1 hour ago, Gorgoroth said:

But he has done it many many times, how many times do you see our "leaders" do it. 

What did you see them do/try on Saturday? I saw nothing, they trudged back to the centre and "went again"

Holy [censored] mate.

Viney is just 23 years old and essentially has two Blueys to his name already playing in arguably the shittest team for 15 years! Compare that to the leadership grounding Selwood got during that period of GFC success? It's just not relative mate.

The game against Freo will be used as a learning platform for Viney and he will lap it up as usual and ensure it's a benefit to him and the team. 

I just can't believe that after a narrow loss to a team that has effectively been tanking last year that our supporters are willing to throw our LG to the wolves after only Rd 4. 

The overeaction (in general) is nothing short of astounding,

 

1 hour ago, Adzman said:

We have improved in nearly every facet of the game.

Our biggest issue is that the competition is as close as its ever been, and if u are without 4 of your best 22 you are probably going to get rolled if you don't play your best footy. We had one qtr that cost us, we didn't play our best footy when we weren't full strength and we paid the price.

No we haven't. Can't hit scoreboard, cant maintain composure.

Some respects miles ahead.

Headspace...i wonder.

But. We're young !!!

[censored] im tired of being young and losing !!

23 minutes ago, Radar Detector said:

I don't understand all this talk about leadership void. Jones was in our best players 3 out of 4 games. Had one quiet one. Hardly a hanging offence.

'Best player' does not equate leadership.

Our leaders couldn't pull us over the line like Fyfe, Sandi, Neale etc did for them. Our leaders lack composure.

2 minutes ago, Moonshadow said:

'Best player' does not equate leadership.

Our leaders couldn't pull us over the line like Fyfe, Sandi, Neale etc did for them. Our leaders lack composure.

Jones did exactly that against Carlton and was instrumental in the turnaround against the Saints... I fundamentally disagree with this whole notion. Teams generally win when their good players play well. Maybe in years past our leadership was terrible but it has improved and we are winning more and more games.

Freo got smashed against Geelong and Port - do they have terrible leaders or are you just using a sample that suits your hypothesis?

The dees struggle when teams apply manic pressure and we lose our composure. When this happens, we tend not to reply in kind to wrest back the initiative and we look passive and overwhelmed.  If we do it to other teams, when we're in charge, we can look as good as just about any team. 

I think we are miles better than we've been but when the acid in put on us, we have to turn up the heat on the opposition. It's easier for supporters to say this than it is for he players to stem the tide when the opposition get super aggressive.

Thats the main problem I see during matches and it's where on field leaders can change the course of a game.

3 minutes ago, Radar Detector said:

Jones did exactly that against Carlton and was instrumental in the turnaround against the Saints... I fundamentally disagree with this whole notion. Teams generally win when their good players play well. Maybe in years past our leadership was terrible but it has improved and we are winning more and more games.

Freo got smashed against Geelong and Port - do they have terrible leaders or are you just using a sample that suits your hypothesis?

Clubs like Haw Syd and Geelong have won tight games regularly over the last 5+ years. Leadership goes a long way towards dragging a side over the line for a win in tight games. Guys like Mitchell, Hodge, Selwood, Bartel, Kennedy and McVeigh are/were very good players but also great leaders. I'm not a fan of military terminologies in sport, but they're generals. 

Jones has some leadership quality and I love him as a Melbourne player, but I'd hardly rely on him or our other leaders to drive us to victory in a tight match like yesterday.

You can always find results to prove any hypotheses. However, when a very close game is there to be won, I'd much prefer to have good leaders with composure who are also good players than just good players

Yes, we move the ball very rapidly forward from the center bounce and out of the back-line e.g. after quarter-time against the Saints.

The up and under kicks from defence are poison as in the last quarter.  

Viney, Tyson and Oliver all need to improve their handball.

Last year, we had the Blessed Pedersen up forward and we will be better for it until Weidemann masters clasping motions.

10 hours ago, pineapple dee said:

The dees struggle when teams apply manic pressure and we lose our composure. When this happens, we tend not to reply in kind to wrest back the initiative and we look passive and overwhelmed.  If we do it to other teams, when we're in charge, we can look as good as just about any team. 

I think we are miles better than we've been but when the acid in put on us, we have to turn up the heat on the opposition. It's easier for supporters to say this than it is for he players to stem the tide when the opposition get super aggressive.

Thats the main problem I see during matches and it's where on field leaders can change the course of a game.

Like our uncharacteristic comebacks against Saints, Carlton and even the last Q v Freo to a degree though not quite with the success of the previous two. 

Last year we would have rolled over and died in all three, and been totally demolished by Geelong. 

We have improved but still have a fair way to go. 

Remember last year when Geelong gave us an absolute bath. Remember this year how had we kicked straight we would have beaten them comfortably. 

Remember the ball movement in round one that we haven't seen in a decade. 

Remember finding a way to win against carlton.

remember pegging back a four goal lead against freo in the last after an absolute avalanche in the third.

remember crying out for some offensive flare under Roos.

Improvement.

 

 

 

Remember when we could kick straight...or do something other than bombing

Thatd be improvement.