Dr. Gonzo

Great thread! First game I can remember attending was when i was 6 years old, it was Round 1, 1988 we played Richmond at the 'G and trounced them and "TC" Tony Campbell kicked 8 goals from memory. I don't remember much from the game except walking around the back of the old Southern Stand just before the final siren. Was pretty happy we won. However I am sure I attended some games in 1987 I just can't remember them. What I do remember though is my dad and I sitting at home listening to the radio and watching the replay in Round 22, 1987 - we couldn't go to the game because it was my sisters 3rd birthday that day so we had to sit at home and miss one of the best moments in recent MFC history! I don't remember attending the finals the two weeks after but I do remember being at the Royal Melbourne Show on Prelim Final day 1987 and Melbourne and Hawthorn posters/banners up everywhere. My cousin barracked for Hawthorn at the time (for a brief period from 1986 to about 1989 - he is now and was before that a Richmond supporter) so was giving me stick when we asked someone who won and they told us the Hawks after we had gotten updates from people all day saying Melbourne were winning. Although I attended almost every week in 1988 I don't have any clear memories of other games until Round 22, 1988 when we beat the Blues to secure a finals spot, and then the Semi-Final against the Pies and the Prelim against the Blues (I didn't attend the WCE Elimination Final as was at a friends birthday). I do remember listening to us beat the Cats at the Cattery on the radio in my bedroom, pretty sure dad went that day but I was left at home. I also remember being up at 6am on GF Day 1988 watching the footy marathon all ready to go and watch the Demons play in the Grand Final and then realising that my dad hadn't been able to get a ticket for me only for himself and my uncle. I guess it was a blessing in the end as I was able to switch off the TV at half time and go and kick the footy around the backyard but I had to cop it from my cousin again who came around at half time to rub salt in to the wound.

I've seen the issue of "fitness" raised a few times now and watching games in 2011 I didn't need to be told - it was plain as day the players were either unfit or lazy. My thoughts are whether it is because they previous coaching staff/FD didn't push the players hard enough they weren't fit enough or is it because of the age of our list and the fact quite a few are only in their 2nd/3rd and have had limited pre-seasons to build up the fitness base. Someone like Morton is in his 5th year next year but how many pre-seasons has he done? Similar with guys like Watts, Jurrah, Blease etc

Exactly. Look at where that has gotten us in the past regarding "name players" like White, Yze, Robertson, Johnston getting picked week in, week out on reputation alone which was mainly built either early in their careers or against weaker opposition.

Maybe he did but the decision was the right one. We have moved on as a club and now we can only hope he does as well and isn't like a Grant Thomas or KB figure carrying a grudge. The future is now and Neeld is the man to lead us.

I don't think that there's any Melbourne supporters that would say the club has never made mistakes in the past or even the recent past. This isn't about a journalist unveiling internal mistakes like a Caroline Wilson might do and perhaps even providing constructive criticism or opinion on the matter. This is about someone making nothing statements, like the club doesn't stand for anything and he would be ashamed to support MFC, as well as having a go at the club for ridiculous things like not paying 100% of the cap, over-paying for Clark & not hunting down Wonna without knowing all the facts or even attempting to know them or put them into context. I think it does raise an interesting debate though which seems to have ben lost in the last few pages here and that is as supporters what is the best way to support the club? Is it by blindly applauding every move they make? Is it by constantly criticising everything they do? Is it by deriding our own supporter base for being passionless and the club for being soft and weak? I don't know the answer but I think the closest thing we can do to what would be "right" was mentioned a couple of pages ago and that is to defend & support the club at every opportunity conveying a united public front while working things out behind closed doors. In effect it is "don't air your dirty laundry in public". This is what the big clubs do or try to do and it seems to work for them. Others like Richmond who eat their own in public are seen as rabbles and the public perception feeds off itself. I sometimes think what is the best way I can help the club? I have been a member for a long time but don't have any access/knowledge of the inner workings of the club other than what is in the papers or on Demonland. I think the answer is to support them to the hilt but to also question the decisions being made and the direction of the club. This may sound contradictory but I don't think it is. For instance I liked the member survey sent out yesterday as it gave me the opportunity to provide some feedback to the club about where I see us without having to resort to ringing up 3AW or SEN and bag them out on air. I am pretty happy with the current board however there are things they can handle better and although we have cleared the debt I still think our financial position is very bad and needs to improve. We are a proud and strong club with as much history as the game itself. Despite being rubbish for almost half a centuiry we still sit 4th on the premiership table. Despite falling short of the ultimate prize we were still seen as one of the most successful Vic clubs of the modern era until 5 years ago making the finals more often than not. We have had and still ahve our problems but no club is perfect and we are working these out. We have some historical disadvantages but those same things also provide us with other advantages and we need to accentuate the positive and minimise the negative. We are stabilising our off-field position and now have some of the best facilities in the league giving our team and club the best opportunity it's had in a while to match it with the big boys. Hopefully this translates into off-field success and I think it will. The worm always turns it wasn't so long ago Geelong were seen as a rabble, soft "handbaggers" who couldn't get the job done. We will make finals and challenge again soon and when we do we can turn around and rub it in the faces of morons like Denham who will then have moved on to their next whipping boy in a desparate attempt to remain relevant.

A call to the AFL would have achieved nothing. A call to the Herald-Sun on the other hand...

Pretty sure the new AD series and movie won't be out til 2013 but after this many years wait another 1.5 won't be too bad. I love British comedies, much better than the American ones (with rare exceptions like AD). Been watching Misfits & Inbetweeners recently as well as An Idiot Abroad and am downloading Psychoville to watch (made by the same guys who did League of Gentlemen). I've seen one ep of Peep Show on FTA was very funny gonna have to download that series as well. I've seen the first 10 episodes of BB series 4, just gotta watch the last 3.

Haha and on that note Arrested Development one of the best US comedies of recent years are making another 9 episodes plus a movie! Happy times all round. Agree with the rest of the shows mentioned love BB and nothing beats Sopranos. I have The Wire, Mad Men, Sons of Anarchy and Deadwood downloaded and ready to watch just gotta find the team. Seen season 1 of Dexter and was very good but haven't watched the rest yet.

This should maybe go in the membership thread but considering we only have 15 games at MCG/Docklands compared to 18 last year will this be reflected in membership prices? I am a Trident member and the cost has gone up about $45 since last year yet we have access to 3 fewer games.

Yeah the positiver though is an extra hours sleep after a big night out on Friday/Saturday.

Pretty sure as part of the new rights deal all NAB cup games are on Foxtel.

They were showing games on Australia Network earlier this year when I was in Fiji.

It'll be at the G or Docklands we will play Port in Darwin. What's the odds $cully doesn't front up for that game?

The mid-season break is split over 3 rounds though with 6 games each weekend. While it could be possible for us and the Dogs to both play there and have a week off it would mean Port playing there two weeks in a row which probably wouldn't happen.

It's still only 1 game a year against Port, it's just that we will play them there every year instead of only 2 years out of 3.

The phrase no [censored] Sherlock comes to mind. There's a reason why our players always trailed their opponents and refused to push hard running for team mates to create options etc. It's either they are not fit enough or just plain lazy. Glad it's the fitness because laziness is harder to fix. Thank god we have a FD in place now who can at least identify the problem and take it from there.

I would look at the same thing, particularly if we don't see any real value around our 52 & 54 picks. Considering this is meant to be a weak draft if there's nothing that takes our fancy I'd upgrade at least Nicholson this year and maybe Evans as well.

I wouldn't trade out a player just because he had a good season, you have to weigh these things up. Martin had a very good year in 2011. However I think the perception was greater than the reality, that is it maybe wasn't as good as everyone is talking it up to be. This is true not just of people within the club but around the league. Now I've seen players have good seasons like this before and people think they will go on to become superstars. Case in point players like Brad Miller, Cam Bruce etc. The truth is most of the time these players do not improve beyond their "breakout" years and in fact have reached their potential. If I had to make a considered decision I'd probably say Martin will be similar to this. He may not be and I hope he continues to improve but if I had to guess I'd say he'll probably plateau rather than continue an exponential improvement. Another consideration is we do have Jamar as first ruck, Gawn as a developing ruck, Spencer as a back up and now Mitch Clark. Given this it could be seen that Martin may be expendable. You wouldn't delist him or give him away for nothing, but if another club is interested and we are able to nab a decent midfielder or crumbing forward for example then you'd have to weigh up your options. By no means should you throw the baby out with the bathwater, but had we decided to shop guys like Miller or Bruce around earlier in their careers rather than right at the end we probably could have got something decent in return and something probably above their real value. But we have decided to keep Martin on and I am not unhappy with this decision. I hope he continues to improve and think he could play a role. I just won't be disappointed if he doesn't go on to become as good as Naitanui who some people here seem to be comparing him to. EDIT: I also agree with you about the loyalty part which is why these decisions have to be weighed up.

Martin could get progressively better to the point where he is a real weapon. He also could plateau and may not get better than he showed in 2011. I agree with stevethemanjordan, we were all excited about Martin's 2011 because of the low expectations, not because he became a gamebreaker. That's not to say it wasn't impressive but we shouldn't get caught up in thinking that he is going to be the next dominant big man of the comp. It is for this reason I suggested a couple of months ago he be trade bait as his value is high right now and possibly as high as it will get.

I agree with your post with one exception. I think Martin probably could hold down a key defensive role to play on the guys like Kreuzer, Jolly, Ottens, Cox etc who are rucks resting forward. He played defense in his first season to some success, I agree he is not a natural footballer which is why I would prefer not to see him played forward but defensively I think he has the athletic ability to shut down an opponent. Obviously if he has a guy like Rivers or Grimes helping him out as 3rd man up ala Maxwell it will help even more. My only query with this is his disposal as more and more you need guys with very good disposal coming out of your back half so you don't turn the ball over for an easy scoring opportunity.

Yep Watts has the talent to be a good playmaker but has too much goal sense and nous to be wasted too far from goals. He can pinch hit down back when Martin is rucking but would keep him forward for the majority of the time.

We do have a lot and I'd expect to see a couple at least moved on next year (Fitzpatrick, Spencer). At the moment I'd have Martin as a KPD as stated but if McDonald or Davis come on then they could easily replace him (McDonald particularly). This would leave us in an enviable position of being able to trade out Martin for something decent as as we saw this year versatile rucks are always in demand. We had to get a big guy to fill a hole up forward and couldn't really afford to wait a couple more years for Cook to hopefully come on. We do need to start stocking up our midfield though and you'd assume this would be the aim of this and coming drafts. We had an advantage though knowing Viney and two compo picks are up our sleeve (and possibly Stretch as well down the track though it's too early to tell with him yet).

Who did he think we should have gone after? O'Hailpin? The only problem with the Stef to KPD argument is what happens when it's his turn in the ruck? Can't send Jamar back there so will have to try and reshuffle our defense when that happens and try and limit his ruck duties to relieving for 5-8 minutes per quarter.

These are my thoughts as well. Clark FF with Jurrah and Davey at his feet, Watts roaming CHF with Howe/Petterd/Sylvia/Green/Trengove rotating off the flanks. Stef Martin to take the Cloke type forwards and resting ruckman in defense. He did well there in his first season and I don't think he ever really got the hang of playing a key forward role, not to mention his lack of accuracy with set shot kicking. I would rather see Martin on Cloke next Queens Bday than Rivers again. It also frees up Frawley to play a more attacking defensive role and allows Garland and Rivers to play the medium/small defender role with Rivers floating across as third man up similar to Maxwell. It also gives us some flexibility to throw Watts behind the ball as a playmaker and put Martin at CHF to swtch things around. With regards to Gawn, I wouldn't want to lose him and what happens will depend on his development. If he comes on next year and demands a starting spot then we could look at trading Jamar if he has some currency, possibly bundled with a comp pick or 2. I'd prefer to hold on to Jamar but if it comes down to a choice between he, Martin & Gawn, he'd be the first on the block due to his age.

As long as Schwab keeps his nose out of the FD and focuses on admin duties, I think the job is his. The FD is now stacked with experience let them do the job they were hired to do. Regardless of whether he was gone before 186 the work he's done since then is tremendous and I think he should have all but redeemed himself. All we need now is to secure the front of jumper sponsor and he will have helped totally turn the club around off-field (with the obvious help of Stynes, Lyon & McLardy).