Can someone help me out here.

Am I correct in remembering that in 2002 Neale Daniher stated that we did not have the team to win a premiership and therefore had to draft key position players.

He went on to say that we had to go backwards for a short time.

If I am correct can someone tell me what KPP were drafted.

These are the KPPs drafted over the next 4 offseasons beginning at the end of the 2002 season:

2002:

15. Nick Smith

26. Jared Rivers

66. Ryan Ferguson

(Picked up Nathan Carroll at 56 in the rookie draft)

2003: None (traded for Ben Holland)

2004:

43. Michael Newton

Mathew Warnock picked up in rookie draft

2005: None

These are the KPPs drafted over the next 4 offseasons beginning at the end of the 2002 season:

2002:

15. Nick Smith

26. Jared Rivers

66. Ryan Ferguson

(Picked up Nathan Carroll at 56 in the rookie draft)

2003: None (traded for Ben Holland)

2004:

43. Michael Newton

Mathew Warnock picked up in rookie draft

2005: None

thanks for reply

Confirms my very low opinion of Danaher as a coach

Loathed him myself. He was consistently inconsistent and didn't achieve anything. Left 3 years too late.

Who the heck is Danaher? I thought Neale Daniher was coaching us in those years?

Loathed him myself. He was consistently inconsistent and didn't achieve anything. Left 3 years too late.

his evil twin brother ,dont you remember

These are the KPPs drafted over the next 4 offseasons beginning at the end of the 2002 season:

2002:

15. Nick Smith

26. Jared Rivers

66. Ryan Ferguson

(Picked up Nathan Carroll at 56 in the rookie draft)

2003: None (traded for Ben Holland)

2004:

43. Michael Newton

Mathew Warnock picked up in rookie draft

2005: None

Cameron did a good job, clearly.

Don't you mean Noeline Donaher?

Who the heck is Danaher? I thought Neale Daniher was coaching us in those years?

No it was DANI HA HA HA. But no laughing manor.

I'd have been happy to get a new Coach in 2000, let alone a few years later. Unfortunately, this forum wasn't around then so I can't prove it

But no laughing manor.

I see what you did there.

These are the KPPs drafted over the next 4 offseasons beginning at the end of the 2002 season:

2002:

15. Nick Smith

26. Jared Rivers

66. Ryan Ferguson

(Picked up Nathan Carroll at 56 in the rookie draft)

2003: None (traded for Ben Holland)

2004:

13. Matthew Bate 192cm and not quick enough to be in the middle

15.Lynden Dunn 192cm and shown little but has played a few decent games up forward

43. Michael Newton

Mathew Warnock picked up in rookie draft

2005: None

2006: Got to include, he was still in charge.

12. Frawley 193cm Big raps, not inspiring at the moment though

46. Garland 191cm KPP (apparently)

Just adding a bit of fairness to Daniher. Value in Rivers, Bate, and Carroll. Possibly Dunn, Newton, and Frawley. That is 6. It's difficult to judge wether that is a good return.

IMO it has been player development over the years, rather than specific picks. We just don't seem to be able to turn promise into reality. But with 2 development coaches, maybe that will change.

Just adding a bit of fairness to Daniher.

None for Cameron though.

Richmond can have him. An absolute bargain (for free).

I thought he was alright, sure, we didn't get a premiership out of him but we were on the up before last year when injuries killed us and him essentially. But I guess the change will be good in the long term for MFC...

I thought he was alright, sure, we didn't get a premiership out of him but we were on the up before last year when injuries killed us and him essentially. But I guess the change will be good in the long term for MFC...

Don't mean to be a nark Tim, but what makes you think he was alright?

Don't mean to be a nark Tim, but what makes you think he was alright?

Daniher had a fantastic fast-moving attacking game plan that required little contested footy. The players were suited to it and played accordingly. They did move the ball quickly but not by hand. The gameplan ultimately came unstuck as we used to get killed on the rebound. He tried to implement a "horses-for-courses" type scenario where the players had to play multi-game styles within a single match. This is obviously far too complicated for anybody to digest and master. It doesn't take much for confidence to evaporate entirely as it did in 2007 and it proved to be his undoing. But ever since Daniher has been in the seat, we have been horrendous at handball and were always easybeats when the game demanded contested footy.

Whilst we have some glaring short-comings, I don't believe the list is as poor as everyone here makes out. As someone else has pointed out, a little bit of confidence can take you a long way. The team currently has zilch.

Daniher was alright. Not great.

Daniher was alright. Not great.

I agree. I was talking about Cameron.

I liked your analysis, fatty. I can add, that at the sharp end of the season, Daniher's game plan (hate the phrase) was vulnerable; it can't ramp up, can't respond to an increase in intensity. Much like NM; if they make the finals again this year, they will be absolutely flogged again.

which is why he tried to change to a 'run and carry' gameplan last year, which caused us to get flogged, lost him his job. but he probably did the right thing for the club - he could have continued old methods and just made the finals again couldnt he?

he had the same problem DB is having now, and that is that the players have psent 10 years playing a different game, and now they are learning a new one.

I agree. I was talking about Cameron.

Whoops, sorry. I thought Tim was referring to Neale Daniher.

Don't get me started on Cameron!!!

which is why he tried to change to a 'run and carry' gameplan last year, which caused us to get flogged, lost him his job. but he probably did the right thing for the club - he could have continued old methods and just made the finals again couldnt he?

he had the same problem DB is having now, and that is that the players have psent 10 years playing a different game, and now they are learning a new one.

No he could not.

The game is changing that fast in the past three years. Daniher realised it but did not have the cattle nor the necessary training time to turn players used to playing a different style that was becoming more and more redundant against the better teams.

After the clean out last year how many players on the list that are best 22 have had 10 years playing a different game. The 23 and below generation have a chance to adapt to the new game plan or perish.

No he could not.

The game is changing that fast in the past three years. Daniher realised it but did not have the cattle nor the necessary training time to turn players used to playing a different style that was becoming more and more redundant against the better teams.

After the clean out last year how many players on the list that are best 22 have had 10 years playing a different game. The 23 and below generation have a chance to adapt to the new game plan or perish.

yes great point RE the under 23s having time to adapt to a new game plan.

however, i still think the ND could have rolled the dice again with the old game plan, and won a few more games than he did, and possibly kept his spot. if we had of finished 6-8 last year and got knocked out in week 1 of the finals, I think he would still be in the job. however precariously perched he may have been.

i believe he did the club a great service by trying to do what was best for the club, rather than by trying to get short term results that in the end would amount to nothing, and get us no where.

however, i still think the ND could have rolled the dice again with the old game plan, and won a few more games than he did, and possibly kept his spot. if we had of finished 6-8 last year and got knocked out in week 1 of the finals, I think he would still be in the job. however precariously perched he may have been.

That would have indicated a plateauing given that it would have been four years running we crashed out in early Sept. I think after 3 years, ND explored how he could maximise his shot a flag in 2007 his final chance. He knew his existing game plan would not get us the next step.

I think he realised as many senior players did that by Rd 3 with mounting injuries and confusion about game styles that he was shot.

I think you give a balanced view of Daniher. If we played well in 2008 he would have been damned for 2007 and not getting the best of the team. We are awful this year and its his legacy. And some of the last statement is definitely applicable re list management and development of leadership.

I think there has been some excellent analysis of our game plans and styles in this thread, and I pretty well agree.

Game plan or not 'though, I am absoltely baffled as to why we can't handball and kick to a Melbourne player rather than the opposition. These are fundamental skills that players have developed well before they are drafted (otherwise wouldn't be). This has nothing to do with game plan, and a lot to do with confidence. But confident or not, I still do not understand why league players can consistently not execute this fundamental skill.

I have seen all games other than Hawthorn this year, and believe we have got the ball as much as the opposition, surely the most difficult part of the game, and do just not use it.

Game plan shmameplan - for some bizarre reason, our players just cannot kick or handball accurately.

I think there has been some excellent analysis of our game plans and styles in this thread, and I pretty well agree.

Game plan or not 'though, I am absoltely baffled as to why we can't handball and kick to a Melbourne player rather than the opposition. These are fundamental skills that players have developed well before they are drafted (otherwise wouldn't be). This has nothing to do with game plan, and a lot to do with confidence. But confident or not, I still do not understand why league players can consistently not execute this fundamental skill.

I have seen all games other than Hawthorn this year, and believe we have got the ball as much as the opposition, surely the most difficult part of the game, and do just not use it.

Game plan shmameplan - for some bizarre reason, our players just cannot kick or handball accurately.

Maybe its the Gutnick years that are the problem with the missed draft picks. We have ageing stars in Neitz and Robbo but then the next group is around the 23 y/o mark. There is no middle group that would compliment both age groups. I think Daniher did a good job with what he had but possibly or from the press obviously smoothed over the cracks that were forming. He made the footy department look good, letting the back end flounder and get away with everything.

Whoops, sorry. I thought Tim was referring to Neale Daniher.

Don't get me started on Cameron!!!

Yeah na its ok, I was talking about Daniher... haha