stevethemanjordan

Let's do both.

It sounds like you're trying to find anything you can to put the blame back on Dawes.Dawes inability to gain possession in games last year was a direct result of our delivery inside 50 and the fact that he got far more attention from opposition players. As others have said he was double teamed where possible. And for posters thinking that he'll get to a stage where he is a deadset certainty to clunk anything that comes his way have got another thing coming. It's never been a strength of his, and he'll never have great hands. That's not to say he can't improve them over his career but jesus, do people not understand the value of him for not only our structure but the morale, direction and onfield leadership he brings? It's the very reason we threw a lot of money at him when our club was a basketcase. Not because of his ability to clunk marks. I have no doubt he's contributed to the change we see in attitude on and off field. Not to mention the positive influence he has on every draftee that walks through the door at our club.

Great post. Agree.

The 'evidence' just keeps coming on in @RPFC @Machsy

I know it's been said... But the significance of early season wins for our club cannot be underestimated. And by that I mean winning rounds 1, 2 and 3 against beatable opposition. There will come a time in which our longest serving players will have a mind-shift and an enormous shot of confidence and adrenalin. That will come from early wins, because they've been starved of them for so long. The players I'm speaking of are Jones, Grimes, Dunn, Howe, Watts, Jamar etc. If these guys get a taste early on, many of them will look like completely different players. You'll notice the shift, and they'll be riding a wave. Much of our list has been turned over, but winning consecutive games at the start of a campaign could be the catalyst for the rebirth of the Melbourne Football Club. The belief will return. The younger players will play with greater confidence. It becomes a snowball effect for the entire club. Players, staff and supporters. It's our time. Imagine the feeling at the G in round 4 against the tiges having come off three straight wins at the start of the home and away season. Get it done Dees.

How is it conjecture when as Ron has stated rightly that there is absolutely evidence supporting the argument that Frawley's display of character is/was poor for a senior leader of our club? It's you that has started speculating that toward the end of the year/beginning of the FA period it could have been the club that 'pushed' Frawley out the door. That's the conjecture right there. Go back and look at any media interview he did and listen closely to the reasons he used as to why he put talks on hold. The evidence is there.

I couldn't disagree more.

I'm more interested in whether or not Spencer will ever learn how to mark, kick, handball, (insert any fundamental skill needed to play the game).. As for his 'aggro' on-field, I really couldn't care. You rarely see Jones remonstrating with opposition players or having scraps, yet he's our hardest player. As well as our best. I think it's okay to admit that Spencer really doesn't offer much in the way of 'improving our side'. His signing is nothing more than insurance incase one of Jamar or Gawn go down. I imagine we'll be targeting a mature-ish ruckman over the next couple of years.

Not so sure I agree on this years form.

Glad we're all on the same page.... (Who said he was a dud out of interest?) This place is ridiculous.

Misleading stats again P-man. Whilst Frawley's strength is his one-on-one defending, I think you'll find that most defenders who's strength is one-on-one defending would have recorded similar stats during 2013 based upon the fact that we were so heavily scored against and through so many avenues. Again, stats like that don't tell the full story. And I disagree that he was our best defender this year.

One all AA year. I think supporters hold on to that and perhaps forget what his form has been like since then. Here's a bit of perspective. Nathan Jones has never been an AA but have a look his gradual improvement since he was drafted and what he is now achieving and producing onfield and off-field. Frawley's form was all over the shop and in my eyes, he never displayed strong leadership on or off-field. I've always thought he was expendable. Strong defence is built as a side. And a strong side is built up of strong personalities as well as talent. As RPFC has said, on recent form he wasn't our best defender (part of the reason he played forward this year). I honestly don't think he's any sort of loss. We've gained in many ways with his departure and we'll start to see that in the not too distant future.

Was there ever any doubt? Nathan is in a different class to James. Great news.

...... ...Te ....Terlich? ..

I'd go as far to say he is no loss whatsoever.If we were at a stage where we were vying for a top 4 spot and a legitimate flag chance next year then I agree he'd be a loss of some sort. But we're not. We're a bottom dwelling team on the up who has landed Christian Petracca for Frawley and weve been able to trade in a replacement for Frawley in the same draft/trade period in Frost. Give it two to three years and you'll be laughing at our fortunes.

Machsy's post was was clearly a sarcastic dig at those who were unhappy with how Frawley handled the whole thing this year. Are you awake today? The both of you seem to miss a very important ingredient in this whole FA versus club loyalty debate. The character of the player. You can bang on all you like about Jones 'nearly leaving' all those years ago. But he didn't leave and the bloke has genuine care for this footy club as well as an instinctive drive to bring the best out of himself and others. Something that can't be said about Frawley. Jones is a leader of men. Something the MFC will be willing to pay be bucks for. We won't be seeing a repeat of what happened with Frawley this year. Jones' character alone and presence at the club means he's an untouchable. It's worth more than half his contract alone, regardless of his incredible on-field display. This argument is over. Frawley needed to go. And you'll be glad he did in 2-3 years time. Jones will sign. There's nothing more to it.

You two are ridiculous. Some of us can decipher quite easily between personalities but quite clearly, you two can't. Jones and Frawley are worlds apart in regards to leadership and Jones won't be going anywhere no matter his contractual status. There's a reason not nearly as many supporters are concerned with the fact that Jones hasn't signed a contract. Can you figure it out Lloyd and Harry? Good one though...

A positive about doing this exercise is that I found it very hard to fit in players like Garland, Grimes, Matt Jones, McKenzie, Terlich etc. I had a half backline of Salem, McDonald and Lumumba which to me is much more exciting and an upgrade on what we had this year. Really we need Salem there for his footskills and defensive skills. Lumamba and McDonald whilst not having the greatest footskills will at least break lines which will create easier targets to hit rather than the stagnant stop start play from the backline we saw this year. Grimes and Garland are two that should be genuinely worried for their starting positions. Goes for many players really. The sooner our more talented youngsters get their fitness up to an AFL standard, there will be no need for the list fillers we still have running around. Hard to see McKenzie getting a game this year.

'There are those who make it happen, there are those who watch it happen and there are those who wonder what happened.' Whether or not Frawley said those things in the above post doesn't phase me. (However it wouldn't surprise me if true). The MFC have been and still are in a 'stage' of needing players who are self driven and want to make change at the club. Frawley, for various reasons, is not and was not ever that player/personality. Which is why he needed to go. We've been able to land two highly talented midfielders who both possess more self-drive, motivation and work ethic than Frawley ever displayed. Supporters are shortsighted when it comes to losing players they've formed emotional attachments to. But for the long term improvement and survival of the club, we needed this to happen and I'm so glad it eventuated. Frawley is a follower. Not a leader. The MFC has been an environment filled with followers for too long.

There are far too many.. I agree that on paper we'll have what looks to be a more effective and potent forward-line compared to what we had running around this year. But the number of goals our side kicks will be determined by our inside 50 count. We need to double our 2014 inside 50 count average if y'all want to see the kinds of results you're predicting. And that's subject to how much improvement we see from our midfield and halfback-lline. Ball movement, contested and uncontested possession count, ability to hit targets regularly. We need to see a major improvement in all those areas. Which will then see an increase in our inside 50 count. Which will then result in more opportunities for our forwards. Which will hopefully bring more goals.

Some of the lists on this thread are genuinely ridiculous.

What defines a 'leader' in your eyes? I think, for our needs and young and developing list, we need all our leaders to display an unquestionable desire and will to be competitive at every contest on-field. To fight nail and tooth for the ball and to be able to nurture and communicate really well with our younger players at the same time. Our club has been completely bereft of leaders that display those two characteristics over the past decade and it has unquestionably been a contributing factor to our poor development of younger players. Watts is definitely not what I would term an onfield 'leader' for our players. Perhaps he is a leader in other areas of his life and in his philosophy of life for some players and I have no question that he's respected highly within the group. But he is still trying to develop areas of his game that are on occasions non-existent during games. We have a really exciting group of young players at our club and there's a theme building that they all share. An appetite to work extremely hard. The leaders on game day need to be players who can inspire our younger generation of: Viney JKH Salem Toumpas Tyson Brayshaw Petracca Hogan Our leadership group for next year should read as follows in my eyes: Jones ©, Dawes (VC), Cross, Lumumba, Dunn or McDonald. Even Dunn and McDonald are players whom I'm not completely sold on as leaders for my own reasons. Unfortunately, there's a gap between our most senior and oldest players and our youngest group which comprise of players in the age group of approx. 24-28 who have endured careers that no player should have to go through. The youngest group of players are the one's who will hopefully be developed properly. They're the one's who share a theme in terms of character and personality. And they're the one's who will be our next brigade of leaders. We need them to stay together and learn from our most well-rounded senior leaders which will hopefully be the one's in our LG next year.

Yes

The highlights on the MFC site have him kicking a goal against O'keefe and bringing Tom Mitchell in a fierce tackle. Not that it means much. Just interesting.

The fact that the draft is such an 'event' now really doesn't help these young kids either. It's pretty disgusting really. The AFL are just constantly looking for $ signs wherever they can. We should be easing these kids into the next phase of their footballing careers. Not building it up. Because the reality is, many of these kids who had really great years at under 18's level won't be doing the same at AFL level ever. Petracca has some really exciting attributes to his name. His aerobic ability has never been a 'strength'. I'm glad that session on Monday was a shock to all the draftees because they'll now know the amount of work they have to put in to reap the rewards. Petracca will be absolutely fine as long as his desire to improve is fierce. Thank god we have blokes like Jones, Viney and Cross as players to look up to at training. I'm looking forward to him showing glimpses in the games that he plays next year. That's all I want from Petracca and Brayshaw next year. Glimpses.