beelzebub

Good to hear ND is open to seriously see what some of thses guys can do.. im on the play Juice first bandwagon, but certainly wont cringe should Warnock get the nod. lets see more of it.

if you can show otherwise...go ahead we can all see what the styles of the Coaches Ive mentined are...and by contrast the efforts of Neale. mate we may disagree on how you view this.. But im certainly not the only one to see it this way. ND has before us all played out a stategy of continually selecting players when well down on form at the expense of youth who whilst may or may not have been much betteer on the day certainly deserved to be in the red and blue out of sheere effort and respect for the jumper, something much lacking by some of the so called leadership groups. but please continue with your throwaway responses. And i have no doubt he wil continue bringing back the bandaged and the bruised, patched up and out they go. yes i know that many a player goes carrying a niggly or some soreness. But thats more akin to cutting of your nose to spite your face. Its a denial denial of reality. We have more chance of wining the cake comp at the royal show than having any influence come september. But in true Monty Python fashion we'll carry on...only a flesh wound.. only half the team out.. tis all right captain the ships fines and we're still on course. who is kidding whom. id have far greater respect for Neale as a coach ( as I reckon he's a pretty top bloke in other regards ).. if he came out and simply said "well she's pretty stuffed" but we'll seize this as an opportunity to find out more about this young bunch and see if we cant set our selves up for a decent second half with the regular suspects better repaired and rested and restored to some useful state of combat. I have grave concern that despite all the rhetoric by the club that some of the guys will come back in underdone,exposed to more injury and so the viscious circle continues...in ever decreasing radii !! If you accept that we probably wont win too many games from here on in.. and fair enough if some dont, butif you did adopt that position, does it really matter if we lose another 4-5 games this half if we can learn something truly useful from it. Sheeds did this years ago and as they say the rest is history. I suppose only time will tell and we can all review with 20/20 hindsight.

good at bending words arent you... youre the one on the power team bent.. ive simply said they have won premierships and we havent...and thats what i would prefer. Your grasping at apples and calling them pears, but dont let that assuade your ability to confuse your OWN words with what others are actually saying. Nice tactic. Some of us here question any legitamcy to Daniher warranting any more years , whether its one...two..or any . we offer up his mediocre record and you offer up other clubs succeses. Possibly only yourself knows what on earth you ar eon about. Most of the rest of us see it as plain case of Danniher having had his time and failed and thats all. As a consequnce we suggest a new face with new methods...maybe some of those like other clubs that actually win things. So you can keep your non sensical arguments.. most of us can reason through it..and see common sense. The common point of view I would suggest is a new coach in 2008..and a serious reappraisal of what we fall talent here at Melbourne. RR you use the words fact a lot..but offer none. bloat away !!

they have won cups...we have won nothing...youtr point ?? Id rather a few up and down years which incorporate a premiership or TWO...and have down times...which is naturally cyclic...than that which we've gone through !! ND's reign has produced nothing ...but thats probably further hyperbole...please keep ignoring the obvious. """There has been no truly consistent "power" sides. And during that time MFC have risen and fallen so relative to who they play and when determines whether the win or loss could have been expected or was a turn up.""" You're pretty good at that stuff as well..I have no franchise !! :-)

lol.. thats only your opinion I asked a legit question.. just doesnt suit your call...why dont you just admit to that instead of name calling I know we wont agree....doesnt faze me. May I ask..then... do yo think all is well,,,, despite out injuries ?

no facts...!! lol they are there in front of you ...but YOU choose to ignore them. What they tell you is that against the power teams in the comp we have for the main failed on an ongoing basis. Nothing changes.. We wont be a real danger to September until it does change. They my fellow supporter ARE the facts.. they are results..they are what IS.. anything else is conjecture and interpretation. But is you want to colour it pink and orange and call it success ...go ahead fact..we have won 12 flags we all know them..1900 1926 1939 1940 1941 1948 1955 1957 1959 1960 1964 since then our only two tilts at the cup have resulted in absolute floggings wooden spoons 1906 1919 1923 1951 1969 1974 1978 1981 1997 and currently languishing on the bottom !! we have only ever won less than 47% of all games.. and keep in mind that will be tempered by our halycydon eras. So in the modern era we arent travelling too well id suggest, and im being very lenient about this year so what facts would you rather I look at ??

i'l lask this then .. How prudent is it whenyou know that some of your stalwarts ( supposedly ) might be carrying a niggle...and that they wil be forced to play more game time that you DONT augment them with MORE fresh legs. Forget for the moment any notion of actually winning but of surviving to fight a better battle another day. he is reluctant to play the kids !!! he has only ever done so by circumstances of adversity...he is unlike Malthouse or Sheedy or Mathews who make this a feather in their repsective bows. He doesnt do it when he can balance it better , he is simplisticly REACTIVE...has no understanding of being PROACTIVE....certainly no evidence i can discern. And thats the real shame for we may have really gotten somewhere at times if we had take the Demons to the game, instead of letting the game come to us !!

1 Adelaide 35.71 2 Bris Lions 45.45 3 Carlton 61.54 4 Collingwood 66.67 5 Essendon 35.71 6 Fremantle 43.75 7 Geelong 38.24 8 Hawthorn 46.67 9 Kangaroos 60.00 10 Port Adel 57.14 11 Richmond 46.67 12 St Kilda 62.50 13 Sydney 44.44 14 West Coast 46.15 15 W Bulldogs 60.00 overall all 49.5 % wins what might that al be some ask thats ND's coaching record to date... the percentages are our wins agianst respective teams you might note that the only real success we have is against Carlton ... and certainly not receently , Collingwood .... well we can savour that !! . ...Roos .... who cares Saints .... not something to really take to the bank as they are as frustrating to their lot as we are to ours !! and the Bulldogs...expect that to change. Against all others we are more than mediocre. This trend to me suggests there is a failure to learn and/or to change. People ( players ) come and people go....save one in particular !!.. and our wobbly ol wagon keeps bumbling along....going where ?? we're heading towards another 2003 debacle. what is it they say...those that fail to learn the lessons of history are doomed to repeat it !!

I dont think there'd be that many amongst us here who would not concede ol Reverend is between a rock and a hard place. he is very much on a hiding to nothing this year ( and if I can think of another relevent poignant cliche I'll add that in later..lol ). But before you all start uttering "all bets off '.. consider who has been largely responsible for the creation of either the rocks or hard places. None of this is particularly overnight. Our instability and suspect performances are nothing fresh out of the box. We've seen them al lin some form for 10 yeaars now. Yes you could look at this year in isolation and begin to think its all just damn bad luck, poor MFC, poor Danners...poor us !!..or You could view this year as a aberation of form , from an availability standpoint , in so much as all the injuries seem to be striking hard. Some argument could be made for saying "well how do we know that we might not have played better had all been available?". But on what evidence would you come up with an answer much different to past results ? Certainly the preseason practice and NAB werent much to get excited about. When faced with limited evidence one becomes forced to look at trends and other evidentiary clues as to how you could create a realistic appraisal of current circumstances. What happens at Melb from a game/manpower utilzation standpoint is often slow and predicatble , all done with such a variance of skill and application it has given rise to the oft quoted despondent question.."which Melbourne is going to turn up ? ". Melbourne would have to be one of the easiest teams to coach against. You know ND wont go too far out of his comfort zone, will be very reluctant to try anything maverick, to deny the opposition a sense of understanding. As an up and coming player you wont be expecting to many phonecalls , and for some they just wont ever come You 'll languish on the sofa question how 'him' or 'him' stil gets a guernsey when playing like cr@p !! You'l know the nature of the board will be to all but dismiss the actual game as any of their concern or responsilbility, but continue the age old wisdom that all will be fine in the end.. I think its wonderful in a way that the Rev has seemingly endless patience and faith in his charges, that they have the ability and where withall to turn it around. But does this work ? History suggests ..NO !! This suggests a number of things to me, one he is a little too patient in his requirements of a return on this faith and secondly that he himself isnt driving and demanding more and instead allowing the team to be responsible de facto for the results alone is the next best thing to a cop out. Armies are armies...but they need to be lead well , instructed in usefulness and guided by good strategy. Give the same ingredients and occasion to two different chefs and you wil probably come out with two different dishes made to two deifferent recipes. One works, and the other is only SO-SO at best !!. So whilst the Heralds article is a wonderful statement of the bleeding obvious it actually skirts what the real problem is at Melb and that my fellow supporters is that we lack any real success, there's no silverware to shine !!!!

my point was satirical towards the origianl post.. it presumed all was well as history was about to repeat itself.. I simply proposed that if so then a new coach was on the horizon and THIS is where the hope is

before we worry too much about gameplans .. Id just like our team to have skills !! silly little things like kicking, marking and handballing, shepherding, backing up and on .. all too a high level !! when we have these down pat...maybe we worry about the next level.

this supposed whizbang plan was actually brought to bear.,.. in practice matches and NAB cup..where it shone as magnificently as a black hole !!

so is the point about history repeating itself and the promise of hope presupposed upon the merit that we then get a change of coach ?...as thats what happened !! :D

Theres a lot more truth in that remark than many here would care to believe....or agree. !!!!

in the same way we disect what players are capable of ..so can we with Danners... 10 years is a pretty fair sample to work on. He's not taking us to a premiership anytime soon. So why would you perservere with this tact ?

HF: Sylvia Dunn Green ( if fit ) F: Yze Neitz Newton still working on rest

MFC... Flinders St, This Train not going !!

do we actually have a Game Plan... or is it just punch drunk reactiveness ? Judging by our kick ins....there's no plan!! just my observation

all lovely words.. just a point.. no one has ever explained to me just how fans win a game. Fans are passengers The team is the train......we dont dictate/participate...just go along for the ride !!

Boy that smacks it fair and truly on the head, which harps back to effective disposals and skills. A kicked ball will travel quicker than you can run !! Its all about relative appropriateness of all disposals....commonly called "Footy Smarts "...we arent too bright at time !! :-( but thats not leadership....though if leaders were effective in THEIR disposals , it might get catchy !!

was when he had his nice monitor and was making white lines with his finger !! :D

I think the comments Vossy made were along the lines ( logically ) that the midfielders needed to be aware whilst defending and 'someone' needed to drop back into the hole to protect the possible Hall lead. happy to be corrected , but thats what i remember

Whether RR is a recent conver t to this assessment of our real position or not..I like his assesment going forward...and actually agree with him (sorry mate ) that Miller and Dunn despite Jades correct appraisal that they are different, are essentially competing for the same spot. The difference is simply in the way they go about it. Miller seems ( very ybelatedly ) to be morphing into so sort of all round heavy utility. But with neither the true skills or gumption to be a gun CHF. This possie requires two fundamental., ability to mark up and down and a natural hunger to strike at the goals. He has neither..but works at presenting etc. all nice, but little damage done. He has been more hlpful down back but going alone he will be crucified I like RR ide of playing with and without Neeta. Hell we might as well find out a few things as this info is the only real win we will garner this year. a possible sharp end scenario when fit!! Juice Neeta Robbo Sylvia Dunn Yze Now thats some real firepower....well i like it :-) quick edit: for those wondering where Id put Davey.. on the wing or as reboundig HBF

yes and no.. the argument all along has been to get these guys into the mix as early as some signs are showing.. They wont all shine like Pettard... On that basis we had a win tonight..we know pettard is up to it... but had injuries not been the case we could still be wondering ten rounds later having played quite a few other past there use by date.

things that kill us.. cant be bothered to name the players.we all know them... but its really the endemic nature of the faults in our play. Awareness.... you know at times I really wonder whther we have that much...too often they seem to be looking for people instead of instinctly KNOWING where they will (or should be ) ...creates hesitation and opportunities for the op to tackle. time and time again we look like lost souls. Effective disposal....... or lack there of...now Bruce i will name as he's one of the worrst offenders here... all that effrot to get the ball..and evenknows where to put it...then doesnt...or rather doesnt properly.. I mean..you kick to a running player...not over his bloody head etc.. . How many times were poor kicks going straight to sydney... and its not just this week. Handballs ...that are just a bit off...making people stretch unecessarily..or worse putting them under the pump when they should have been strides away. these are BASIC skills.. surely its not too much to ask. There were definitely a few encouraging signs....but were eclipsed by the other week in week out sloppiness. Take a bow Petterd...in fact take two !! well done begs the question though...why did it take so long to get him on the pitch?