astrodee

Reading this thread was a lot like watching Melbourne play. Cuddles, who it seems might know what's going on, said that it will take DB up to six years to achieve their goals. In this decade we have seen a young St.Kilda, Hawthorn and Melbourne squad play ring a ring a rosy. And their coaches be vilified by a number of their supporters. I thought our last effort was overkill, but it wouldn't have been if not for Geelong's inaccuracy in the rain and wind. So we were pathetic - oh woe, the players were just a little dispirited and tired. We were told to expect pain, so accept it. I said at the start of this season this man has rat-cunning. He managed to stave off Worsfald for the golden spoon. Now the football department can take their time and select the kids we need to succeed, and hold the ace in the PSD. All in all, on what I've seen so far - I love him. So do the young players - both my daughter and I know know a number of the players' rellies. The BOYS are slowly turning into men. Just enjoy the trip. It'll be slow and steady for some time - with downtimes. But then..... IMHO it will have been worth it.

Well, I still have great faith in DB. Let's face it, he picked a team that I knew would be thrashed, as I'm sure he (as most of us would have) expected Geelong to win by well over 100 points - which, had they kicked straight, would have happened - and any win by us would have cost us the golden spoon. It becomes totally wooden again in 2010. At the same time the club give 3 stalwarts a send off instead of a ride in an open car. WE still saw Grimes show that he's got IT, Warnock give Richo a touch up, Cale Morton always in space and with an 84% effective disposal rate, and Maric be really clever in traffic. We also saw Col Sylvia show his dedication by coming back on when he didn't need to and continue to give his all. Does anyone on this site believe we would have been been beaten by an ordinary Richmond outfit that had nearly as many errors as we did had Brock, Moloney, Rivers, Davey, Robbo, Wonna, PJ, etc, etc., played. I love the improvement in so many players. Hawthorn 4 years ago were lamentable, and Clarkson was the worst coach in the world according to Hawk's fans. They're not saying that now. Youth policy means patience. One thing I've learnt in my 51 years as a Melbourne member is patience. Bring on 2011 with us challenging for top 4.

As I've said on another thread I love the way Geelong play, particularly when they play as they did on Friday night. I hope one day we are as dominant and professional.

Robbie played over 100 games with peter Daicos at Collingwood, and was the Calder Cannons coach for (I think) 7 years taking them to (again, I think) 3 or 4 flags. He was Maric's coach there until last year when he resigned.

I watched him through a lot of the U18 carnival - he's smart but green. If my memory serves me, he takes a good grab and has some goal sense.

Sure was - until he took Mooney the guy was beaten. He played him back to form.

After watching this club play for over 50 years, I believe that this group of kids is as good as any I've seen, including the group Ray Jordan developed in the early to mid 80's. Last night's game is the best 100 point loss I've seen - and I've seen plenty! Look at the worst players -especially Carroll and White. Skinny kids trying their hardest, being buffeted, pressured as never before, but always putting in. Mistakes being made galore did not stop them from trying again. It was one of the best lessons they could have had. I have watched every Geelong game this year, because I like the way they play. Last night's was close to their best performance of the year - given the slippery conditions, and the sureness of their ball handling. I applaud them. Almost everyone of our kids out there did 1 or 2 really good things, and some even more. PJ, given that big men don't reach their best until 25-27, will be a superstar. Buckley will be anything. Warnock will play well over 100 games. Maric was described to me by Robbie Hyde after his 1st game as 'the next Peter Daicos' - he was then 16. He kicked 4 goals in a losing Grand Final. If he hadn't been so nervous in front of goal, his game would have been perfect, given he's one of the youngest kids in the league. Martin made some awful errors, but did some terrific things as well. And so on. I applaud them. Now they know what they have to become. Write them off at your peril.

As one of the village elders - I have seen 5 premierships and 3 losing GF's. I also have been through the pain of administrative upheavals, 1981, the AGM's of the 70's & 80's where money was regularly [censored] up against the wall, Templeton, and the unparalleled ineptitude of GS. We have been in trouble so many times, except for a man who bled for the R & B - Stuey Spencer who, with a tough uncompromising coach, pulled us out of the mire for a while. But another little bleeder in the used car business, who as a coach turned victory into defeat countless times, brought us back into it. The assassination of Joe Gutnick by GS ( he who cannot be named in case of a rerun). The top hat brigade were only good for this club when they didn't have to actually put much of the their money into the club. They still occasionally dine at the 'G. And we're stuck with their stereotype. Jimmy the legendary, who spoke about embracing immigrants MUST get rid of our stereotype.

1957-1972 , working O/S, 1977-1992, 1994- until I die.

John Northey may have coached us to the then record losing margin GF defeat, but he forged a TEAM of steel and his legacy to this club should be honoured. CC, Lyon, Stynes, Lovell, Hopgood, Ingo, Flower, Hutchison, Lovett, Viney, Greg Healy - these are just some of the team that he gave an 'us vs them' attitude that will lead this club into it's bright and successful future.

His demeanor, his nouse, his emphasis on educating the players in decision-making, his unflappability, his belief in himself, the way he managed to make himself into a footballer who played 63 games during Essendon's heyday (when in reality he wasn't particularly skillful, but always showed nouse and poise during games), his honesty, and his realistic appraisals of games. And the way he takes all the negativity and criticism in his stride and just keeps working away. He also delegates well and listens to others. He knows that he doesn't know it all. I have close friends who have played and coached VFL/AFL/TFL, and they are unanimous in their belief that he has what it takes to build both a successful culture and team. So, I'm excited.

Exactly, WJ. He's playing in a team that is bottom of the ladder. Imagine if he was surrounded by 21 Geelong players - he'd already be favourite for the rising star, or close to it. No, he's surrounded by kids and blokes who won't be there next year. As the team rises over the next few years, so will his status and stature.

I agree that Northey has been our best coach since the great NS. However, I love the way DB coaches. It should be remembered that without Neitz and Robbo we now have the 2nd youngest list in the AFL. His game plan is not a rehash of Port's 2002 - 2004 (which netted them a premiership), but a development of it. He said when he started that he was going to develop the team. Aussie, Garland, Warnock, PJ, CJ, Miller, Brock, Jones, etc are all developing into better footballers under his tutelage. CC is out there selling the club. Bailey in the media reminds me of NS in the WOS days. Straight faced and honest. So he uses cliches - gee, that means he's like all the other coaches. I have consistently watched this club play since 1957, and since the great redhead was destroyed by the MCC/MFC committee DB is the 1st coach to genuinely excite me. I loved Northey for his passion and his ability to develop an 'us against them' mentality, but always felt that he lacked the nouse to win a flag at AFL level. I agree with most that it is too early to really assess him. But for mine he has so far earned an 8/10 - and he still excites me as a coach. I also enjoyed his appearance on Before the Game, and can't wait for him to come on Footy Classified.

Is George your dad?

Have attended every game since I stopped playing 30 years ago, and before I started playing. But then, I'm a masochist.

If DA started barracking for us when he was a lad, it is unlikely his allegiance changed to the bears/lions. If he is a genuine supporter of the demons and has attended as many games as his schedule allowed, then great. If he chose his game of golf above watching his "beloved" demons play, then I'd be a little concerned, unless that game was a business need. When I was a lad I worked closely with Pratt, when his father ran the company and he was the Sales and factory manager. Visy Board paid well above the odds for a graphic artist, but Dick reckoned he owned you. When the Production manager was two days into his honeymoon he was recalled to work and he was to take the 1st plane back - or not to bother coming back. I was called in at 3.45am one Sunday morning to greet Dick and some Dunlop blokes who'd been out on the town, and had to put their wants into pictures for the outside of boxes they were going to order for their batteries. They paid well, but got your blood - the golden handcuffs. A smart entrepreneur. Argus, on the other hand, didn't inherit his father's company. He worked his way up the food chain with brains, guile, and a great way with people. He changed the culture of organizations. I was at that time an organizational cultural change consultant and worked at a company he was running. The man knows how to create a new organizational culture. Our greatest need is organizational culture change. We are no longer in need of the genteel culture of amateurism. We were a successful club when we could offer players inducements like Melbourne High (where Bill Woodfull was principal) and MCC memberships. But then along came professionalism and ever since then we have endured 4 decades of poverty and ineptitude with the exception of the periods under Spencer/ King and the management of Steve Harris (funny how when he came we got the big handouts from the AFL and the MCC - he knew where the bones were buried - and now he's gone, they're heavily reduced). The AFL want China. We've put in the work, and they want the result. Don Argus, is a man with CLOUT! And plenty of it. And whatever his personal wealth may be, he's a man powerful people listen to. If he would COMMIT his energy to this club and and people like Jimmy and Greg Healy joined the board, combined with the nouse of our new footy department and the move to Casey, we could go places very quickly. I pray that this becomes reality.

Cuddles is CC's nickname. Wherever the cattle come from is of little import. Good recruiting always involves some luck. Cuddles fits his role as FOP like a glove, just as Balmey does. They are professional, convivial, and well loved footy identities. He realizes that he can do as much to bring home the coveted prize as if he were coach. He is there to help, mentor and assist DB. I have no problema with your post. Merely your underestimation of CC's love for the club.

At last, someone with an iota of common sense. I am very excited about what's happening. To build a new house you have to knock down the old one. DB reminds me of Northey, only smarter (thank the lord). Enjoy watching a team being turned from a bunch of downhill skiers into a hard working, hard running, skilfull unit - who work for each other and ultimate success. DB excites me more than any coach we've had since the great NS (although, I must admit I was always thrilled by Big Carl's elbows).

If you need reasons to follow the red and blue, take up knitting.

Cuddles has annointed DB as our coach for AT LEAST the next 6 years. That's about the time it takes to develop a top team from scratch. Ask Bomber, or Clarko, or even Sheeds - after he won his 1st 2 flags with the list he inherited from Barry Davis, it then took 9, and then 7 years for his other 2. DB has inherited some stuff that was diverted from Werribee, and a lot of talented kids. Don't watch the ineptitude and lack of leadership, and ignore the scoreboard. Both Bomber and Clarkson withstood the barrage of supporters calling for their heads, and so will DB. When he develops the team HE wants, and they're successful, remember your words. They will come back to haunt you.

I was, and have been to every game I could get to since 1957. I have seen the best and the worst at this club. For all you disappointed people out there (of whom I am one) all I can say is that DB is the first coach who will deliver the medicine required to overcome the malaise that has engulfed this club since round 9, 1965. John Northey inherited a good young list created by Ray Jordan. DB has inherited a pack of older one trick ponies, and a number of talented kids. It will be his way or out. If you're not prepared to go through the pain that StKilda, Geelong and Hawthorn fans endured to develop competitive successful teams (and who kept turning up regardless), then p**s off - we don't want you. You represent the downhill skiers that our last coach loved. Perhaps the people of Casey will have stouter hearts. Bailey offers no excuses - he presents an honest picture of what happens on the field. Game plans are irrelevant when the team can't kick, handball or make a decent decision in the heat of battle. Remember the calls to sack Clarkson all through his 1st year. As a player he was just an honest toiler who gave everything to his teams (including ours - under Northey, a great builder of culture). Just as Bailey was(under Sheedy). Both these hard men are students of the game, and have long term plans. Skills take time to learn. We all know there was no skill development under our former coach and abominable list management. Therefore players have to unlearn all the bad habits that were fostered, and then learn correct ones. This can't be done over a short period. I am no longer concerned about the scoreboard. I just want to see the steady improvement of the youngsters. The older players had their chances and (with the exception of mid 1996 when Byron protected them until he did his hammy against the dogs), always floundered when mental toghness was needed. As it is now. DB will develop an honest, skillfull, and mentally tough team that will make good instinctual decisions. Cuddles said that he will coach us for a least 6 years - about as long as it should take a team to be up there for years. Get used to it. Cultural change takes time - just ask anyone who's beem through it. It took Bomber around 7 years to develop his side. He stuck to his plans while a great number of Catland ( or kittylitter land or whatever) users were calling for his head. Have all you people who want to dump DB noticed that the ex-Northey players are coming back to the club to help with the rebirth of this once great club. Perhaps they like what the footy department is doing, and will stop the off field mismanagent that has has plagued us since Cameron Schwab left. Let's get a president who has bled for the RED & BLUE. As Stuey did. As Jimmy did.

I've seen the first games of virtually every player since 1975, after I stopped playing. And there have been some beauties. Cale Morton has what only the best have had - genuine class and a good footy brain. As he fully adjusts to the pace of the game, he will develop further. Hopefully the coaching panel will iron out his kinks, and allow fis natural flair to reign (within appropriate limits). If he played with Essendon or Collingwood, he'd be headlined. He comes from a football family and knows what he has to do - and he wants to do the work. When he bulks up a bit, barring injury (think Warren Dean, Juice, etc), he will be an elite footballer. They way he moves remins me of Robbie and Barry Vagg. Brock's a McLean, he'll come good. It'll be a curcuitous journey. He's a lovely tough kid and he will continue to grow and will then be harder to close down.

Fair dinkum, how on earth can anyone condemn the talents of a coach 4 months and two games into a season. Especially one who was left a bunch of lazy senior players, and a number of inexperienced but talented kids. And another major disadvantage - if you remember, prior to season 2007 ND had the players losing weight so as to implement his run and carry delusion. This led to a number of injuries and still skinny kids. Look at how Dunn and others have bulked up in this pre-season. ND cost us a year of muscle mass building as well - so our kids are lighter as a result. Devopment of kids was non existent. So the skills were practiced, but not taught. We now have two development officers teaching players who have been in the system for 1-3 years from scratch. Do you actually ponder why our skills are so bad? That's right, Bailey should have undone 3 years of mismanagement in 4 months. Teach the group a game plan based on what? Their ability to dispose badly, make poor decisions, and a senior group (-2), devoid of passion or pride? Imagine someone with Godders' heart who had been taught skills and decision making from day 1. Collingwood have been teaching every kid in the club for over 2 years starting as soon as they arrive. Do you think their good kids became that overnight. No, they had, and have, a strong leadership group of older players (Buckley, Burns, Lockyer, Wakelin, etc) and two development coaches. And a wiley old coach who reinvents his game plan as needed. DB will pick his team on basics - courage, character, and selflessness on the field. He's old school - he understands that while the game changes, the fundamentals don't. And then, enhancing the skills they have. This is not an overnight fix, nor a one year fix. But it may well set us up for a sustained period of success. Support the man. Turn up to every possible game and enjoy the experience of properly managed team development. Put up with the early pain, the lessons that every player must learn, and then - when the team finally becomes what we all hope for -you will have earnt the rewards that supporting a top team gives. I still remember leaving the MCG in 1957 having seen my 1st premiership, and 1964 having seen my last. It still sends shivers down my spine. I hope to have that feeling again. I believe that in DB we have the man who will set us up. Patience - found rarely in a woman and (almost) never in a man - is called for. Passionate supporting is needed. Do you wear your various club member scarves all winter, or only to the football? Are you PROUD to be a DEMON? If you are, show the world.

Alan Jeans, Tom Hafey. They, like Bailey, got every game they played because of their character, toughness and smarts - not because of their ability. The fact a slow, not very big and injury-prone player managed 53 games in 6 seasons when Essendon were a top side says a lot about him. He studied under 2 of the best in Sheeds (who went to the trouble of getting him) and Choco, who were given better lists than he to start with - especially Sheedy who inherited a team filled with kids who went on to win 2 flags. I suspect that he knows what he's doing, and that is finding out the character of every player. The type of character that wins pemierships - he's seen how it's done. I expect him to set out to really try and beat a few sides this year. But those games will be late in the season. And I'm certain that various players have disappointed him - especially the older ones. Acker, who I respect because he's honest and a thinker, said in an interview that we are the quietest team on the field he's ever (not?)heard. What does that say about the older players? Bailey said earlier this year that he wants Robbo tp teach the kids. I bet he's changed his mind. The sad truth is that our more experienced players know their window has closed, are contracted, lazy, and selfish. With one or two exceptions. Both Neitz and Junior are quiet men who lead by deed, not words. The rest of them couldn't lead a dog. Talk about biting the hand that feeds you. The only place Brock can lead them is astray. Ever since the mantle of LEADER was thrust upon him ( long before he joined the leadership group - particularly in this forum) he's become a crock. We have a bunch of kids who have many leadership qualities amongst them (think Jack Grimes - captain of every team he's played for , but old timers can often be far more intimidating to 17 - 21yo workmates, than they are to opposition workMATES who are often TEAMS. Hardly surprising - look at the culture they represent. Bailey is a shrewd man. He knows that the faux glitz amd glamour board will be eventually replaced - it is inevitable. We were a great team between 1987 - 91. We were a passionate club led by a very smart businessman and passionate president in Stuart Spencer - a premiership player and one of the many leaders the club had in those days. And who hired a coach who played guys who had heart and knew how to play within their limitations and were about TEAM. They were hard and ruthless but unfotunately had blokes with injury problems. Who could forget Jamie Duursma, a swans reject, beating stars like Kernahan and Dermie/ Dunstall (at their prime) when it counted. Could hardly walk, but had mental toughness. Stewie was a martinet but a passionate supporter - who can forget his missus berating Brian Wilson's wife for not being passionate enough. We replaced him with a car salesman (great player) who had the charisma of a prune. We were at our most successful when football was an amateur game. We didn't have the Jack Wrens of the world digging into their gains to reward our players. What would our then supporters think, while they played gin rummy and took care of establishment business? We didn't have the Richard Pratts digging in whenever it was needed. And when we got one, we replaced him with Szondy, an accountant who turned us from having money in the bank to debtors. Oh what a great decision. A passionate demons supporter who created passion in the club outed because he didn't fit the Melbourne model. What is Paul Gardner passionate about? Did he, as Eddie did, sit in the outer as a passionate supprter at opposition grounds getting there early to watch the reserves? Or play, as Richard Pratt did, bleeding for his Club in the reserves on muddy grounds with cold showers, or with his local comp dreaming of one day pulling on the red and bue? All while bulding a glabal marketing company. He didn't bleed inside when the Dees lost. He's passionate about causes. We are still run by amateurs. There are former players out there who are smart, passionate and successful. Come on Cuddles, get your mates moving. Take over the club. Do we have enough passionate supporters out there who care enough about this club to get rid of the establishment amateurs who run it? We need some FERAL PASSION. To get back to the subject at hand, Bailey has, IMHO, a fair degree of feral in him. Let's give him passion. Let's give him supprt. You all ask for balls from the players. where's the balls from the supporters? Our next window should open 2010 -11. Instead of whinging and whining, and seeing who'se got the biggest c**k, let's make difference. Make noise about changing the real problem. The lack of leadership at the top creates a culture of dispassion. FCS aim our collective anger where it belongs. Fire the board. We count - but only if we're members. Enough members can make a change. Enough, perhaps, to cause our current so - called leaders - the board to fall on their swords. Let's stop p*ssing into the wind.

FWIW he's at a mates apartment in Docklands allegedly sniffing a lot - must have a cold.