beelzebub

drafting inst down to Neeld, this is a straw argument really. Theres a whole dept charged with drafting. ALl Neeld did was to highlight the nature of the holes on our list..the Recruiting dept did the rest. Mindyou blind freddy ( and indeed most of us here ) knoew the nature of the difficiencies of our then list. the good or bad of Neelds coaching is team play and scoreboard. Both woeful

I find all this quite damning really. Damning of our vision and any implementation of interim ( bridging ) developments. Is this seriously what weve done, recruited experienced hands to play Magoo-Ball !! Whats the point of that ? I thought part of their job description was to provide onfield ( in game ) mentorship/leadership/calm . Yes its unlikely theyd all be there ( 1sts ) at the same time often but to see any of this supposed value just awash down the gurgler furthers my thinking that the brains trust arent that strong suited on brains. Im seriously struglling to discern a logical path that this club might be taking to go forward. Why is so much going wrong ( at Melbourne ) and a lot going right at other clubs? why are we inevitably continually coming back to this question ? By way of , what I though an interesting ( almost ) parallel I watched a program the other night on the Desert Wars. Tobtuk -El Alamein etc. The allies were toing and froing for many a battle here. Rommel was getting the upper hand more often than not. The Allies in the end came under criticism for having an essentially ineffectuall higher command . It was making poor and slow decisions. . Its was wasteful of itss resources. This unfortunately in war means lives. . Men , let alone weapons were being wasted because the people high up who needed to make clear and hard decisions in a very timely manner werent. it was shown that many of these commanders were products of the old school of British officialdom...A bit too much ra-ra and less getting on with it. Churchill arrived at the front and was livid, furious that we were unable to get the job done. The team was good but the leaderhsip wanting. He changed it. In Montgomery out Auchinleck. Montgomery was a hard nut. He didnt quite like the notion of backward stepping unless it was a very temporary thing done whilst working out a better way forward. He was a fitness nut. The troops instead of resting were put to extra pt. Montgomery took the very same troops that were being hounded and beaten onto victory. anyone else see a curious parallel here ?

forgiven

The thing that concerns me most is is therre any capacity within Neeld to actually get us going or as another poster suggests has he arrived at his limits ( i.e peter principle ) To those that laud what Neeld has done to date as apparent evidence of 'betterment' let me ask you, in all honesty who amongst us couldnt have achieved much of that also. We all had a pretty good idea who needed a kick up the proverbial, we pretty well had concensus here as to who ought to be delisted or moved on. it really wasnt rocket science to achieve that. As to recruitment that has been OUT of Neelds hands in the main and left to others. He can be neither lauded nor lambasted for that. A very simplistic ( granted ) litmus of achievement coaching wise is to understand how well one extracts effort and achievemtns out of your charges whilst under your direct influence. This team of our is massively underachieving. I can see no other to call to answer for this than the coach(s) We are like the Titanic 5 mins from the icebergs. Logic suggests you try to miss them. The person(s) steering this ship whilst in their own minds may well be doing so with the very best of intents the course being sailed is frought with dangers. How long do you continue to go backwards before hiting the brakes and changing gears ? This is supposed to be a rebuild but it looks more like a ham fisted demolition job. As sydney handles their refurbs so ought we. Theres no need to reside on the bottom all the time. Many of our list arent THAT bad. On paper who wouldnt suggest we should be playing a hell of lot better than we are.. Please keep inmind all this is a business. In a business world if your CEO, your president you r manager of this that or the other isnt performing, or even if that are somewhat but the figures are damning then someome pays for this, some one is accountable and lives or dies on the merit of success. Success....im sure none at teh club can remember that concept anymore...its been so long. Those that were supposedly brought in to influence by way of their experiences have in fact fallen vicitm to our malaise instead. How long do you wait ?

Why does anyone really give a flying fig about this spud anymore. We off loaded this overarated judas and for mine have got the better of it. We surely have more to concern ourselves about than another piece of media [censored] stirring. We all know it was a semi mistake to have taken him but whats done is done and pick wise we recovered value quite well. All this really shows is we gett very little right at Melbourne and hindsight shows he was but another cockup. Hopefully now with the likes of Jason Taylor having a hand in future directions of drafting we wont be so inept. Even recent picks are yet to be proven beyond dount but look a lot more promising Spud Scully is done and dusted, surely we can move on. Its like this forum , as is our club is perennially trapped in the tarpits, unable to move forward

you are a buffoon. obviously... Lets attempt to shy away from what was asked of you. Obviously you didnt read much of what was written before otherwise youd know the answer. How about the team concentrate on what it can do, on what it can affect rather than some pie in the sky ambitions to a game style it obviously falls flat at attempting. If you dont have the ball you get the ball. We lose games through a simple happening. The oppoisition has the pill a lot more than we do. And when they do have it they tend to retain it and do more scoring. I really have no idea what Neeld does all day....I do think developing a winning style isnt part of it though. I would be only too happy to see this team turn around. To eat words and see Neeld triumphant . You see I really dont care less who plays for us or who coaches us. I only want a competitve and ideally premiership winning team in red and blue....all else is superfluous really. What I do care about is the constant dilution of anything resembling a football team in our colours. What do I want Neeld to do.?? maybe have a total rethink, what hes accomplished to date is SFA !! Anyone who fails to learn is doomed to repeat.

care to make sense? want to frame a question in the context of the direction you point ? what you might be undervaluing is the ONLY time that matters...is those 4 qtrs. now care to ask something relevant

UH you seem to be missing much here then. In simple terms here it is MN and co rave about the progress and quality of training. Team has stepped up.( by their accord ) team seems able ( according to the club ) to carry out the plan at training and practice...their summation...not mine team gets flogged.... Neeld...well fmd I didnt see that coming...dont understand how that happened...unable to corrolate training to gamedays !! Now this isnt my interpretation...this is what happened...its what he uttered. So do I not take him at his own stock ?? Do I think we are up with the big boys ? No way...Am I surprised we are as pathetic as we are ? You bet. We should be better than last year....we're worse , without much to give comfort. I can only surmise that the clubs benchmarking is way off mark. I also think , at least now suspect Neeld is out of his depth. Game day changes are way WAY too slow. What I think many are unduly doing is suggesting this game is very complicated. It isnt, not that complicated. Much is being made of the supposed game plan ( is there one ) as opposed to application of the basic fundamentals of the game. i.e Tackling, more tackling, second efforts ( ever more first might help ) , shepherding , hounding of opponents etc.. This seems lacking in enormous amounts. Game plan aside the fundamentals are the responsibility of coaching and training. Why are we inept. Why are we incapable of understandig trajectories of play and massing at these points. Why do Melbourne players handpass to stationary temates already tagged ? Why do players kick to opposing players ? Why is the coach adamant ( seemingly ) about coercing the current players to run to a plan which they are obviously incapable of instead of developing a plan that they can and growing it ?? Im really starting to wonder whether he has the slightest clue at this level. There is only ONE litmus.... the scoreboard....its daming. Shows not only cant we win a p!ssup it indicates we are running out of legs prematurely, all this despite our supposed athletic ability being better than past years according to Neeld and Co. Neeld it would seem is either an unpolished genius, and totally misunderstood or a modern day sporting Abagnale. Nothing indicates any line of imnprovement. The degree of thrashing at the hands of Malthouse might show where we are...or more poignantly where Neeld is. Ive yet to see a team thats switched on this year... you can be underdogs, underlings, vanquished but you can still be mentally at the contest.. We hardly show were at the same game !!

I would even go as far as to say this is very much the case. My point however goes to the notion of how is it so many players are left flatfooted mouth agape with out nary ( it seems ) a clue as to what to do next . Training is surely about scenarios and accomodating differing outcomes to ones that might be those drilled. If Neeld is training his men in the singular view that you would encounter only one level of adversary then that would be foolhardy bordering on delusional. I cant imagine this is the case..i.e a variety of 'levels' would be considered and practiced. In this case players OUGHT to know what they are supposed to be doing when things are either going in their favour or diametrically opposite. Neeld was aghast ( let alone surprised ) that training outcomes were emulated on game days. We all know real v training can be very different so why the surpise Mark ? If they are all at sea then either the training isnt nearly as good as the FD thought or the comprehension just isnt there. The whole point of training is to eradicate eh acttual neccessity to 'think' too hard come crunch time. The idea is to just react ( do ) not think. What worrie me about all this is I dont think the FD have nearly as good a handle on where things are and ought to be as they profess. And this all comes back in spades to the ideologies and abilites of firstly the coach ...and then all his minions. Despite the mutterings of the club the scoreboard suggests things are not clued up as suggested.

All this seems at odds with the mutterings that have eminated from the fd. Coach et al would have had us beleive that all the trainging was smick. Neeld and co were very satisfied with how the team trained and drilled. I must say I didnt see much of this at my limited viewings but Im going to take Neeld at his words. He has been on record at saying he cant understand how the team has been unable to translate wha tthey COULD do at training and match practices to game day. So they on one day understand what they are supposed to do...and on another they look like geese. Something is obviously wrong with this...sommeone is telling fibbies perhaps. The acrid stench of sewage is prevalent i suggest !!

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have a beer and wave a 64 pennant for me then

I take issue. Theres a difference between calling it "quits" so to speak... and just not being botherered with subjecting oneself to dissapointment and pain. I will always support Melbourne, indeed be a member, whilst such a Melbourne based club exists, but I really just cant be stuffed with the current incarnation of this club. Ive never seen a premiership in all the time ive been a Dee, and thats since feb 1965. We have been truly competivie for very few seasons in that time.. Our modern history is deplorable. Our current ability is laughable. I suggest the epitome of 'denial' is the MFC.

is it inconceivable to simply not go ?

if I may comment upon Olds response. Neither of us are reliquishing our support of the club per se. We both fervently want a proud and successful Melbourne as part of this game we love. We,,,or rather speaking for myself am just tired of the rubbish. Theres better things to do in life than pul lyour teeth out and nail your hands to posts in some sort of puiblic show of unconditional love of the Demons. Im now a totally conditionally driven supporter. Ill go when I can be bothered,and for 2013 thats likely a write off. Maybe the last game watched ( Essendon ) was the final straw. Time spent away from the game has been rewarding. I have no more sado masochistic in me. what anyone does is up to them. I choose happiness and pleasure . If the MFC is ever capable of delivering some modicum of this then I will get interested. til then im sorry...the MFC currently represents a waste of time and energies. a sad thing to say....so be it

strangely the basest fundamental in competitive sports coaching is success. i.e I deem Jades comment innocuous yet damning. This in itself goes to the notion noone realy knows wtf they are doing at Melbourne. To any one at the MFC capable of listening... talk is rubbish....results are everything. We can see the results. Time for the diahroetic verbal leakage to stop. We arent all stupid. We can tell the difference between a win and a loss and we can see a trend for what it is. Jackson....sharpen and swing !!!

as a parting comment before I go enjoy a real life. I believe everything that this club stands for and is gauged by effectively boils down to a singulairty. It was uttered by our illustrious coach. " to make Melbourne the hardest team to play against " The reality is we are by many standards the easiest. No one take us seriously. I dont. I think we're a pathetic joke of a team . By most standards we ought not even bve in the AFL. We're past being the laughing stock we are now only pitied. I was initially prepared to back Neeld for I thought he had the ideas. He had grit and nuggetiness to get down amongst it; to call spades spades etc. I have no idea whats gone wrong , or rather it would be easier to note what has gone right... practically nothing. Whatever he ( MN) is doing its not working. It would have been unimaginable that we could go backwards but we have. That has to lay squarely with the coach. This then makes me wonder what Craig is doing as a Mentor come overlord of the football dept ?? I will have no qualms should Jackson take the scythe to this club. There is some sort of cancer in this club. The more it supposedly changes the more it remains the same; successless !! I swear even if you were trying to be abysmal the law of averages would afford a better show than we continually deliver So this is a result of design. We are crap as a result of design and prescribed efforts. Those that are culpable must be brought to account, and dismissed. The time for experimentations nouveaux is over. We have to play football, real football, winning football. The word ive left out to present is "proven" We need someone who has actually shown the nouse and ability to coach at this level. Stuff this taking on 'wet behind the ears' types Im sorry Mark, youre time is up. You may not be alone. The game and list are pretty much of your making, so you must take the whack. Now im off theres a real world out there. The MFC will always be dear to me, i will continue to be a member whilst they exist. ( why...I cant honestly tell you. But dont ask me to bother to watch you any more or care much about what happens...not whilst you as a club dont, or seemingly dont. when a player cant be bothered chasing or tackling dont expect me to be overly concerned or take it to heart anymore. We suposedly have talented players. Why are so may almost to a man playing below par. Is it the water ? Footy is often described as a game played being mainly between the ears. we seem to take capable young men and turn them into stymied football halfwits incapable of cognitant decision making. If it was one or two you might overlook it all but is seems systemic. In parting heres a message for all those who have have there hand in creating the club as it exists. Stop...desist. Youve done enough damage. If you cant put in 100% , dont put in 1% The club needs fresh eyes and legs. It needs people who know how to succeed not just talk the talk. Mark talks well...coaches abysmally. Not an opinion, an observation of outcomes. We need better, and we need it quickly. 2013 is dead cya when 2014 looms

and yet they have again.Every year its like watching a loved one slowly wither and pass. Year in year out our emotions are drained..all by round 4 or 5. Theres more rewarding things in life. Go Dees....please, one day !!!

suffer ??? but ive found the answer ...lol Im am home OD , back in wonderful Melbourne....home of footy and our every changing weather and ongoing sporting sufferance lol Ive just come to realise I cant take any of this seriously any more. I might one day... that day will be when 18 players on a filed in red and blue do. Til then I shall now remain happily paid up but aloof ...and SANE

So yesterday afternoon I suffered high-tea at the Burj Al Arab. And now im home. Im not sure which is the more surreal experience, Dubai...or these forums.....have i missed much ?? I must admit I thoroughly enjoyed not giving one modicum of care about the team or its fortunes for three weeks. Im thinking this is the only sane way forward for me to barrack and support this outfit for some time going forward, and thats not to give a hoot. I stayed calm, I was apparently easy to communicate with, fun to be with. ...and I was/am happy. My only regret was not having a Banana dacquiri yesterday...but the champagne sufficed admirably !!! I can understand Eddie everywhere being keen to get a game there ( Dubai )...but id reckon youd get probably a couple hundred expats a brigade of taxi drivers and a camel or two watching !!...still if you want a Rolex, Tag,Omega, Prada, Chanel etc youll be right As an an aside there was even a feral there ( ob expat local ) actually wearing a Pies Jumper...wtf ????? Theyre everywhere

You could do a lot worse than give Barass the occasional opportunity to give the pregame rev up. !!!

I dont want anyone on the park who canteen or wont play to their abilities 100% of the time. Sylvia never has...never will. He is not the style of Melbourne 's future. Time to let someone who will be get experience . A much better Experiment for mine.

Redleg for Pres !! he knows how its played !!

Why are so many keen on Garry for pres etc. I simply dont think he is the man for the job period. Is he a play maker ? Undoubtedly. But maybe those days need to end in order for a NEW Melbourne to unfold. So may of the same mistakes get reworked into new directions only to fail. Time for new people with new impetus. Not meant as a slight to GL. Thanks for the help but its time for anew. Simple as that

I know ...its a bit rich huh !! Theres work tobe done...but i feel some new workers ( blood ) is required. Some who can bring clean and unused sheets of paper with them !!