old55

Cats emergency list is impressive - Parfitt, O'Connor, Menegola and Ceglar.

"the most effectual ..."

Ch, Ch, Ch, Ch, Changes ... We need a lockdown defender who's strong quick and has sure ball handling - not asking for much am I? We were very shaky when the ball hit the deck in the back 50. I think getting Bowey into the 22 and Salem back to full fitness will help but they're not the lockdowns. All 4 PF teams have dangerous match winning small-medium forwards: Stengle, C.Cameron, Elliott and Papley. Hibbo has done very well but he's on his last legs, I don't think even @Lucifers Hero has the confidence that Jayden Hunt can go with them, Joel Smith has the speed and size but is a concern with his ball handling and is always injured, Trent Rivers has the speed and size and is a possibility but he'd need to improve his defensive work and ball-handling, I think James Harmes has the attributes but we tried him in defense a few years back and he was a failure there. I think our other major problem is that we can't afford to have ANB and Sparrow in transition possession chains because neither of them are clean enough. It would be nice to replace both of them but that's probably not going to happen, ANB is in the leadership group and the FD clearly rates his work ethic. Sparrow is more tradeable anyway - both Adelaide and Port could be interested with Sloane and Boak near the end and Crouch on the outer. I think getting JJ into the 22 in Sparrow's role would be a big help - he's much cleaner than either of them and we also have Chandler in the wings too. As posted elsewhere I think Tomlinson should look for more opportunity, we've lowballed Jayden with a 2 year offer - someone will offer him 3 or 4 years, Toby Bedford would have signed if he's going to - he's off for more opportunity, and as above, I think Tom Sparrow is tradeable. There's some 2nd and 3rd round capital there for a lockdown defender - but I don't know who we should target - suggestions welcome ... I think Will Hamill at Adelaide could be a handy pick-up, he's got some size, pace and is a nice left-foot kick. Victorian too. He has had concussion issues which is a concern. I don't think he'd necessarily solve our lockdown issue but I think he could be a decent trade for Sparrow. He's contracted to the end of 2024, but so is Sparrow.

What BS is this? Grundy averages a contested mark per game, same as LJ: https://www.footywire.com/afl/footy/pc-collingwood-magpies--brodie-grundy?advv=Y And 3.5 marks a game compared with Luke Jackson 2.8 https://www.footywire.com/afl/footy/pc-collingwood-magpies--brodie-grundy https://www.footywire.com/afl/footy/pc-melbourne-demons--luke-jackson Max is the best contested mark in the game (4.5 marks, 2 contested), Grundy is not at that level but he's capable.

I think Freo's starting point for Jackson would be 2022 1st and 2023 1st, no doubt we want more, but Freo supporters on BF and probably Bell want something back. I think it's going to end up close to that with garnish.

"there is no way WC is going to trade pick 2 for LJ" .... 8, 9, 10

How about you go back and read my original post where I said that "WC won't trade pick 2 for Jackson" ie MFC won't receive pick 2 which is the important point. I did not say WC won't do a trade involving pick 2 so they can get suitable picks to trade for Jackson which is an entirely different thing.

West Coast split 2 with GC for 5 and 7 and offer us 5 and 20 for Jackson. Freo's 2 1sts beyond 10 don't compete.

We clearly don't rate Lobb, we've known for a while that Jackson is gone, if we rated Lobb we would have been all over him.

Two years ago, Jeremy Cameron was one year younger than Grundy when he was traded for 13, 15 and 20 with 2 future 2nds back. I think a late 1st is fair value for Grundy if Collingwood pick up 30% of his salary.

There's every chance your namesake will go past him next year.

Because they wouldn't have to to get it done.

I'm very happy for @Grand New Flag to post rumours as long as they don't expect to be taken seriously.

I think one year deals for Hibberd and Melksham probably has to do with the possible exit of other senior list players. Jackson (replaced by Grundy), Bedford, Chandler, Tomlinson all for opportunities. Baker and Rosman (maybe rookied), Hunt - we probably need to recontract him for 3 or 4 years to stave off other offers and one for Hibbo and Melk is preferable.

OK well that's helpful for us because we could cover their deficit with our 4 picks. My numbers include the 20% discount. That's all our picks gone for 15 but we'll get some back for Jackson and some player trades like Toby Bedford, Adam Tomlinson and possibly FA compensation for Jayden - we've offered him 2 years, surely someone else will offer 3 or more. Probably 3rd rounders for all of them.

Brisbane have Will Ashcroft F/S who Cal Twomey rates at pick 1 (3000 pts / 2400 to match) and Jaspa Fletcher F/S rated at pick 16 (1067 pts / 854 to match). That means they need 3254 points to match. They currently have (subject to this weekend's results) 15 (1112 pts), 33 (563), 44 (362), 69 (49) = 2086. Absolute best case scenario they'll get end of 1st round compensation for McStay (948), but it could easily be 2nd round compensation (542). They're going to be way short of points either way. It would be nice to get our hands on 15 in a pick swap, let's say they get the 948 for McStay, that gives them 3034 and still leaves them 220 short. That means they need 1332 for pick 15 (1112) to make up the deficit. We currently have 32 (584), 41 (412), 50 (273) and 63 (112) = 1381 and if we traded all them for 15 to Brisbane it would bridge their gap but I think the AFL require Brisbane to have sufficient list vacancies for the picks so that could be difficult.

Agree. I can see the arguments for and against getting Grundy, but the FD seems committed to getting him and the most likely explanation is that Max is more banged up than we'd like. I think the Jackson trade could drag on while Freo try to negotiate their other deals to set it up. I wouldn't mind getting the Grundy deal done early for our future first with Collingwood paying a 30% of Grundy's salary. Then we can concentrate on some other deals like trading up for Brisbane's first.

Some posters live in dreamland, there is no way WC is going to trade pick 2 for LJ, Freo can't get anywhere near that and WC have the PSD safety net. The best achievable outcome from WC would be a top 10 pick from a split of 2, plus their pick 20. Jackson is going to Fremantle anyway, it has clearly been arranged for ages, WC involvement just keeps Freo honest.

I'm predicting ... Jackson will end up at Freo for their 2022 and 2023 1sts and some net-zero-value garnishing. We'll then trade one of our 2 2023 1sts to Collingwood for Brodie Grundy.

Max said himself that Jackson turned the game

And no 2021 flag.

Do the Dogs have more insight into Collingwood's financials?

No it wouldn't. There must be some existing mechanism in place for Collingwood to currently pay $300k of Treloar's salary on behalf of the Dogs, this is just an extension of that. This proposal doesn't increase the total salary cap across the league or introduce new draft picks that push other clubs back. I think it has merit. There is already the rule in place where a club has to use two 1st round picks over 4 years and that would apply to limit these transactions also.

I think it makes sense for clubs rebuilding through the draft who don't have a list that warrants paying the full cap. Teams like Essendon, North, Hawthorn and Adelaide could accelerate their build by buying in picks with excess cap.

I agree, a KPF drafted now is not going going to help us next year. We already have JVR in the hopper for next year and we're not going in with him and a draftee as our KPFs. There's every reason to believe that we'll get at least a season combined out of B.Brown and TMac each year for the next two years that they are contracted. Together with JVR and two ruckmen that's a full complement of tall forwards. Three years is when we will need a KPF replacement, but maybe this year isn't the right year to be reaching for one at the pointy end of the draft, it's risky with Cadman and Jefferson the only ones rated by Cal Twomey as first round prospects: https://www.afl.com.au/news/832462/cal-twomey-s-phantom-form-guide-top-draft-prospects-august-ranking Maybe someone like Isaac Keeler rated at #29 represents better value and should be available at a pick we receive in the Jackson trade. Additionally we can look to clear cap space and chase a ready-made KPF in the trade and FA market over the next two years. As I posted earlier, we have 11 expendable players coming out of contract over the next 3 years, there's probably $3M or $4M of cap space there: 2022: Hibberd, Melksham, Hunt 2023: Dunstan, ANB, Weideman, Tomlinson 2024: B.Brown, Harmes, McDonald, J.Smith