stevethemanjordan

It does seem young at 24-25, I agree. I definitely rate him and he'd be an upgrade on Matt Jones or McKenzie. Hard runner, hard player with better skills than those two and can find the sticks. The more quality we add to our list the better we become and he wouldn't cost the world. As someone said, Cross will be gone possibly next year and given we've lost Blease, Gysberts, Tapscott, Strauss etc who were all in the same age bracket as Selwood, we need to be targetting a proven midfielder to fit in and continue to make it easier for players like Brayshaw and Petracca to develop properly.

Obviously early days but saw this pop up yesterday. Has put off talks. Very achievable get and someone I could easily see us going for to add further depth and talent. Eagle Selwood puts off contract talks to concentrate on form Thoughts?

Garland's ability to play on small, agile and quick opposition forwards as well as your more one-dimensional straight-line leading forward is an extremely valuable quality.Pederson doesn't have that positional flexibility due to his physical attributes and not only that, he just had his best year of AFL football playing as a forward. Why you'd entertain the thought of swapping the two I'm not sure. It's most certainly something Neeld would do. Garland's challenge is to get back to playing as a consistent and versatile defender like he was in '13.

'He's an experienced player, one that we'll sorely miss.'

But seriously guys, just wait until he completes a 'full pre-season'...

There's no rush. The very reason Cross was brought to our club was to teach and inspire. We've learnt from our mistakes. Think about how much better prepared all of our young 'leaders in waiting' will be having learnt for a couple of years from these guys. This is the perfect platform to unearth our next batch of leaders who will really take the club to new heights. Hogan, Viney, Bradshaw, Petracca, Salem etc. We're in a great position.

Your points are valid Sat-man. What a funny thought to think that if we hadn't gone through those terribly dark years, we wouldn't have had Roos as coach. The guy is unbelievable.

You're understanding of the list goes deeper than just a 'training level' TDI... It's not as if every single player starts every pre-season with the same number and level of attributes as their team mate. You're basing your answer completely off this pre-season training. Have games gone by not given you any understanding of skill levels of certain players, strengths/weaknesses etc etc? Pre-season training tells us one thing. The volume of work (namely running and strength work) an individual gets which does benefit their overall game. Of that, I have no doubt. What do you think of the example I gave with Dan Nicholson? I saw him training a number of times and could also say his running ability, dedication to the work and professionalism was exemplary but the proof was in the pudding come game day. He just simply didn't offer enough and wasn't good enough to make it once our list management got their act together.

Thank for your dedication in providing training updates TDI, I enjoy reading them. I do have a couple of queries however. As for the 'lemon suckers', I can't say I am in the same boat that you lump some in when it comes to analysing our list and critiquing individual players like Jordie McKenzie and Matt Jones. In fact I am more than happy to point out their individual strengths. Just as I am happy to point out their weaknesses. Out of interest, with our now new and improved midfield that features greater depth and quality than in previous years, do you see a spot in the 22 for a player like McKenzie? If so, can you outline why? What puts him ahead of someone you've left out? What does he offer that they don't? Is the reason you now regularly point out players on the lower end of the 'skill' spectrum at training, (such as Matt Jones and McKenzie) purely an emotional one due to the fact that you have formed some sort of face to face relationship with the player? Do you think an individuals performance is based entirely upon how much of a pre-season they've completed? You've spoken about the fact that Jordie is having his first full pre-season in a while which you believe will translate to his performance. I agree in some respects and aspects of playing the game. Take Dan Nicholson however. Arguably our best runner whilst on the list and certainly had enough full pre-seasons to give himself the opportunity to cement a spot in our 22. His skill level didn't seem to change regardless of how much or little of the pre-season he completed. He had questionable footskills. He always will have. The same applies with McKenzie in my mind. Anyway, would love a response to my questions written in bold.

Undoubtedly cooler than anything I've read from you of recent.

Don't let it bother you too much, Clint.

Give it a rest. Pretty sure its bordering cyber bullying now.

Or, for an alternative view for all those out there asking about skills... It's a training session. It's not a pressure cooker situation. Anyone attending training will see some surprisingly good kicking skills from players who are more often associated with having questionable footskills. Of that I'm sure. Getting better as Saty says? I'm not so sure. Perhaps. But it's training so really, it's hard to tell. Matt Jones and McDonald will never be fantastic kicks of the footy. I prefer to accept that, knowing that minimal improvement might come but nothing more. It's more about raising the standard around these guys as they have other qualities and attributes that the side need at the moment. The ultimate goal eventually would be to upgrade individuals. For example, Bradley Hill from Hawthorn is as good a runner as Matt Jones, but also has silky skills. I know Saty would love for all MFC listed players to 'make it'. But it ain't realistic, and it certainly isn't going to help the side improve. Continuing to add quality to our list will though.

Noted. I'd say his ability to run all day contributes to the tackle count. He is going to be able to get to more contests with the amount of running he does. An advantage of being an elite runner. In the past he has been someone who has given away silly free kicks due to high tackles but as I've said, last year he really did play some consistent, disciplined football and contributed to the team playing that HF role. He definitely played to his strengths and again that's Roos' ability to get through to him. (He's a seriously special coach). I guess I'm excited by the thought of getting someone who has more attributes to offer up to the required running standard so that they can offer more to the team and I feel like we have a few waiting in the wings. If Roos can get a limited player in Bail playing a consistent brand of 'role playing footy', imagine what he could do with some of the more skilled and talented recruits we have.

This is really hard to do... There are many players who I can't seem to fit in and they're players that would have been staple 22 two years ago. A great sign. For round 1 against The suns I think we need to be playing guys like Toumpas, (as long as he performs during the NAB cup) as we'll need guys who can use the ball well against this mob. We'll need a good mix of inside grunt and outside skills. I remember how easily they moved the ball against us at the 'G' last year once they got their hands on it but I thought we competed really well in the scrap/contested ball. The exciting realisation for me is that we now have many more options for that midfield/half-forward role. Guys like Michie, Newton, Petracca, Kent, Salem, Toumpas, Jones, Bail, JKH etc will all be fighting for that spot. Then we've got the same problem if we're wanting a half-back/midfielder with some of the same guys plus Grimes, Lamumba, Howe and Hunt competing. The competition for spots has gone through the roof over the last couple of years and I'd argue that we've got more talent and individual drive than in previous years when we had players like Blease, Strauss, Gysberts, Tapscott etc. Roos has clearly loaded up on midfielder types with the ability to play HF or HB as well. It's very exciting knowing Matt Jones, Bail or McKenzie are not lock ins. In fact, skill and talent wise, they're on the lower end of the pecking order. It's only running ability that keep Jones and Bail in front and as soon as we see some of our more talented and skilful players build their tanks, we'll see a squeezing out of some of those less talented players. Can't wait to see how some of these guys perform during the NAB cup.

So you're confident we'll see a dramatic improvement in ball movement, inside 50 count, metres gained etc?Basically our midfield will have to be tracking the same as what Carlton's was when Garlett was kicking those bags in 2010, 11 and 13. Carlton finished 8th, 5th and 8th those years. Judd won a brownlow during one of those seasons. I think you're being a bit unrealistic 'jnrmac'.

I'm not too sure, but I have an inkling that it may have been due to the fact that Carlton had a functioning, talented and deep running midfield..Just a thought though.. (But seriously, if Garlett kicks close to 30-40 goals from our midfield next year, I'll be unbelievably surprised to say the least). For those predicting Garlett's total for the end of the year, did you happen to glimpse our inside 50 average for last year? Our midfield, (which will supply Garlett) still has a LONG way to go going by last year's form. Garlett is a dangerous acquisition but he's going to need the ball to come his way quickly and often if he's going to kick 30+ goals.

Im in big boy.

Too many, or one or two? I think the common theme among most is that it's winnable. Not 'in the bag'. Based on end of year results for 2014? Why don't we wait and see how the pre-season form looks. That'll give us a better indication of 'odds'.

Agree. All are winnable. It's mentality as much as anything else. Especially for us. If we win the first two, we'll be riding high and brimming with confidence in heading to Adelaide. The MFC have the worst record of recent starts to the H&A season and the players who have been around for a long time on our list know it. Confidence plays a huge role for those particular players. We have a better list than we did last year with the additions Lamumba, Hogan (regardless of what people say) and Garlett. We have have greater depth and talent running through the midfield with upgrades to our midfield like Tyson, Vince, Michie, Newton and Cross. Two years ago we had Sylvia, Rodan, Magner, McKenzie, Nicholson etc in our starting 22. Sure other teams are improving but we are without a doubt bridging the gap quickly thanks to list management and coaching. None of those games will be blowouts and we are in with a big chance in each of those four games.

From an outside perspective and view of who should be in our LG: Jones (Captain) Dawes (VC) Lamumba Cross Grimes Dunn The first four of those to me are no brainers. They're all highly driven and professional trainers and they're the ones who our younger crop will look up to. Especially on game day. Dawes and Lamumba love to direct and vocalise instruction on-field and Jones and Cross just lead the way with their unrelenting attack and focus on winning the ball. Whilst of course Grimes displays many leadership qualities, relinquishing the captaincy does say something about his own form on game day. As Saty says, I have no doubt that players respect him highly as a leader in some areas of his game, but as far as form goes, you don't want your captain turning the ball over consistently. Im sure he'll remain in the LG and I'm looking forward to seeing him concentrate solely on his own game day performance. Dunn is an interesting one. After his first really consistent year as a full-back, people are throwing his name up as a leader. It seems as though last year has given him a boost of confidence and after hearing him speaking about wanting to display more leadership qualities, I'm glad the penny has dropped for him and I hope last year will be a benchmark for him in terms of competitiveness and discipline levels. The most important thing I see in all of this is that the players who are voted into the leadership group really nurture and show the way for what will hopefully be a really strong younger crop of leaders coming through. It's of utmost importance and will be a big factor in regards to how far we can go as a side over the next 5+ years. Hogan Viney Petracca Brayshaw McDonald Salem Toumpas These players show leadership characteristics and some of them have been leaders/captains at 18's level. We need to see these guys grow and really follow in the footsteps of guys like Jones, Cross, Dawes. They need to adopt the same habits on and off-field. It's exciting because we have some really good senior leaders on our list (unlike in years gone by) and we also have an unbelievable coaching group in Roos, Goodwin and Macca which is something any young team would be envious of. The early signs are good, let's hope we get a bit of luck along the way. Can't wait for Round 1.

I agree he offers more to the side than McKenzie. He's more versatile and played that hard running half forward well last year. His kicking is still a concern for me. If he can perform consistently well this year again, then yes, he'll have surprised me. Roos has utilized Bail's strengths very well to date.

Misleading stat. Do you ever think that due to a player - (in this case McKenzie) - being aware of his weakness at a given skill, (in this case kicking) he will always go a safe/short/backward option for fear of making a mistake which will lift his disposal efficiency making this stat look awfully silly without context? I can assure you that neither McKenzie nor Bail would still be on the list had our club not been so mismanaged in all areas over the past near decade. Again, misleading. Your training reports are fascinating. I enjoy reading them. But when it comes to objectively analyzing and critiquing players in which you have developed personal relationships with, it becomes impossible for you to do. Of course as you say, there are those on this forum who perhaps completely write off/slag off players and the club unfairly. But there are also those in-between who know that once certain players are pushed out of the side or moved on from the club, it'll be further evidence that the playing list is becoming stronger. Your care for each player on a personal level is endearing, but it stops you from seeing the bigger picture. Of course coaches know which individuals need to improve in certain areas of their game. Of course those individuals themselves know that there are areas of their game that need improving. Of all clubs within the AFL we're the one that has lacked the most talent and depth for years now. That is a result of having drafted and developed so poorly over the same time period. Which is a result of having the worst playing leaders, coaches and administrators within the AFL over the same time period. Do you not think that they're the reasons we've had players like McKenzie, Bail, Nicholson, Evans etc on our list for so long? Nicholson and Evans are gone. Why? Because we have now added talent and depth, which is a result of having competent on-field leaders, coaches, recruiters and admin. That will also continue next year. And whilst Jordie will be trying as hard as he can to improve areas of his game with coaches who will be working just as hard with him, the reality is he will not be on our list for much longer. And that is because he does not add enough at AFL level. Neither myself or any other Melbourne supporter needs to be an AFL qualified coach to be able to make that call. Nor do I need a print out of his kicking efficiency average from last year. It's the ability to critically analyze in an objective manner.

Almost sig worthy!

Nobody but supporters will be 'assigning' that status. He'll be played as a KPF alongside Dawes with Pedo and Gawn sharing stints also.