P-man

I see where you're coming from, but Roos has been very open about his want to bring across some assistants who are familiar with his coaching and game style, who can hit the ground running. So, this is to be expected, and as long as they have some recent wins to back up their appointment, as Matthews appears to have, I'm all for it.

What a little champion.

Did Ben just use a smiley face? Sociopaths don't use smiley faces. : ) That list is kind of of alarming. One of my mates hits every single one of those on the head.

Damn you rjay. I knew you would pick me up on that. The midfield is in urgent need, but as you can see by the temp name change, I have faith in the bloke we've appointed to address that and I think he can do so quickly, with or without the PP. Jackson is doing his job by applying for it. I do wonder if his professional opinion is the same as his personal one, but anyone in his position would be applying for it. I'm wary because this is the path we have travelled in recent times, and look where it has led us. But I'm hardly going to turn it down if we get it. I might be a bit nuts, but I'm not bat [censored]. Not yet. At its most basic, this is my position. Perhaps I've elaborated too much but at least we share some common ground. BB - cheers mate. Ditto.

Ditto. Am disappoint,

RL - thank God not everyone feels they should be bullied into submission by the majority voices on D'Land, as nice as that would be. If we get it, fine, let's use it wisely. If we don't, I won't be crying into my pillow at the lack of that one player, messiah figure #87, to come to the club. I'll be focussing on what the club is doing to develop the talent it already has.

In my view, the financial assistance and remedying the off field debacle is a necessity, and the AFL rightly recognises that. I appreciate you see draft assistance as a necessity. Maybe you're correct, and maybe I'm placing far to much faith in the Roos appointment. I'm coming from a position where if there's two scenarios: one where we become a great club without further compromising the draft, and one where we don't, I'd choose the latter. I don't expect everyone to align themselves with that position, or even understand it. It's just how I feel about it. Of course I understand the arguments that we're arguably the most affected club in our timing of beng the worst side in the competition, with the two expansion clubs raiding the talent pool. I've used that in arguing FOR our application. I'm not blind to the reasoning behind it, or naive enough to think that the culture can't be fixed with a PP as well. I'm just sick of following a weak club with a recent history of reliance on the AFL to sustain itself. I see an opportunity to make a stand and say we're gonna knuckle down and do this ourselves and it appeals to me, innately. Hopefully you get where I'm coming from, even a little. If you don't, I can't explain it any better than that.

Jesus christ mate, you have a go at me for semantics but you love picking apart every single word. Your problem seems to be your insistence on towing the company line. Defending Schwab. We didn't tank. I believe in Tom. etc etc. Any questioning of what happens seems to attract your ire. Not quite on Satyr's level I'll grant you. Compared to fixing the fundamentals of a football club, it is a quick fix. An easy get. What this club is now synonymous with. We have two picks in the first round. Over the past 2 drafts we'll have 4 Top 5 draft picks (including JV). Let's develop our own Andrew Swallow. We're getting the people on board who are capable of it. So let's do it. Ourselves. Unless being on a welfare drip is desirable. If that is the starting point, there's no argument entered into.

You really can't see a connect between a desire to toughen up and become a strong club with a strong culture, and an opposition to further draft handouts? I have reservations about it, which I choose to share amongst my fellow supporters, and I don't appreciate being labelled weak because of it. No Melbourne supporter that has survived this far is weak. Frankly I think mine and others' reservations about another quick fix have some pretty good foundation. I don't see a PP as a priority for this club, or anything close to. I have however been resolute in my defending the club to put forward the application based on performance, because the case is there for all to see. I simply acknowledge there are issues that cloud the debate, and some of those have merit.

Rpfc - you've explained your position well, as you often do. I don't disagree with alot of what you've said. I do think it becomes a slippery slope once you start restricting the definition of tanking to telling players to lose. Pre-match planning and decisions in the coaches box must, potentially, fall under the banner as well. The motive too should receive some consideration, but as you point out, it can be near impossible to prove without sufficient evidence. It would appear that the degree of our ineptitude allowed such evidence to be uncovered. In the end I think as crazy as the outcome appeared on the surface, it was fair. We did not deserve to be stripped of draft picks for something that several clubs had put into practice before us. The investigation itself was the hit that we took, and it did its share of damage to the fabric of the club. That's not to cast aside the extreme sensitivities around the awarding of a PP that BB points out, which I think the AFL will be very conscious of. As for treating ex-officials with scorn, I agree there is no point in that, I just wouldn't go out of my way to defend them, or the decisions they made. I personally believe tanking was orchestrated by those whose vision for success was shown to be short sighted and misguided.

Agree with all of the above.

It's also not going to be a great look for the AFL if Melbourne shoot up the ladder next year after being awarded a PP for being uncompetitive. If indeed, a club's success is determined by the quality of the people off the field, as much as on it. I'm willing to bet that the AFL will give the club a season under Roos to see what he can do. Another dismal season and the case goes from compelling to undeniable, enough that even the other clubs won't be able to whinge about it.

i know you held tight to "we never tanked", but you can't seriously believe that punishments were handed out because of a misinterpreted joke. The whole thing was smoke and mirrors to cover the AFL's arse for creating such a flawed system, and ours for munching on the poisoned carrot. I'm not sure why you would defend the fools that have driven this club into the dirt. They don't deserve it.

Roughy has overtaken Buddy, for what it's worth. Conversely, I don't get the argument that we shouldn't risk Jones' impact as a player by giving him the responsibility as captain. Just because it seems to have impacted on the youngest captain in the history of the game doesn't mean it will do the same to a seasoned campaigner. Seems to be walking on eggshells. Jones is the best on field leader. Easily. To me that is a heavily weighted consideration when selecting a captain, moreso for a club in our position. If he has the sniffles during a speech, I couldn't give a stuff. He demonstrates heart felt desire to make the club great when he speaks publicly, that's enough for me.

I wasn't aware that it was ever in doubt that the outcome of the investigation was a complete farce. Watching McLachlan trying to explain the decision was a comedy act. The non-guilty verdict was pretty much a finding of, "we know you did it, but so did numerous other clubs, so we'll go easy on you. p.s. if betting agencies or anyone else asks, tanking does not exist. Wink."

I'm honestly staggered at the recklessness of their decision to turf Voss without having a replacement lined up. Now they have 5 top 30 draft picks, all young players, ready to walk. No club is in a worse position than us, albeit with some light at the end of the tunnel now, but the Paddles will be facing some very tough times ahead if the rumoured exodus pans out.

Read nothing into it. The North poster on bigfooty who started it is a known troll and card carrying [censored].

Surely you don't mean B Grade in the league? He averaged 17 touches.and kicked 9 goals for the year. No way on earth I'd be selecting Trengove as captain ahead of Grimes. Mysterious injuries or not, ever since he's been captain he's gone backwards in his development.

He can improve though. He reminded everyone in the last game of the season what he's capable of. The difference between his best and worst is monumental.

Henderson and McKernan for Pick 2? "We know you need some hard bodied midfielders...how about a couple of key position players?"

Seems to have gone a bit quiet on the Dal front. Strongly tipped that he will be moved on with the Saints looking to turn their focus to the youth. North considered the frontrunner, but any interest or case put forward to get him? Short term solution to midfield woes but could have a long term impact in terms of what he leaves behind, beyond that of Byrnes or Rodan. He would be a consistent best 22 contributor. Still highly respected. The question is also what the Saints would accept for him. Second rounder + ?

This.

Exactly. This one is a no brainer. Get him here.

I'm just being honest, and I respect everyone is entitled to a opinion. I actually try not to belittle others so if I have it wasn't intentional.

It's very easy to say that. The fact of the matter is that this club is on a path to earning respect, from everyone, including its own supporter base. We have to sacrifice alot of it to undergo this transformation from mickey mouse laughing stock to professional football club, but at some point accountability and rolling up the sleeves has to take place. It has to START. The concept of pride gets laughed at on this site. I don't think it's laughable, personally. I see the argument for based on performance, but the craving for it saddens me a little bit, to be honest.