poita

Viney became a very solid kick late in his career - you don't get an All Australian jumper by being a poor kick. Like Robertson with his goal kicking, it shows that anything is possible if you practice enough.

That's fine, but don't go putting him in the senior team until he has played a couple of consecutive full games at VFL lever.

Good to see Salem and Hibberd back, hopefully both are right to go. Not particularly impressed to see Hannan in on the back of 1 game in 8 months. He can go missing even when fully fit, so I'd hate to see how he'll be without enough match fitness. Wagner has been dropped three times in five games - pretty safe to say that he is done as an AFL footballer. Petty and Lockhart may not have made the cut any way, so not concerned by their absences. That said, why on earth are Spargo and Smith in the team? They are both contributing nothing at present. I'd delist Spargo if he didn't have a contract for next year. I'm no great fan of Weideman, but at least he has some chance of being on an AFL list in two years. In a season where finals are off the table, we are just wasting games on playing Smith over Weideman and Preuss.

Fritsch may be when played in the right spot, J Wagner not even close - his decision making time is way too long for an AFL footballer.

16th on the ladder (and deservedly so) would suggest we should have mountains of salary cap space available. If not, there is some serious mis-management going on.

Goodwin and his advisers should be looking for a new job on Monday if they are stupid enough to even consider playing Lever this week. All Goodwin is doing is lining up the excuses for Saturday night's post match press conference.

That may be so but, at 27 and having played 7 games out of the past 57, you have to have serious doubts re his ability to withstand the rigors of AFL football. Hopefully the club is giving serious thought to paying out his contract if his condition hasn't improved by the end of the season.

Yep, he should be aiming for the Fremantle game.

Between Lewis and May, do we do any due diligence on the players we recruit? Pathetic.

Assuming Dunkley shows some promise I'd keep him and one of C.Wagner & Lockhart, probably Lockhart. Bradtke aside, the rest of our rookies are gone. Of the listed players: Keep: Frost, Neal-Bullen, Baker, Jones, Weideman (although he'd want to pull his finger out to get a decent contract) Undecided: Stretch, Kennedy-Harris, J.Smith (possibly only keep one of Stretch and JKH, depending on draft picks) Gone: Lewis, Garlett, Maynard, J.Wagner (although I expect he will get a new deal) PS. How did Vandenberg get a three year deal with his injury history, and why did Spargo get a third year?

I've been convinced that our midfield is lacking in depth for several years, so if Kyle can push into the midfield rotation over the next years whilst making a contribution in the forward line, that would clearly be a big step up on the likes of Wagner, Spargo and Lockhart. My number one priority is players who can find the football, then kicking ability and leg speed. If you can't find the football (see the three names above as examples), everything else is irrelevant.

Frost is a better bet than May at this point in time, so I can't see Frost going anywhere any time soon. That said, I'm sure May will be back in the side as soon as he is fit as Goodwin will need to justify his recruitment. I feel as though Hore & Lever are ultimately fighting for one position as neither is a great one on one defender. I wouldn't mind seeing Hore play a couple of games on the wing later in the season. Hibberd must be close to the end based on his first ten weeks, and perhaps Hore will take the role after next year.

Those statistics are so misleading. Smith (28, 9 games), J.Wagner (25 next month, 35 games), Lockhart (23, 7 games), Hore (23, 8 games), C.Wagner (22, 13 games) are clearly inexperienced, but they certainly aren't young. Even Baker is already 21. Hence they are inexperienced because they have not been good enough to play more games at AFL level, not because they have young, immature bodies that are naturally going to develop over the next few years. Clayton Oliver was the fourth youngest Melbourne player out there yesterday, and he has played 70 games. Do we still consider him a young, inexperienced player? As an aside, our recent rookie selections include Smith (28), Maynard (27), Keilty (24), Walker (23), Lockhart (23) Wagner (22). Not one of those guys is young, none is close to our best 22, yet we continue to waste development resources on them. It is no wonder our list is so shallow when we don't turn it over regularly.

Hibberd is 30 in January, and has generally been terrible this year. Jetta has been carrying a knee injury for at least 12 months, so blame the club for his current absence. Salem is a big loss. May is fat and lazy, and no guarantee of improving the side even if he gets fit. Lever is massively overrated on these boards, but will at least add some leadership. Hannan is a fringe player who was dropped several times last year. Kolodjashnij is all but done as an AFL player. Smith has played 11 games in five years and is yet to prove he can be a consistent AFL player. Yes, these players are individually better than the guys who have replaced them, but there is enough talent in the current team that they should be performing much better than we saw yesterday. I don't think that getting players back will automatically fix the problems we clearly have.

I thought we showed something in each of the past four weeks, but yesterday's effort was abysmal. A massive step backwards in every respect. GWS are a good side and thoroughly outclassed us, but they completely outworked us as well. The Giants' first three goals summed us up beautifully - Spargo gives away 50 because he was off with the fairies as usual; Baker gives away a free kick down the ground because he was playing behind and was undisciplined after the ball had gone; Fritsch lobs a lazy, ill-directed kick out straight to a GWS player. Goodwin had yet another shocker at selection and on game day. Preuss is no star but he works hard, gives Gawn a chop out and gives us something different to play with up forward. The Spargo selection was the worst of a bad season - a poor footballer recalled off no form and no fitness. Why Lewis did not replace Salem is inexplicable. Brayshaw and Fritsch have been destroyed by being played out of position all season. Nothing was done to break Oliver's tag. McDonald and Petracca were not moved up the ground until the game was done. Lockhart, Wagner x2, Spargo and Smith are so far out of their depth at this level it is beyond a joke. They'll tease occasionally with a decent touch or two, but go missing when the heat is on. Garlett is soft and lazy. With these guys in the team we start six players short even before others have a bad day. Petty and Baker should be developing in the VFL but at least they generally try. At one stage in the second quarter we had Spargo and Wagner x 2 on the bench - GWS had Coniglio, Whitfield and Kelly resting up, and we were still getting absolutely flogged. Gawn was excellent, but had no support. Viney and Harmes at least looked interested for a bit. Hore was the best of a poor defence, and the less said about our forward line the better.

I am yet to see anything to suggest that Spargo is an AFL standard footballer and I have no idea on what basis he was drafted. One (lucky junk time) goal in four games, and averages less than 10 possessions and 2 tackles a game this season. His only notable skill is being where the football isn't.

In a season full of incredibly dumb selections and player management decisions, that would be by far the dumbest. If they are sensible they wouldn't even contemplate selecting Lever until after the bye. That said, I don't think the 6-6-6 rule suits Lever and I expect him to struggle significantly this season. I'm not sure that we can play both he and Hore in the same team as neither is great when defending 1v1.

I enjoy reading the same people bitching and moaning about umpires making mistakes whilst doing an almost impossible job, when they won't hear a bad word said about certain highly paid, professional athletes who can't execute basic skills.

Question for the regular VFL watchers - have you seen any sign that either Bedford or Chandler are any chance to make it, or do we have another two Dion Johnstones on our list?

There is a very fine line between treating the media like fools and treating the supporters like fools. I'm not sure that Goodwin has got that balance right yet.

There has been no progress on the status of Smith, Kolodjashnij, Vandenberg and Jetta since the initial incidents. Does that mean there actually is no improvement, or we're just plucking figures from thin air to complete the injury reports?

I think we missed an opportunity at Moorabbin. It is close enough to our heartland, decent facilities on the back of council and government funding, and easy enough to get to for players living in the south east. It also ties in nicely with our relationship with SMJFL.

Trengove would be a massive upgrade on the likes of Maynard, C.Wagner & Kennedy-Harris who are just clogging the list. That said, there is no point him being on the list either if Goodwin won't play him.

Should have been a fine at most. The hand wringers in this thread are really saying they would be happy for Clayton Oliver to be suspended for that? I very much doubt it.

Does the club actually care what is being said about it in the media, or are the key individuals all bunkering down protecting their own backsides? What do the sponsors think of what seems to be a complete lack of professionalism and accountability at the club in certain respects this season? The last thing we need is the parents of players having reason to doubt that their sons are being looked after properly.