Bonkers

10 to pick 7 involving Bugg is a done deal according to Purple & Wallet.

http://www.afl.com.au/news/2015-10-21/indicative-draft-order-your-clubs-provisional-picks-as-trade-period-unfolds

Interesting deal & it's great that the club could still get pick 3 even though the Howe trade didn't go as planned. Doesn't look like we have any chance of trading for an A-grade player such as Prestia next year, but perhaps the club has decided that they will draft the A-Grade talent in rather than trade for it. Seeing as they have struggled to attract a big name trade they're probably doing the best they can with what they have. That is of course unless they have lined up pick 3 & 10 as part of another trade which seems unlikely.

I don't think they will be too concerned about "draft debt" players will just nominate them as a destination club again when the time is right for them. They will most likely go hard at free agents next year & then load up again for the 2017 draft.

I hear what you're saying. I just hope these players have the skills & attributes to go with it. There's not much point if they don't. From my limited knowledge of these 3 players the knock on them all is their kicking. Kicking skills is a big weekness in our list & I'd be happy if they addressed the hardness & skills at same time. Perhaps I am reading too much into but these players improve our depth & that's about it. If that is what the club set out to do so be it.

Just thinking out loud here. So Seedsman is a pick 32 from Crows? What will St.Kilda give to get Freeman? They will have to shake loose a 2nd rounder out of Essendon in the Carlisle trade or give up their current second rounder to Collingwood for Freeman so that Collingwood will to be able to give us two 2nd round picks. MFC would recieve pick 29 from Port for Toumpas & pick 26 from Collingwood for Howe. Collingwood then on trade the Seedsman pick 32 to us. I don't see how we are going to pay for Kennedy if Collingwood want a second rounder for him other than letting them keep pick 32. If they keep 32 we won't have the currency to beat other teams in a trade with GWS. You believe Collingwood will give up two second rounders for Howe & give us Kennedy? It could work but a lot of Clubs are going to have to work together to make it work. Once one club digs their heels in the deal would be dead. I don't see how any of these hypotheticals are going to help us as Collingwood are trading for Treloar & Aish & they will have no picks left to give us anything of note for Howe if those deals go through. We are better off telling Collingwood at the moment you have nothing to give us that helps out position, we are only open to a trade for Howe when you can give us X that you can trade to us to help us get pick 8 out of GWS. Until then we are doing the deal with GC. I think the original plan was to try get involved with the Dixon trade by involving Toumpas, Howe & pick 6 to help satisfy Port & GC. If we deal with Collingwood as it stands it is going to be hard to get all the picks to trade for pick 8 out of GWS. If Collingwood short change us we wont have any currency to do a deal with GC for the original plan. If that happens then there is no point doing any deal with Collingwood as we would be coming out behind from when we entered the trade period.

From memory Neeld etc flew up to meet him on Saturday or Friday night. The paperwork to make the deal offical would have been done in business hours Monday to Friday. Feel welcome to correct me if that's incorrect.

Hopefully that is what occurs. Alternatively we could trade the 2nd rounders to GC as well as pick 6 in a deal to get pick 3 & a player from GC to help them get their academy players (if worth drafting?).

Yes Toumpas, is an example of one other player who has currency, who else? He had nominated Melbourne as his club of choice, there was no need to rush any deal.

Where in my post did I mention an A grade mid? I'm talking about draft position. If you believe the rumours, MFC had lined up a move for GC's pick 3. Now that we dont have pick 25 the only cards we hold are 6, Howe & our 3rd rounder. We would have been better off holding onto pick 25 & waiting so that we have the option to use that pick if it could help us get another trade done. We have less flexibility now to do any other trades if they had arisen & there was no demand for Melksham from any other club, I'm sure he could have waited a week to help out his future club.

It's got nothing to do with whether I rate him or not, that is irrelevant in the context of what I am talking about. The fact is we held all the cards & pulled the trigger on the deal & buckled to Essendons demands when we possibly could have waited to see how the other trades panned out. Now we don't have pick 25 to use in any other trades & Essendon potentially have it over us when trying to get pick 8 from GWS. Draft picks can be over rated I agree, but this isn't just about picks it is about jostling for the best position in the trade period. There were numerous other options possibly available to us with time to try & get other deals done. We could have done this trade for Melksham with 1 hour or less to go in the trade period.

I realise some people think that dealing in that way is being a Dick or being hard to deal with. Some have even said that operating this way during negotiating will get you no where. The reality is we will get the respect we deserve as a club only when we negotiate to get treated in that way. Dodoro cops a lot of crap from people on here but I would much rather someone like Dodoro managing trade deals in this specific instance as he is willing to do whatever it takes to get what they want to better their own cause. It may end up just being all a bluff & bluster but at least there is a line being drawn somewhere if the other party isn't willing to come to the party. With regards to how it feels as a supporter, Roos has said that there is a feeling of negativity around the club including the supporters. Peter Jackson said that he had to win back the respect & faith of the members. In my opinion that respect & faith is won back in these circumstances like this when negotiating for a better deal at the trade table to improve our clubs position. People on here can call me irrational or emotional or whatever they like but the club does need to start being tougher when dealing with other clubs whether it be on the field or off. That is when we will start being respected again. A trade like this goes a long way to building up that trust & respect IMO if done in the right way. If we bend over & cop it from Essendon & Collingwood on the Melksham & Howe trades I don't see how we can be seen to be making progress as a club. As a 10 + year member that is what I expect.

Sounds good in theory, hopefully they can pull it off. Would the Pies let us have Kennedy for a 3rd rounder?

I guess it is possible that we could do a similar trade for our picks that we get for Howe to GC for their pick 3. I don't know if GC have any academy players that they would do that deal for?

Good to see the AFL is heavily invested in equalisation.

Sometimes its better to be a dick, than a [censored]. He will probably end up at the Saints but at least Essendon are forcing St.Kilda's hand.

Yeh he is saying that now, but why else were we negotiating with Gold Coast in the first place if he wasn't happy to move there? I don't think the club would get deep into negotiating a trade without knowing the player is a good chance to want to move there. His manager has said a lot of things, less said about him probably for the best.

Howe had already spoken to Gold Coast & said he was happy to move there which is why the MFC had already organised the trade. Hence why Mahoney is now [censored] off because Howe or his manager has flip flopped.

Dodoro was just on the radio saying that he preferred what Hawthorn had offered up & that St.Kilda to this stage havent offered anything that satisfies them. So he made a veiled threat that if St.Kilda don't offer up what Essendon are asking for he can always enter the PSD. There is a big difference between what Dodoro is saying & what Mahoney is saying. People hate dealing with Essendon at trade time because they are hard to deal with, they are looking after their interests. The only way to get what we want in the trade is to play hard ball & to do similar to what Dodoro is doing. Carlisle & his manager can talk all they want but the clubs have to agree on a trade.

We could do that, what is the difference between the Howe & Carlisle scenarios? Essendon are looking to deal with the clubs that satisfy their needs versus Melbourne looking to do a deal with the club that suits Howe's needs. Mahoney needs to grow a set, that is the difference.

Mahoney will be on SEN @ 430pm & Traderadio @ 445pm so it will be interesting to see what he says.

I don't think it's about immediate results. It's more about building your team around a nucleus of A grade talent. You have too look at it long term & back the recruiting team to find the right players. If they want to move up the draft order to get pick 3 they must be confident that player will be a 200 gamer to build a team around, otherwise I'd agree with you & say there's not much point. So far the new footy department seem to be right about Tyson, Salem, Petracca & Brayshaw so you have to back them in on this decision as well.

Whilst it appears there is nothing too much to be excited about I think the club is building the list in the right way at least. They are trying to fill holes in the list with players of a certain age profile that they think they can get a certain amount of service out of. Hopefully those players will reduce the holes in our list from the bottom 6 players in the 22 & make us a lot more competitive. I will admit that we could do with a star player being drafted but the reality is there is another 15 or so clubs that won't land any big fish this trade period either. Building our list around Hogan, Petracca, Brayshaw & Viney is a good start. Looks like we will have to be patient & see if the club can land someone like Parish to add to that nucleus of genuine A grade undeveloped talent & build our list around those type of players until we get closer to finals & become a "destination club".

I am hoping the MFC dig their heels in over this & demand a trade that works for us first & foremost not Jeremy Howe.

Official, Bennell & 22 for 16 & 35 to Freo. Maybe this paves the way for GC to get the Howe deal done! Edit 22*