DeeSpencer

You aren't familiar with Knightmare? He posts a bucketload on bigfooty and has turned that in to an ESPN gig. Seems to know a bit about drafting but who knows if he's reliable. D+ seems a harsh rating for 2 late picks. Personally I think he's looked too much at stats with Hannan instead of investigating the different parts to his game. And DJ was drafted for his attributes but I think he should reassess the benefits of a small who will really launch in to tackles and can kick long and straight. A lot of the other small forwards have kicked more goals and shown more moves but come finals those types of smalls can very often get beaten.

Main listed draftee gets 80k+ and very decent match payments now I think, play all 22 games and they can be banking more than 150 and even close to 200. Rookie list guys I think is 55k plus match payments. I think Hannan said he had further study to do if he wasn't drafted so who knows, he might do that part time now or maybe wait a year to get sorted. Tim Smith might want to keep his plumbing skills up to date in some spare time but otherwise will have to be full time footy so he can't exactly be working weekdays! Should be some fitness improvements with going full time. And definitely some strength and recovery. But it's the little things like having/being able to focus on diet and sleep and training in regular hours instead of fitting in training after doing a full work day that all add up. Smith's 25 and has a strong and fit body so he might not make huge inroads, but Hannan hasn't been playing VFL all that long and is young enough to probably make quite a bit of physical improvement.

FB: Hibberd Oscar Mc Jetta HB: Hunt T Mc Salem C: Stretch Viney Lewis HF: Kent Hogan Petracca FF: Watts Weideman Hannan Foll: Gawn Tyson Jones Int: Harmes Brayshaw Vince Melksham I've left out Clarry which seems very silly, but I just wonder whether he'll be a better player with more time at Casey developing his tank and made to earn his spot. In time he'll be our best midfielder but the way the game is going especially early in the season teams are super fit and it's hard to carry guys who are underdone and don't have a lot of positional flexibility. He can be good forward, but he's even better on ball. Harmes and Brayshaw could be our best forward tacklers and can start forward and go through the midfield and the wings. Vince and Melksham can go through half back and wings/on ball. Lewis can obviously move on ball, as can Vince. I want the extra goal kicker and proper forward so Hannan comes in. Garlett misses out for the pressure guys listed above due to their flexibility. I want the extra running defender so Frost misses out and Hibberd plays as the 3rd tall and hopefully the zone defending provides cover. Weideman gets the nod over Pedersen because I think he'll be fitter for the start of the season. A lot of my best 22 is based upon Goodwin ramping up the game plan with zone defending and fast ball movement. Plus also trying to copy the Dogs model of multiple positional changes. If we want a more traditional game plan I'd go with Frost down back, Garlett in a forward pocket and Oliver rotating from the bench to the midfield.

Yep that's fair. Just saying the new guys don't have to do much at all to equal the AFL output and both can perform at VFL level. If the ranking is based on projected AFL output I don't mind it and I don't really care about VFL output really. I don't care if our players are dominating in the VFL as long as they are doing ok and progressing towards becoming AFL players.

Grimes - 2 games, 1 good, 1 bad, never factored again. 2 mediocre games. From an AFL perspective the bar is very low to replace their output. Both were good players at VFL level but so was Hannan - despite limited training, and McKenna had a solid season in the NEAFL and should be above average in the VFL.

Not sure about that. If you use the above from Dee-licious: Jordan Lewis > Michie . Michael Hibberd > Dean Terlich Pat McKenna = GrimesMitch Hannan > Ben Newton Melksham > Matt JonesLachlan Filipovic = Max King Declan Keilty < DunnTim Smith - Chris Dawes Plus Dion Johnstone The addition of Hannan, McKenna, Keilty and Smith instead of a bunch of kids means Casey will have a really good group of AFL listed players each week. They'll now have to go out and replace Smith, Keilty and to a lesser extent McInerny (he only played seniors at the end of the year) but that can be done. Jordan Moncrief was playing well in the VFL 2's, he could replace Keilty. Mitch King being fit could replace McInerny and another year of development in to Hullett and Weid could cover Smith. I assume Casey now have some shopping money and an increase in reputation to go find some mature VFL players. Could be mids or smalls at either end instead of talls, as long as they get quality to go alongside the AFL guys they'll be in a good spot.

Listed as 194cm but has a good leap on him and an athletic powerful frame that should fill out. Oscar will be stronger next year and Frost is being trained up as a defender now. So that's 3 options other than Tom to take on the big boys. Cloke got him once or twice in that absolute wet bog of a game at Casey but he was more beaten for smarts by an experienced player than for sheer strength.

I wonder if the change from 2 more Cat A rookies to 3 more relegated the plans to take another cat B. Or if securing DJ meant Allsop was unlikely. Would be nice to get the kid out to Casey maybe. Could be a nice way to further the Indigenous/Multicultural academy by linking in the players who don't make it with Casey and seeing if they can get a 2nd chance that way.

In his defence (which goes against everything I just wrote) the VFL grand final was a terrible match up for Spencil. Minson is still as crafty as any AFL ruck and Spencil is still as dumb as a post. At AFL level Spencer could run him around and blow him up and lessen his influence, but the slower speed of the game at VFL level allowed Minson to stay with him. Plus he had Tom Campbell as back up where as Casey had young Oscar who was playing in by far the biggest game he'd played in and against by far the best opponent.

West Coast - Giles. Freo - Griffin. Adelaide - O'Brien. Port - Lobbe (just). St Kilda - Holmes and Longer. Hawthorn - Pittonet. Gold Coast - Witts (just). North - Daw. That's off the top of my head. Spencer has flashed moments of competence but neither his skills nor his smarts have improved significantly in a long time on the list. I have very little confidence in him with just a slight hope that a full preseason improves him. He should be able to play a fair share of the Preseason games as well this year because surely there's no need to play Max for any more than a bit of conditioning.

Thankyou Bears for one of the great tank jobs of all time getting me the tip and getting the bears closer to a top 3 draft pick. Oh and yay another injury to our best remaining defensive player. At the same time, Matt Barkley NFL QB? Maybe? What a shame his receivers dropped all those passes including 2 in the end zone for the game winner.

VP nailed most of what I saw. I was impressed by Hannan and DJ's kicking technique when lining up for goal. Simple run ups, came in straight, nailed kicks easily with nice penetration. Vanders was leading out Viney on a few longer laps. T Mc, Pedda, Jetta, Lewis, JKH, King and Trenners were all part of the rehab group doing runs. Maynard was doing light jogs with the two draftees before heading off early For what it's worth Hannan had jumper 19 on and DJ had 37.

I think he had a shoulder reco over the break and so wouldn't have done any upper body weights. Through the legs and core he's fine. On the other hand DJ is an absolute baby. There's nothing off him besides from the biceps. Don't be fooled by the beach weights he's a young'en.

Looking only at stats: Doesn't take a heap of marks and very few contested marks. Doesn't kick goals, 1 for the entire year. So very much a follower type of ruckman who looks as though he can run like an extra midfielder. Which is probably where the game is going with the Dogs using Roughead and Boyd like extra followers. Does find a bit of the ball and has had some big hit out games. http://websites.sportstg.com/team_info.cgi?action=PSTATS&pID=199622788&client=1-3020-111708-392810-14528790&ocompID=392810 Can't say he's any worse than most ruck prospects. But doesn't look like the answer to our forward/ruck problems.

Take the Riverina out of GWS academy zone. Give them their own TAC team - the Albury-Wagga drop bears. Any player who plays for a TAC, SANFL or WAFL side is removed from the GWS academy. To be eligible for the GWS academy you can only play local football, NEAFL and representative football for NSW teams. If you join a Victorian or South Australian junior development team then you should be treated like those players. At the moment it's double dipping and billing the AFL twice. Setterfield played for the Sandringham Dragons (+ Caulfield Grammar) this year. He's from Albury. Literally walking distance from Victoria! That's a long way from growing the game in non football areas of NSW. He got TAC coaching like every other kid from bayside Melbourne and also had his own set of coaches in the Giants academy. Cummings played for North Adelaide. Broken Hill is a traditional football area and feeds in to the South Australian system. With a little more money the SANFL clubs could streamline junior development for players in South Western NSW should they choose to head to Adelaide like many kids from that area do.

Joel Smith looks ready to play and Maynard has the tools to play, just a matter of seeing him at VFL level. So I'm fine with going in 1 short on the A list. But 1 short on the A list, 1 short on the B list and seemingly 1 short on the senior list with Lumumba likely gone seems a bit too much. 47 players for a team of 22 does seem a lot! But 44 out of 47 seems like a bit left on the table. I wonder how much we are putting in to buying players for Casey. If they aren't drafted I think the club will want to do what they can to get McInerny, Tim Smith, Keilty, Hutchins and probably a few others to stick around so that this years gains aren't wiped out. Might be able to buy 3 experienced VFL players for the price of 1 rookie these days.

JKH is a high half forward/wing player. Good runner, good reader of the play around the ground and a nice kick. Kennedy is a half forward/inside midfielder. His strengths are winning contested ball around the packs and a burst from stoppages. Neither of those guys have the pace, tackling or one on one ability to be consistent AFL small forwards in a designated role. They are handy because they can fill the spot whilst bringing some versatility but if we want a more traditional small forward to compete with Garlett then we needed to draft one.

Hannan is a bit left field and a risk. He's 22 and played 18 VFL games for only 20 goals. But I'm not convinced he was a needs selection as much as others are. He improved a lot as the VFL season went on and looks like he was still playing a lot of deep forward. He was best on in the A grade ammo's grand final in 2015 as a midfielder and I'm sure the club was watching then. He reminds me of Howe whom a lot of people thought was drafted as a 3rd tall forward but eventually became a handy (if disgruntled) intercept marker. I think Hannan is a long term prospect who might eventually settle on a wing or as a true utility. Johnstone looks like a needs selection at the back end of the draft making sure we've got another small forward and getting the one we wanted. I expect the rookie picks to be similar today.

Titans Pats Giants

According to Taylor we will only take 2 selections which seems a bit disappointing given we've got room for 3 more, plus a cat B, plus replacing Lefumbles if he quit already. We obviously have faith in Joel Smith and Maynard as options if needed and don't want to dig too deep in to rookie picks. In a perfect world I'd take a ruckman, a tall defender/versatile tall and another outside runner.

Without derailing the thread too much Bugg, ANB, Melksham and with a good injury run JKH and McKenna are all very good endurance runners. JKH, McKenna and in some way Melksham are noted for their skills. Bugg, ANB and Ben Ken are all big ball winners. And whilst he has bad games on his day Ben Ken plays with speed, grunt and goal kicking. My point is I think they are on the list for a reason and they bring complimentary skills to round out the list. Melksham was the only one of those guys drafted/traded for a pick in the first 2 rounds anyway, so we weren't expecting stars from the others and I think if we chase stars with every pick in the draft you'll end up with an inconsistent list. Hannan has more X factor, but he needs to, he's a 22 year old with 18 VFL games to his name! And even if it was pick 46 he was our first pick in the draft so we'd be hoping for a top 30-35 player on our draft board.

Fitness would have to be the issue. He missed a lot of 2015 with a broken arm and so has only really done the 1 preseason at VFL level with the Dogs. They might have to treat him like an 18 year old recruit in terms of building his fitness.

Mitch Hannan (Footscray, 22, 189cm, 84kg): the left-footer gained plenty of attention with a spectacular grab against Collingwood in Round 18. But a Moorcroft-like mark earlier in the season was even better. The mid-sized forward was best-afield for St Bernard’s in the VAFA grand final in 2015 and took his place in the Dogs’ VFL premiership 12 months later. He’d set Footscray on the road to Etihad Stadium by booting three goals in the final quarter of the semi-final against Essendon. http://www.heraldsun.com.au/leader/localfooty/best-vfl-players-in-line-to-be-drafted-to-the-afl/news-story/57290b5a4d1bff2f61ebab8a47c2e19c

Not suggesting it's enough to draft him but our defenders have been slow for over a decade (maybe 5!). The training benefit of getting some more speed and pressure is a pretty handy improvement alone, not to mention getting some proper pressure for spots in that forward pocket role. The other thing I like about him is I'd rather a small forward who needs his skills cleaned up a bit than a silky mover at under 18 level who isn't up to it with body contact and tackling. It's almost a defensive first position these days and it's a difficult role to kick more than a couple of goals in a final no matter how good you are. So I like that Johnstone is taller and harder at it than most small forwards.

They weren't that height but The Wiz and Robbo had me excited. As did a certain Jurrah fella. The game is getting taller so at his height Hannon is really a flanker more than a 3rd tall. There won't be any delusions that he can be a key forward like there were with Howe and Bate.