Adam The God

I'm loving it. It's hilarious. And it's great watching everyone giving it to Carlton and Maclure. The way they're patronising Carlton reminds me very much of the way everyone has patronised us for the past decade. They do it, because they hate us, and they do it to Carlton because they hate them too. So it's a compliment of sorts. Anyway, really enjoying this. I don't think there's any chance Barker will get the gig. Didn't think so before this game and it's now been confirmed. They've been pathetic. They are in for some more pain, Carlton and I'll be loving it. If they try to cut corners again (ala Judd), it will only wallpaper an ordinary list. They have to do the rebuild properly this time, which means probably 3 to 4 more years in the wilderness.

Thought not. Thanks mate. So it shouldn't have any impact whatsoever.

Did Billings even play against us last time?

They probably weren't a great side to choose either, OD, unless she started barracking in 1999. They're in a bit of trouble despite beating us with their young kids. Our blokes just didn't turn up to play. Maybe there's a chance she'll jump back in the next 5 years.

That's true, OD. But unfortunately, as you well know, these things take time.

You cannot discount where these two clubs have been in recent history though. One played in Grand Finals in the last five years and still has a core of players from that team playing, so a strong culture has been in tact and been able to nurture the young guys coming through. The other club fielded the worst team in 2013 I think I've ever seen, has won about 20 games in seven seasons and had deep rooted cultural problems across the entire club, as near as two years ago. There's absolutely no point in comparing them. St Kilda have a couple of nice, young players, but we've built a core over the last two or so years that will far supercede their crop. This week will see another tight game and possibly a Melbourne loss, but over the next 5 to 10 years, I think you'll find we'll be dominant. We're moving in the right direction and are currently about on par with St Kilda, although they're probably slightly more consistent due to their core group of leaders from the Lyon era. But we've closed that gap significantly in 12 months and it will only improve next year, whereas St Kilda may lose one or two of their experienced leaders. I think when this happens, you'll find they'll dip in form.

It's character building, Nash.

I could relate to a lot of that. Certainly sounded like us between 2007 and 2013. In board fighting, administrative instability, a crap first and second team. It becomes all encompassing. Success really does trickle down from a well run administration and make its way through the entire club.

Not in every situation, but the vast majority, certainly.I say this often, but I coach at a private school in the traditional Melbourne heartland. Barely a demon in sight. Very scary. Success is what will ultimately bring kids back. There are some that are stoic, tough individuals who I very much admire, who will continue supporting despite poor performance. Unfortunately, these kids are in the minority.

My old man was always pretty firey when I was young. I got my loudness off him, now he's mellowed and I'm the crazy one. I never walked away from games that we lost saying that was a bad experience with him. I walked away saying losing was a bad experience. I think it's totally a horses for courses situation and everyone is different. If your side is relatively successful, as we were when I was growing up, that's all that matters. You will want to go again if you win. I can absolutely see how some kids would be put off though. Particularly, if you were a kid in the last 10 years or so.

If it's true that Treloar was offered the same deal as Shiel, it's clear that they prioritised Treloar too, but he either wanted more money or had his heart set on returning to Victoria or both.As for Treloar lacking x-factor, I completely disagree. He's fast, hits the scoreboard and wins a heap of the ball. He's already in the elite category for mine and was there last year too. Treloar will be in the top 10 midfielders in 3 or 4 years time. He is a gun, who is probably down on form slightly this year, which tells you something, given his ability to put up big numbers consistently.

You're lucky, mate. I've been with my girlfriend for almost 9 years. Still haven't been able to convert her. If she'd gone for almost anyone else besides Hawthorn, I reckon I would have been a chance to convert her, but alas they pump us every time and win the flag every year.I just have to bide my time.

In all seriousness, I'd be offering $700,000 to Prestia and Treloar. Think 6 year deals. They are young and A grade talent already. Add them to Brayshaw, Hogan and hopefully Petracca, support from Jones and Vince, and that's a seriously good midfield. Then there's Viney, Tyson and VNB.

Tongue in cheek, OD.

Well, see, this is where I'm different. I much prefer to antagonise the locals (as I did in Adelaide and Geelong). It's the main reason my family are concerned that I sit with them.

I won't be giving my kids a choice, OD. You're a demon or you don't go with me (or more aptly - you're dead to me).

Sit in the good seats, but be noisy about it. Hope the younger fella enjoys it and that our mob put up a respectable display. We don't need to lose any more young members.

We'd be in trouble if they try to enforce some new rules in this area. Our contested style keeps us in games that we would otherwise be blown out of the water in, due to our below standard skills.

Yeah, it was about keeping the ball in motion the whole time. It also throws the opposition off and doesn't give them time to set up defensively. But it requires each and every Hawthorn player to know exactly where there are and where they should be at all times. They also must have the skill to execute these skills quickly and precisely, otherwise you can prevent Hawthorn from scoring.

I've always wondered why there isn't more innovation though. It seems most coaches are pretty conservative. For example, how would a team defend the following: we clear out our forward 50, pushing the rest of the forwards up to the wings, with the exception of Hogan. We have a one-on-one inside forward 50. If the opposition team lose the clearance, we have a one-on-one and if the ball hits the deck, it's up to our blokes to get back and offer support to Hogan. The opposition could simply drop another defender back on Hogan, but we'd then have an extra number at the stoppage, which you'd hope, with smart decision making and spread, we'd be able to utilise to our advantage. The other way the defending side could choose to combat this, is by having a defender playing midway between half forward and the goal square. Once we win the clearance, he zones off to the square to provide a two-on-one. If his team wins possession, he can provide run off half back instead. Anyway, I don't see why something like this isn't tried. It's basically a slightly different take on Pagan's paddock, but if your mids use the ball well, it'd be very tough to defend.

Let's talk stats, shall we? So Patrick Dangerfield averages early 20s for disposals for the last three years and averages one goal a game. Dion Prestia averages late 20s for the past three years. Who would you prefer? Sorry, the article on the AFL website 'Is Patrick Dangerfield worth the hype' got me thinking.

I hope we're following our own blueprint and not somebody else's. I thought that was the learning from this thread. We want to be inventive. I hope Goody has what it takes.

What are you talking about? Are you suggesting we trade Salem? A highly skilled left-footer, who is tough at the contest and makes good decisions. He'd fit in nicely at Hawthorn and he fits in perfectly at Melbourne.

I think this was more about Roos' game style influence on the competition (Sydney, Freo, Melbourne), rather than just an attack on Melbourne.

Fascinating. Bomber Thompson was just asked on AFL 360 whether Paul Roos' game style is good for football. Robbo tried to get him to say it wasn't, but Bomber said, no, Roosy's style is not only stoppage football. He claimed Roos opened us up earlier in the year and that our ball movement has the capacity to be very quick. When they start to 'get it', Roosy will open us up even more. I mean, we knew this, but some on this thread have seemed to dispute it. We should expect next season to be scoring more heavily again. Last year we were defensive-minded, worrying about lowering the opposition's weekly score. This year we are trying to find a balance between defensiveness and offensiveness. Next year we will look to increase our ball movement, by adding pace to our list in the off season and more skill.