The first 15 mins or so of this is great listening if you are interested in hearing a dissection of how our game plan (or lack of) is falling apart.

Edit: starts at about 2:30 mark

Nicely summed up in one sentence:

"What I'm seeing is three different strategies, one for each line and they just don't connect".

Though I'd argue that the disconnect between the forward third and the middle is far greater than that between our backs and the middle.

5 minutes ago, Luther said:

Nicely summed up in one sentence:

"What I'm seeing is three different strategies, one for each line and they just don't connect".

Though I'd argue that the disconnect between the forward third and the middle is far greater than that between our backs and the middle.

It's an interesting observation, because I'd say that from back to front our only strategy is kick long to a contest. 

Since our intercept numbers are heavily down on 2018, I'd say that within our system there, if we could move the ball quickly from the back half on turn over, we can score very quickly. Melksham's goal last week was proof of that. It took 4 kicks to score:

* Hibberd's attacking kick into the corridor.

* (dropped by the Richmond player) into Petracca's hands, his kick to Fritsch at half forward.

* Fritsch's kick to Melksham in the square, goal.

Our connection from the midfield to the forwardline is too slow on the rebound or misdirected from centre clearance.

Our connection from the backline to the midfield is too slow and predictable.

Both problems are associated with the midfield though and work rate. Given our alleged fitness levels, it's an intriguing dynamic.

At the 5.00 mark he says the footage Garry Lyon showed on AFL360 On the Couch, is how Saints played for the last 5 years.  Can only be Richo's influence.  Worrying.  

A losing strategy at saints and so far the same for us.

Was not a fan of his appointment.  Less so after hearing that.

Edited July 9, 20204 yr by Lucifer's Hero

13 minutes ago, Lucifer's Hero said:

At the 5.00 mark he says the footage Garry Lyon showed on AFL360 is how Saints played for the last 5 years.  Can only be Richo's influence.  Worrying.  

A loosing strategy at saints and not much better for us.

Was not a fan of his appointment.  Less so after hearing that.

Anyone got vision of this footage? What does it show?

6 minutes ago, A F said:

Anyone got vision of this footage? What does it show?

My apology.  Not AFL 360, it was On The Couch so should be in another thread.  Will see if I can find it.

Found it

 

Edited July 9, 20204 yr by Lucifer's Hero

24 minutes ago, A F said:

It's an interesting observation, because I'd say that from back to front our only strategy is kick long to a contest. 

Since our intercept numbers are heavily down on 2018, I'd say that within our system there, if we could move the ball quickly from the back half on turn over, we can score very quickly. Melksham's goal last week was proof of that. It took 4 kicks to score:

* Hibberd's attacking kick into the corridor.

* (dropped by the Richmond player) into Petracca's hands, his kick to Fritsch at half forward.

* Fritsch's kick to Melksham in the square, goal.

Our connection from the midfield to the forwardline is too slow on the rebound or misdirected from centre clearance.

Our connection from the backline to the midfield is too slow and predictable.

Both problems are associated with the midfield though and work rate. Given our alleged fitness levels, it's an intriguing dynamic.

Fair point. I do think one of the key elements that makes our connect between the backline and the middle a little better is the fact that May is often taking the kick outs and often hits a target.

Interesting to hear a previous coach pointing out these issues and that the club still haven't addressed it years on.

Also interesting that teams actively target Oliver and Petracca as weak links defensively and try to launch offensive attacks through the players they're on. Also suggest Oliver be played more forward for his own development.

Too many players go at the footy, opposition just wait on the outside. If Melbourne do win the ball, they're surrounded and make poor decisions as a result. Coaches do this on loop to nullify the amount of contests we win.

When the opposition get the ball they maintain possession and play keepings off, and we have no way to combat that. 

They're two obvious strategic things that have brought us unstuck for years now. We are outcoached on a weekly basis. Until we change gamestyle, we can give 110% effort as much as we like, but we will not be a competitor.

Edited July 9, 20204 yr by Lord Travis

Jennings has just told every club how to beat us and it's unbelievably simple.

Interesting hearing the chat around Clayton and how it was hard to admit things were not working when he was getting plenty of stats. Jennings has made at least 2-3 references of not coaching to stats.

It's sounding a lot like Goody & the playing group are all trying too hard to do too much. The idea of Max rucking back half and T-Mac rucking front half seems like a no-brainer, gets T-Mac involved in the play and maybe works him back into form.

Edit: Everyone is frustrated with Lever, well he is being actively targeted. A lot are frustrated with Clayton, he is being actively targeted. Petracca was interesting, but people don't notice that one as much because he's about the only bloke doing anything the other way.

 

Edited July 9, 20204 yr by BW511

Question paraphrased: Can the issues be fixed and can they be fixed quickly?

Jennings answer: It's a 30 second fix. That's just pure strategy and match day coaching.

Pretty damning assessment of Goodwin right there!

3 minutes ago, BW511 said:

Jennings has just told every club how to beat us and it's unbelievably simple.

 

He also has told us how to win and it's unbelievably simple"

Gawn back half ruck. Tom forward half.

Oliver to forward line

Defend further back in the field.

Except that Jennings was part of the coaching group last year.  He was also one of the coaches that voted for Oliver to win our B&F when he was accumulating some very average stats. 

I hope Goody listens to SEN @george_on_the_outer & @Lord Travis.

Maybe things look a lot more complicated and difficult from the inner sanctum and an outside perspective is all it takes.

If Goody and Jennings were great mates, wonder if he's picked up the phone for a little advice?

35 minutes ago, BW511 said:

Jennings has just told every club how to beat us and it's unbelievably simple.

Interesting hearing the chat around Clayton and how it was hard to admit things were not working when he was getting plenty of stats. Jennings has made at least 2-3 references of not coaching to stats.

It's sounding a lot like Goody & the playing group are all trying too hard to do too much.

How to beat us has been known and successful for a very long time:

• Control via short kick mark (deny our ballistic play style):  Geelong, WCE, Hawks
• Match in the contest, beat on the spread/outside (too many committed to the contested to stop opp spread):  Lions, Tigers, Pies
• Drop an extra in defence (to mark our bombs):  Every team has been doing it for the last few years.

What is fascinating is that he was our strategy coach last year.  As he was given the flick one can only assume that Goodwin didn't want to hear these messages from Jennings. 

Will Goodwin now take on board what Jennings has suggested to win...

Edited July 9, 20204 yr by Lucifer's Hero

22 minutes ago, Luther said:

Fair point. I do think one of the key elements that makes our connect between the backline and the middle a little better is the fact that May is often taking the kick outs and often hits a target.

I'd love to know what our kick out stats have been like this year. I've found May's kicking out to often be very underwhelming. He kicks to contests far too often.

41 minutes ago, Lucifer's Hero said:

My apology.  Not AFL 360, it was On The Couch so should be in another thread.  Will see if I can find it.

Found it

 

Just watched it. It only goes for 3.42 "Red Mist Exposed". There's nothing about the way St Kilda played?

4 minutes ago, A F said:

Just watched it. It only goes for 3.42 "Red Mist Exposed". There's nothing about the way St Kilda played?

Gary calls it the red mist. Jennings referenced Gary's comments and added he thought it's the way St Kilda played 

14 minutes ago, A F said:

I'd love to know what our kick out stats have been like this year. I've found May's kicking out to often be very underwhelming. He kicks to contests far too often.

I can't seem to find anything specifically on kick ins but his kicking efficiency rating is 83.7%. Doesn't help a lot.

5 minutes ago, A F said:

Just watched it. It only goes for 3.42 "Red Mist Exposed". There's nothing about the way St Kilda played?

The st Kilda reference wasn't by Lyon it was by Jennings talking about Lyon's video (if I found the correct video).

Some great points from Jennings and well summed up.. I listened with great attention when he was on earlier  

Anyone get a bit of a feel there are a few sour grapes there though from Jennings?

2 minutes ago, Luther said:

I can't seem to find anything specifically on kick ins but his kicking efficiency rating is 83.7%. Doesn't help a lot.

I feel like May's kicking is all or nothing. He seems to have his 8 perfect kicks out of 10 but his other 2 are howlers

21 minutes ago, A F said:

I'd love to know what our kick out stats have been like this year. I've found May's kicking out to often be very underwhelming. He kicks to contests far too often.

He kicks to Max and it is nearly always to the members side of the ground (or the left when at other grounds).  Very, very predictable.

Haven't seen our kick-in players take a run out of the goal square this year - they may have forgotten the rule changes  allow it. 

7 minutes ago, Lucifer's Hero said:

He kicks to Max and it is nearly always to the members side of the ground (or the left when at other grounds).  Very, very predictable.

Haven't seen our kick-in players take a run out of the goal square this year - they may have forgotten the rule changes  allow it. 

First kick out of the Richmond game May runs out of the goal square, hits up a short target in Hibberd and we quickly slingshot forward. Melksham goals.

Great analysis.

Interesting that teams make adjustments when playing us, but we do the same thing week in week out.

Stubborn or deluded. Maybe both.

Just now, Luther said:

First kick out of the Richmond game May runs out of the goal square, hits up a short target in Hibberd and we quickly slingshot forward. Melksham goals.

True.  And it worked because it was unpredictable and rare.