had a rough day and his taps went to Lions players a lot of the time. Our mids were pushed around and outsmarted. Players who couldn't do anything constructive to turn things around. Along with us, they watched the train-wreck happen in front of them. I trust that there will be accountability at the selection table and Neeld's comments suggest this. Davey is completely bereft of confidence and zip. We know that he doesn't like the physical contest. That has never been his value, but he is obviously injured and does not know what to do. He need to get himself right and fight his way back into the team. The boundary hugging, long-bombing game looked particularly bad as players lacked the confidence and energy to convert it any sort of smart creative attack. Jade Rawlings commented on this so hopefully the game-plan is not to play the boundary like robots and then bomb it in to the dead pocket. I would like to think that Saturday's performance was due to the recent trauma and the adjustment to a new approach. I believe (hope) that our effort will improve next week and that we will "trend upwards" as the year progresses.

I don't think he does know it. And there lies the problem. Aker has a very skewed perception Yes, everyone has an ego and is motivated by self-interest at times but some people recognise that in themselves. They keep that instinct in check and work towards a common good most of the time. Aker doesn't appear to get this. Maybe it is why he alienated himself the other players at two different clubs.

I like your attitude and agree. The people in place at the club now, from the top down, are there to see it become a successful power again. This is not easy and culture won't change overnight.

The thing that has struck me in all of our NAB Cup games is the preoccupation with defending space is making our players much more conscious of the opposition and less inclined to create our own play. In the games that we looked good in the last two years (albeit usually against inferior sides), we had a free-flowing, creative, attacking style, where we used the corridor. Neeld observed that we were a good attacking side but crap when the opposition had the ball. We all saw players like Sylvia, Davey etc. fail to apply defensive pressure and bemoaned our lack of mental toughness. Hopefully they will begin to blend the two together. Solid, tough, relentless defence, and free flowing attack when the opportunity presents itself. You can see that players are not playing on instinct and have not internalised the new program yet. I certainly hope that there is more to the Neeld game plan than "boundary hugging". It's very predictable and almost as horrible to watch as the Ross Lyon style. Already the good teams like Hawthorn have added new dimensions. Of course they have brilliant kicking skills that we don't. It does highlight the need to get Blease, Strauss and Tappy back into the squad. Grimes, although not super accurate by foot, is handy because he runs and breaks the lines. On another note I think we really missed Green and Petterd on Saturday.

I agree wholeheartedly. This incident has captured the imagination of many. I, for one, feel devastated. I remember teasing my wife because she seemed to take it personally when Princess Diana was killed. I kept telling her that she shouldn't feel like that for someone she didn't know. in effect, a celebrity. She explained that the whole Princess Diana saga represented a "bigger truth", especially to women. I still don't quite understand it. However, I do somehow feel the same about this situation. Liam Jurrah represented many things to many people. He is one of the most gifted and exciting players I have ever seen. I regarded him as the biggest footballing jewell in the Demon crown, the reason many of us went to games. But his story means much more than that. His journey from Yuendemu has been well documented but this situation highlights just how remarkable a journey it has been. His dignity and determination have been an inspiration to many. The events of the past few days are tragic for so many reasons and bring in to focus the intractable and complex problems facing indigenous communities that are so marginalised and just so different from the world we live in. If there is any good to come out of this it might be the insights gained by the broader community. Liam's future seems so clouded. Like all of us, I don't know if he is guilty or innocent but either way it is difficult to imagine him being able to live a happy life from this point. I certainly fear for his mental and emotional health. He will live in exile and in "limbo" until the legal process is complete. The pressure he is under must be unbearable, from the media, his friends and community, the football club, and from all of us who may have the best intentions at heart. To a person with such dignity and such a burden of responsibility, the impact of such a loss of reputation is hard to contemplate. When Bruce Hearn-McKinnon referred to this as being "Shakespearian", I think he was talking about the feud between the clans. The way things are panning out, I fear that it may have all of the elements of a Shakespearian tragedy. Let's hope not.

Everyone on this site and beyond needs to listen to this!

Reported in the HS this morning that it is "bereavement leave". I can't help thinking that anti-aboriginal stereotyping is so close to the surface in our society. It makes me very sad. The sentiments expressed on this site are often thinly masked as in some other supposedly logical argument.

Yep. Davey seems to be everyone's new whipping boy (after Morton), but last night it was evident how important his creativity and skill was compared to just hacking it forward. Another thing that need addressing is, apart from Tapscott and Strauss, most of our defenders have flawed kicking actions which require everything to go right for them. Bartram, Rivers, Grimes, McDonald, Macdonald, Garland, Bennell and even Frawley all lack penetration and accuracy with their kicking. Frawley makes up for it by breaking the lines and balancing himself. We are desperate for some laser-like kicks.

I agree with this big time. It's very obvious that we haven't had a silky midfielder for a long time and while we have some grunt atm we need the class package to really complete the picture. Think Judd, Burgoyne, Ablett, Kerr, Cousins, Pendlebury, Goodes etc. These players create so many opportunities through their ability to extract the ball from stoppages and then use it brilliantly. Trengove may get their but won't do it with that explosive style. Maybe more like a Black, Hayes or Bartel. Sylvia has many of the attributes but doesn't do it consistently.

The ineptitude the Dees showed tonight, especially against the Lions, may be a result of them desperately trying to stick to the new 'structures' implemented by Neeld. There was very little flow, attack and the boundary hugging game was horrible. Neeld has made it very clear that he will pick the team for round 1 on the evidence he sees in the NAB games. Players could well be constricted by a fear of stuffing up and not pleasing the new coach. He has made it very clear what he requires and this may well be weighing heavily on the minds of some of the guys. Few players did the 'natural' things tonight. It will come, hopefully, when they are more familiar with the different structures. It was interesting to see how often they just tried to belt the ball forward with little system. Maybe they were instructed to because it was wet. Brisbane, in contrast, were relatively 'surgical' in their ball movement.

I often use this as a method of getting back to sleep in the middle of the night, name my best 22 in the old fashioned way, ie."from the backline", "League Teams" style. It's quite effective and I'm often asleep before I've sorted out the forwards or the interchange bench. Some players, like Frawley, Jamar, Clark etc., pick themselves in their positions. Others are more difficult. There are others who I think "how could I possibly leave him out?", like Jordie McKenzie, Petterd etc. Even Green! They're are too good to omit, but for example, how do I fit Jurrah, Watts, Howe, Clark, Petterd, Green, Martin and Davey all into the same forward six. Or How do I fit Trengove, Jones, Gysberts, Bail, Moloney, Mckenzie, Bate and Sylvia all into the midfield. Or how do fit Frawley, Garland, Rivers, Grimes, Tappy, Bail, Bartram, Bennell all in the back six. In my mind all of these players are certain starters, but so far that's already 23 players. I haven't been able to fit in the next tier, who I think will all play important roles when injuries occur. They are Blease, T McDonald, J MacDonald, Dunne, Jetta, Nicholson (I know he is still on the rookie list but I suspect he may climb into the group above), Sellar and Strauss. Then there is the development group, some of whom may demand a game, and some who are probably still a way off. Davis, Cook, Tynan and Taggart. Then we have the rookies and unknown quantities. Magner, Couch, Evans, Lawrence, Williams and Sheahan. The whole picture is very good and makes the "best 22" or "Round 1 22" really almost impossible to pick. One would think that training track and NAB Cup form will throw up a couple of surprises and that the pressure on the players to keep their spots will be better than ever. It's a very healthy situation, both for the Dees and for my sleep patterns.

It wasn't Davey's decision to go into the midfield, it was ND and then Bailey, who incidentally, stated in '08 that he wished he had "three or four Aaron Daveys". His lack of tank is not his fault. As you can see by all of the reports about pre-season training, it is tightly controlled by the fitness staff. They determine, to a large extent, the fitness profile of the player.

When I saw the OP I wondered whether they had been in to the change rooms.

I agree totally with this. JT looks fantastic, but Beamer deserves it now. He turns 28 in January. This would give him a likely 2-3 yrs in the job. This time-frame would leave JT absolutely ripe for it in 2014. It would give him time to develop as a footballer, and as he stated in the article, "We'll just see what happens. Not all leaders have to be in the leadership group." - What a fantastic attitude! He is an obvious future captain, but right now we a blessed with many future leaders. The obvious ones are JT, Watts, Grimes, Chip, Jones, Jordie McK, Tappy and even the big Russian. If we look to the best team of the modern era, Geelong, we see 4 or 5 players who could be captain. That's one of the reasons they have dominated recent history, their ability to adapt their tactics and overcome teams that might have the wood on them early in the game. This takes great on-field leadership and a core of strong, smart players. Geelong had a really good captain in Tom Harley. Ling had to wait his turn. He only got two years but did a great job. It is assumed that Selwood will be next, but we can see that Bartel, Taylor, Corey or Enright could all do the job if they had to. Beamer deserves it now. Having a number of burgeoning leaders is a great thing but we don't need to rush JT in to the job. These guys will be the core of the team over the next few years and hopefully they will be the players who will steer us through a successful era. Others will emerge as well.

Actually, I think he looks a bit Todd Viney. Very fierce at the ball and the player. Unfortunately, on the limited amount of vision available, his kicking action looks a bit that way as well. Hopefully they are addressing this now!

I agree with you totally WJ. I am very wary when people begin with the sentence, "I'm not racist, but......" The long history of antipathy towards our own indigenous people is deeply ingrained in the culture. It will take a long re-education and and openness of heart for it to dissipate. Hopefully in time it will be no more than a trace-element in our national psyche. As Pauline Hanson and John Howard discovered to their electoral benefit, it's very easy to pick the scab, and having done that, there are many out there who can't resist the scratching. Anti-aboriginal sentiment is still out there and still has it's own momentum. It's not difficult to find anti-semitism either. Both of these racist sentiments have a long history. For the record, I do sip cafe latte, chardonnay, and could be described by those wishing to give vent to their racist feelings, as a bleeding-heart lefty and a prisoner of political correctness. I do, on the other hand, also very much enjoy tea, beer, shiraz, pinot noir, water and have been known to make jokes which are not "PC". It's easier for those who like to make racial generalisations to also generalise about those who might take issue with their statements, by labelling them with such pejorative terms as "politically correct". Maybe "political correctness" had very noble beginnings. The term has been hijacked by those who use it as an all-purpose tool to devalue a view they don't agree with. PS. We all harbour racist feelings at times. It's the tribal nature of the human animal. It's whether we recognise them when they arise and how we deal with them that is the measure of our moral and social development. - End of Sermon

BARTRAM FRAWLEY GARLAND GRIMES MARTIN RIVERS BAIL MOLONEY DAVEY PETTERD WATTS HOWE JURRAH CLARK GREEN JAMAR JONES TRENGOVE MORTON SYLVIA TAPSCOTT McKENZIE Emergency from: Nicholson Bennell Blease T McDonald Gawn Bate Gysberts Dunne Strauss J McDonald This is based on the best players from 2012. Including Sellar would be purely speculative at this stage. He may well fill the CHB post but does look a bit s;low from the video footage. Martin has the speed, height and his kicking, decision making and general disposal have improved out of sight. While looking at the above line-up, with injuries etc. there are some other players who you would expect to also get some game-time this year. They are: Fitzpatrick, Jetta, Evans, Spencer (I don't think his story is over yet), Davis, Cook, Lawrence. There are not too many players now on our list that won't deserve a game in the next two years. That's a pretty good situation for us. We don't have too many "Grgic" types any more. People may dislike Dunne, but he gave us a great year in 2010. Bate looks to be working very hard at turning things around. The whole picture looks rosy. GO DEES!

Like many people, I have re-watched the March presser a couple of times. At the time I was one who listened to his words and wanted to believe him. In light of recent events it is very interesting to watch his body language, especially in relation to questions regarding his dad. The big question for me now is, what were the important "values" he was referring to. The "values" that would help him make the best decision. At the time, many of us assumed that the "values" were those that would help him decide against going for the money and stay with the club that were trying to do the right thing by him. It would seem the "values" were something else entirely.

What makes you think Davey won't?

How about this Anthony Tipungwuti guy from the Tiwis.