I noticed many fans this year perhaps expected too much, some even screaming for him to be dragged from the ground during several games this year.

Have faith. He is one of these rare footballers that always seems to have time and space around him, even when he is not playing loose.

His kicking style is ungainly but if he can control it, and as Peter McKenna used to say when he was commentating some footballers kicking styles have "their desired effect" (in reference to Todd Viney and Tony Campbell circa 1987 Elimination Final vs North Melbourne), he will be a defence force to be reckoned with.

I've seen a mean streak in him that may have not come through physically yet as he is young but I can feel with the way he charge the defensive lines.

Mal Michael had to learn a lot about the game before he becam a force at the age of 25.

I noticed many fans this year perhaps expected too much, some even screaming for him to be dragged from the ground during several games this year.

Have faith. He is one of these rare footballers that always seems to have time and space around him, even when he is not playing loose.

His kicking style is unganely but if he can control it, and as Peter McKenna used to say when he was commentating some footballers kicking styles have "their desired effect" (in reference to Todd Viney and Tony Campbell circa 1987 Elimination Final vs North Melbourne), he will be a defence force to be reckoned with.

I've seen a mean streak in him that may have not come through physically yet as he is young but I can feel with the way he charge the defensive lines.

Mal Michael had to learn a lot about the game before he becam a force at the age of 25.

I just cant believe some people are putting up there Round 1 best possible line-ups and they have him in it. Yeah, he could very well be a player in years to come. But he cant handle VFL level right now let alone the big boys. He's at least a few years off.

I just cant believe some people are putting up there Round 1 best possible line-eps and they have him in it. Yeah, he could very well be a player in years to come. But he cant handle VFL level right now let alone the big boys. He's at least a few years off.

Frawley cant handle VFL? WTF man? He look like he is going to be a top defender! Think how bad defense looks in bad teams... and how long it takes for a backman to develop, he looks the goods.

I just cant believe some people are putting up there Round 1 best possible line-eps and they have him in it. Yeah, he could very well be a player in years to come. But he cant handle VFL level right now let alone the big boys. He's at least a few years off.

Relegating him to the VFL aint gonna speed up his development though is it?

Relegating him to the VFL aint gonna speed up his development though is it?

afl promotion didnt help zac dawson though did it?

Relegating him to the VFL aint gonna speed up his development though is it?

For young players who are still building their bodies and confidence, playing them at AFL level can often be more damaging than anything.

I just look at a lot of Collingwood's younger players who were thrown right into the deep end and it paid off for them.

I just look at a lot of Collingwood's younger players who were thrown right into the deep end and it paid off for them.

Such as?

I like Frawley as a player with the ball in his hands. BUT I think his defensive ability is very poor. Rarely does he get a fist in for the spoil, despite often being right with his opponent. However, the fact that he is right with is opponent is a very good sign. I think he can be taught to spoil better, but this should be done at sandy. Had we been incontention for finals later last season, I wouldn't have wanted him in the team. He isn't ready yet.

Such as?

Goldsack, O'Brien, Shaw, Pendlebury, Thomas to name a few...

Plus, even though hatred makes people blind, i would be very proud if i was a Collingwood supporter this year.

They play with passion, pride, hardness, charge the lines and never stop running...

Absolutely agree with the topic title.

Come off it, a tall defender in his first year, in a losing team which routinely failed to apply midfield defensive pressure, and had a mess of a structure from both injuries and lack of system?

There were games where he was being beaten and was simply left to hang.

I'm actually a little angry about it, because I also think he's shown enough to be confident he'll step up and be a quality tall defender for us.

But seriously. Tall defender, first year out, most difficult possible environment, and beause he only did ok we hang s$ on him? I don't think so.

And in keeping with what seems like an odd tradition at the Demons, he's player just under ten games in his debut season, keeping him eligible for next year's rising star award.

I like Frawley as a player with the ball in his hands. BUT I think his defensive ability is very poor. Rarely does he get a fist in for the spoil, despite often being right with his opponent. However, the fact that he is right with is opponent is a very good sign. I think he can be taught to spoil better, but this should be done at sandy. Had we been incontention for finals later last season, I wouldn't have wanted him in the team. He isn't ready yet.

Yep. But on the plus side, if you had to recruit a KP defender with a weakness in his game, spoiling would be the weakness I'd choose. You can't make them much quicker, you can't make them any taller, you can't really develop their football brain all that much, but in Frawley's case I reckon as soon as he gets a bit of bulk on him the spoiling will come naturally.

I think people need to take a bit of a reality check here. How often does a KP player recruited in any given year come into the competition in his first season and star at the top level? Has it EVER happened? Look at Gumbleton, Leuenberger, Sellar, Brown etc etc... None of these guys have done anything. I would say if Chip has come into the side as early as he has and NOT had a serious career affecting injury, then he's just about exactly where you'd want him to be. He's had a taste for it, knows what the pace of it is like, and I'm sure that next season if he doesn't debut in the first round, our desire for KP defenders will force his inclusion within the first six... and if he still isn't pulling his weight, he'll get dropped again. Simple really, and certainly nothing to be ashamed of.

Look, next season he's going to get smashed half a dozen times, and he's going to get beaten (but not disgraced) another half a dozen times, maybe more. But with a bit of luck he'll win a few games, and if we're REALLY lucky he might play a few really good ones against really good opposition and force his name into the spotlight at MFC and in the football world. We're not going to need him to play like a veteran defender YET. Rivers, Carroll and Holland are bigger mature bodies who despite obvious lacks in their games can be relied upon to pull their weight in the majority of matches in any given season. Nobody should be expecting Frawley to do as much as those blokes in 2008... Beyond that? Yes...

Goldsack, O'Brien, Shaw, Pendlebury, Thomas to name a few...

Collingwood have some good young players, but I don't really know that they've been fast-tracked any more than Frawley, Jones, Petterd, Bate and Bartram (all of whom have played more games with Melbourne than they have with Sandringham).

Geez ... Jones has played 29 games and already finished second in the B&F. Shaw is 22 years old and O'Brien is 21 ... they need to be compared with players like McLean and Sylvia for "fast-tracking".

Collingwood have some good young players, but I don't really know that they've been fast-tracked any more than Frawley, Jones, Petterd, Bate and Bartram (all of whom have played more games with Melbourne than they have with Sandringham).

Geez ... Jones has played 29 games and already finished second in the B&F. Shaw is 22 years old and O'Brien is 21 ... they need to be compared with players like McLean and Sylvia for "fast-tracking".

Thanks Maurie. I asked that question on purpose so I could give that answer to the inevitable response. Beat me to the punch.

Injuries aside, Frawley should be in our starting 22 come Round 1.

Next year is as much about developing the kids, as it is about compensating for this year's horrible result.

Collingwood have some good young players, but I don't really know that they've been fast-tracked any more than Frawley, Jones, Petterd, Bate and Bartram (all of whom have played more games with Melbourne than they have with Sandringham).

Geez ... Jones has played 29 games and already finished second in the B&F. Shaw is 22 years old and O'Brien is 21 ... they need to be compared with players like McLean and Sylvia for "fast-tracking".

i agree with you to an extent but i would argue that Jones, McClean, Bate and Sylvia had much higher expectations than Shaw and O'Brien.

nevertheless this argument is pointless really as all I want to see is our boys play with the same reckless abandon as Harry O and Heath Shaw.

Liked his game against the Blues 1st time around. Played most of the game on Waite how was coming off 19 goals or so in 4 weeks. Keep him very quiet.

Injuries aside, Frawley should be in our starting 22 come Round 1.

Next year is as much about developing the kids, as it is about compensating for this year's horrible result.

That i agree with, should start the year

i agree with you to an extent but i would argue that Jones, McClean, Bate and Sylvia had much higher expectations than Shaw and O'Brien.

But no higher expectations than players like Thomas and Pendlebury, who were top 5 picks in the year we got Jones at 12. In the year we picked Frawley at 12 (2006), Collingwood picked Ben Reid at 8 and Nathan Brown at 10. Reid's played 3 games, Brown hasn't yet made his debut.

In fact, of the first 12 picks in 2006, Frawley is third on the "games played" tally after Bryce Gibbs and Joel Selwood.

Shaw would probably have been a first-round pick, except he was taken father-son. Collingwood's first two picks in the year we took McLean and Sylvia, were Brayden Shaw (delisted) and Brent Hall (delisted)!

This idea that we are slow at playing youngsters is bollocks.

Injuries aside, Frawley should be in our starting 22 come Round 1.

Next year is as much about developing the kids, as it is about compensating for this year's horrible result.

As far as I can see, with the number of mature-age retirements and delistings, we'd have trouble not picking a young team next year. I don't think any particular extra emphasis needs to go on kids - just play whoever gives us the best option on the day, plenty of young players will get their chance whatever happens.

I would like to see a lot less of the 'playing injured' pattern - particularly noticable in our forward line, where a restricted Neitz and a restricted Robertson simply couldn't provide enough leads and create enough danger to demand extra defensive attention.

I rate Frawley highly, but we'll see how the preseason and the pre-season cup play out; who knows, Garland might turn it up!

If I had to make a predicition, I be pretty certain that Frawley would play a majority of next season's games.

If frawley gets into the steak and weights he'll be fantastic. Get some meat on dem bones.

James Frawley will be our best defender in a few years time. Has the confidence to take on opposition running out of defense. Smart, Tall, eventually stronger.

Had a stellar NAB Regional match against Richmond out at Princes Park but did nothing after that to suggest he'll be a solid AFL player.

CAC will be nervous about this selection.

CAC will be nervous about this selection.

What a disgrace, an 18 year old KPP who had stress fractures in his foot, and hasn't even been nominate as FB in the All Australian team. What the hell is going on?

Give it a rest, he's a kid and has had one year in the system. Show me a key position player drafted last year who has shown more than Frawley...

What a disgrace, an 18 year old KPP who had stress fractures in his foot, and hasn't even been nominate as FB in the All Australian team. What the hell is going on?

Give it a rest, he's a kid and has had one year in the system. Show me a key position player drafted last year who has shown more than Frawley...

I'm only commenting on whats been presented to me in 9 games of AFL footy plus a couple of pre-season games. I like it how he clears the ball out of defence and has the guts to run and carry out of defence and seems to have more time to dispose of the footy than the average player which is a key ingredient. Very concerned however, with his one-on-one contests -especially if you saw the Roos game in round 16.

I think he has the ability to make it. However key position players selected in the first round are risky prospects, hense why I think CAC will be nervous about this one, considering Frawley was expected to be picked up later in the draft.