rpfc

It's just such good news, what makes it even better is that I was never really worried he would bolt. Haven't had that confidence in the club for a while.

And what a huge flaw it is... If I could swap Frawley for a commensurately talented mid - I would do it. But the world doesn't work like that.

Can you name a worse midfield? St Kilda might be, GWS right at this moment, Richmond? Carlton? He's not far off...

I believe the extension will see him paid $500k in 2016 and 2017, not this year or next. So if he plays well next year, he may well be worth it by 2016...

But the otherside of the argument is our midfield is 55/100, if Frawley leaves and Shiel comes in his stead that number jumps and is of more value than Frawley is to that backline - that is the essence of stmj's argument.

Whenever a poster writes the above - I am sorry to say - but I always think I hit the nail on the head. You were trying to tie people who think like stmj in knots about Frawley's worth as a player and the commensurate compensation. But all you have found is a few randoms calling him a spud and over-stating his form issues. You don't have to engage, I don't really care, I am simply trying to add to this situation that is not as simple as some are making out. You make some great points, and so does stmj, but you both run over a few things that need some extrapolation and exploration.

You should just picture another poster with the same arguments that I have - you would give a more nuanced and sensible response. If our backline is running at 85 out of 100 right now without Frawley, he would lift it to around 90 out of 100 but is that the reason we are on '4 effing wins' as you so eloquently point out? Hardly. We are where we are because our midfield is consistently beaten by better players and deeper rotations. If we were to 'raise our bar' as a club - it may involve letting Frawley go so we can invest his worth in the midfield.

I have always agreed with the notion that we will be fine if he leaves - there is even a possibility we would be better, but it is not a fait accompli, and that is why, if Frawley turned around and said 'Paul, I'm signing with the Dees,' we will keep him.

He has already left the backline for 3 months and the defence not only coped without him, but excelled in comparison to last season. Your argument that he would improve our backline is without a doubt true, but his absence from the backline hasn't 'hurt us' this season so why would it hurt us next season?

If anyone has referred to Frawley as a spud they don't deserve to be taken seriously. I think you are going to have to bump those posts that mention he is not worth $400k but then in the next breath mention a top 5 pick. I don't think stmj, or anyone that is happy to see him leave, has said that he is a spud. His point is that the bloke is not worth the same to us as he would be to other clubs. Specifically those who have more midfield assets. The notion that - if Frawley left - the chances the MFC adding to its midfield goes up is irrefutable. He offers the best chance the club can get its hands on another top 5 pick and, in turn, a star quality player in the draft or trade. That's the argument, it has merit, and thus we are having a thoughtful discussion. Only on Demonland!

Jamar's breakout season was his 8th. For 6 seasons he didn't average more than 2.3 marks a game. For 6 seasons he didn't average more than 2.5 kicks a game. In his 5th season he averaged 9.7 HOs a game. For 7 seasons he didn't average more than 22.7 HOs a season. I know these are stats in a vacuum (and to many that's where all stats should end up) but it takes a while for ruckmen to reach the peak of their abilities and Spencer has been afforded 29 games so far. Jamar was able to play 52 games in a different era when back up rucks didn't have to contend with the sub-rule that is inherently biased against 1-dimensional ruckmen. Spencer may be moved on when a suitable replacement for Jamar is identified but that is not something we can just assume will happen either this Summer or the next.

Yeah, that last line. We simply can not, in these next three weeks, allow 40 minutes where the other team are the only ones interested in attacking the game. You go into your shells against the best teams and they will bury you. I am not surprised the players have gone into their shells early against Essendon and the Bulldogs - they have spent 2 years in their shells against all teams. I am pleasantly surprised that they have come out of their shells while the punishment is occurring. It's progress. White knuckled, frustrating progress...

This is where we head into stmj as a glorious genius because if we are to get Prestia/Danger/insertgreatplayerhere it will most likely be because of Frawley leaving a hole in our salary cap and a top 5 pick behind. I just want the surety of it though... But I can't have it. So I am comfortable in the knowledge that whatever happens we will be fine. Unless we don't recruit well... But that's a different thread.

It's simple. Isn't it?

There a few steps between compensation and the midfielder(s) that you would to get - that is something you must admit - it is the blasé sense that this Pick 5/6/7 is better than Frawley... We just do not know.

We haven't played great football since we have been out there...

So you are defending the hypothetical removal of Pedersen and Jetta? You name the few valuable assets we could have got at the point but the chances they would get something worthwhile are infinitesimal. Roos backed himself to get something from these known commodities than risk getting a speculative talent. And as for Spencer - he is a back up ruck, but he did help us win against Carlton and played a few games injured so that Jamar didn't have to be rushed back too quickly. I thought that was selfless and worthy of reward - and he got that reward. If your back up ruck was a world beater, he wouldn't be your back up ruck...

I will mention Boak and Cloke. Criticise his onfield leadership, he deserves it. Criticise his inconsistency. But I for one do not think that a player taking full advantage of his earned FA is failed leadership. This is a very public contract discussion and comparisons to other leaders are fraught. I have heard that Nathan Jones was very close to being a Bomber a couple years ago. Does that make him less of a leader of that group? Or even our club? I don't think it does, he is leading professional football players, and he has been faultless as the face of this footy club in the last few years.

Franklin, to Sydney Hawthorn ain't exactly weak... Betts, to Adelaide Neither is Carlton Sylvia, to Fremantle Bernie would not be here if we were keener to keep this airhead. Thomas, to Carlton Collingwood is the power club. Goddard, to Essendon Your Exhibit A. Young, to Collingwood Who cares? Rivers, to Geelong He was such a hit that Geelong is already looking for his replacement... From your list - Goddard is the only one that fits this 'big clubs stealing from the small' narrative that a few people are worry-selling. Smart clubs are making the most of it - I hope we continue to do so.

Is he? Four years of consistent footy and he is on his last chance after a few games where he has made some errors. I will tell you what is worse than errors, and you alluded to this with the line that follows the above - doing nothing and just worrying about your bloke. I watch Terlich run around and follow Murphy like a hungry puppy dog completely oblivious to the football that just happened past him in the arms of an opposition player. No mistakes made from Terlich there, and yet he was moved off of him? It was like having a 5 man forward line, playing with 17 men... Give me the bloke that goes and tries to get the footy and makes the odd, or more than odd, mistake here and there. I am frustrated because my own team struggles with this concept when playing good teams - if one team has more blokes looking for the footy they are already at an advantage. Bit of a tangent but FML.

It's more "unless we are getting a star FA it's not worth it." We will only be chasing FA if Frawley re-signs right soon or they are star FAs.

Apathetic response...

This seems to me like a whole lot of nothing. I came down very hard on Bartlett after his ill-advised decision to talk out of his arse to Wilson but this just looks like a possible aside while we are working on a few things in our relationship with Melbourne Uni. So I still await a plan that will come in a few months that decides what the Admin wants to do with the base, training facilities, growth strategy, and how it is all starting in earnest after we complete getting the footy side of things in line with what Roos wants.

You can delete posts...

I am giving you the chance for some self-reflection - it's up to you whether you take it on board.