Jamar misses a few easy goals forward, but it's not like he's never kicked one over his career. Kicked a harder goal than last nights to win us the game v Adelaide last year. More so he dominated the centre hit outs early and got us in the game which is his primary role. Unless Pedersen does anything in the rest of the NAB series then we should play 2 rucks and develop Gawn and live with some poor forward work from the rucks. It's not like Freo's second ruck did anything forward. Jamar at least drew the free kick that led to his comical miss.

Agree totally on Grimes and maybe on Garland. They have 2 games to prove themselves because we know Howe can play half back, we know Frost is an option and personally I've seen enough from Salem as well.

No way we should play two rucks. Hogan and Dawes are poor when the ball hits the deck and so we need the added mobility.

How is it that Gawn, after a few ? years at the club, still can not kick ????????????????????????????????

Roosey, a lot of target practice is required ASAP. Footskills at our club are abysmal if not worse. Overall I rate our kicking as a 5.75 out of 10.

This is the AFL, not year 2 at the local primary school. Gawn seems to have a few mates that also have this dreaded strain.

C'mon Dees, fix it up straightaway. Endeavour was good but skills still a long, long way off being anything near acceptable.

Hogan is a monster that is already being talked about at other clubs. He is Neitz reincarnated. Jones is now top 25 in the league.

Gawn kicks beautifully at training. He's really improved his technique. The pressure of a game and 31 degrees stuffed him though. He's worth another chance because he's not in the side for his kicking. Dawes I don't understand though, he wasn't just missing kicks like Gawny but wheeling round and lacing it straight to no one.

We aren't going to have smooth kicking talls, not many teams do. However there is hope that most of our best 22 can raise the kicking standard to something like a 7/10.

One of the big problems in trying to analyse our performance is that you have to figure it was a NAB challenge game and give the players leeway for being very rusty, but also remember a lot of these guys just aren't much chop. So there's no real way to predict who will or wont shape up by round 1.

Jamar misses a few easy goals forward, but it's not like he's never kicked one over his career. Kicked a harder goal than last nights to win us the game v Adelaide last year. More so he dominated the centre hit outs early and got us in the game which is his primary role. Unless Pedersen does anything in the rest of the NAB series then we should play 2 rucks and develop Gawn and live with some poor forward work from the rucks. It's not like Freo's second ruck did anything forward. Jamar at least drew the free kick that led to his comical miss.

Agree totally on Grimes and maybe on Garland. They have 2 games to prove themselves because we know Howe can play half back, we know Frost is an option and personally I've seen enough from Salem as well.

I know he has been injured a lot but IMO Gawn is way over hyped on Demonland.

The guy is average at best in real games.

No way we should play two rucks. Hogan and Dawes are poor when the ball hits the deck and so we need the added mobility.

Hogan and Dawes are fine for talls when the ball hits the ground. Dawes defends very well, he wont crumb it like Buddy Franklin but he's more than standard. Give Hogan a bit of time to find match fitness, but he's a very smart player when the ball hits the deck and moves well.

If our second ruck was Fitzy then maybe I'd agree with you. But he's not in the picture and neither Dawes or Hogan are putting their name up to 2nd ruck. So it's Pedersen and really there's little evidence that he's any more mobile than Gawn. Jamar's our best ruck. Gawn's our future ruck and provides another winner in the hit outs and mobile player in the midfield.

Gawn kicks beautifully at training. He's really improved his technique. The pressure of a game and 31 degrees stuffed him though. He's worth another chance because he's not in the side for his kicking. Dawes I don't understand though, he wasn't just missing kicks like Gawny but wheeling round and lacing it straight to no one.

We aren't going to have smooth kicking talls, not many teams do. However there is hope that most of our best 22 can raise the kicking standard to something like a 7/10.

One of the big problems in trying to analyse our performance is that you have to figure it was a NAB challenge game and give the players leeway for being very rusty, but also remember a lot of these guys just aren't much chop. So there's no real way to predict who will or wont shape up by round 1.

Strangely..... Tommy Macs a lot better at kicking at training these days too

I know he has been injured a lot but IMO Gawn is way over hyped on Demonland.

The guy is average at best in real games.

Average output. Still a very good talent. Pedersen is average in every single way and doesn't have the physical tools to ruck. Gawn will get there as a ruck but he needs AFL minutes. He'll only deliver once in a blue moon as a forward but until Pedersen does more often there's little to lose.

Strangely..... Tommy Macs a lot better at kicking at training these days too

Tommy Mac plays half back, you better be able to kick there. Gawny plays ruck, he should handball it off or take a safe option more times than not. The training line gets over used, I'm just saying I do expect improvement. Spencer even at training still is incredibly mechanical in his kicking, Gawn at training has good flow to his kicking.

Tommy Mac plays half back, you better be able to kick there. Gawny plays ruck, he should handball it off or take a safe option more times than not. The training line gets over used, I'm just saying I do expect improvement. Spencer even at training still is incredibly mechanical in his kicking, Gawn at training has good flow to his kicking.

GGRM...might have missed the gist there .....

Macs kicking , like Gawns is ok at training.. He still lifts my heart rate when he kicks it...in a fashion...somewhere. Though admittedly sometimes it does go where he wants. isnt that nice

No way we should play two rucks. Hogan and Dawes are poor when the ball hits the deck and so we need the added mobility.

Not sure if you watched many of Hogan's Casey games but he is pretty good when the ball hits the deck. Give him time.

The big problem is neither of them (Dawes/Hogan) are really ruck options and whilst I agree and wouldn't be happy with Jamar and Gawn in the same side we need Fitz or Peders to start showing something.

One thing I have come to realize is that I will gladly take a couple of Watts lazy efforts a game if it means we will have his foot skills in the side.

We lost to the Dockers because of poor disposal, nothing more, nothing less. Same thing that probably cost us another 5 or 6 wins last season.

One thing I have come to realize is that I will gladly take a couple of Watts lazy efforts a game if it means we will have his foot skills in the side.

We lost to the Dockers because of poor disposal, nothing more, nothing less. Same thing that probably cost us another 5 or 6 wins last season.

amazingly a very similar thought crossed my mind. I felt odd..lol But it is his ( JW ) best attribute...link and deliver. Not sure what Howes is...and no saying that to be niggly, im just not sure.

I say Howe as many consider him for the HFF role....this is where Id put Watts...as a high HFF as it were... us oldies know it as playing the wing...so last century I realise.

Not sure if you watched many of Hogan's Casey games but he is pretty good when the ball hits the deck. Give him time.

The big problem is neither of them (Dawes/Hogan) are really ruck options and whilst I agree and wouldn't be happy with Jamar and Gawn in the same side we need Fitz or Peders to start showing something.

I watched a few of Hogan's games in 2013 and he dominated, but the VFL is much slower and he is poor at ground level versus AFL players. You cannot carry more than two slow players (max) in the forward line these days. It looks good on paper but it doesn't work.

I still think Howe is a forward, in our setup he'd likely be the 5th forward and would demand the respect of his opponent making him nervous to run off, Howe and Watts should be very difficult match ups for the 4th/5th defenders

I still think Howe is a forward, in our setup he'd likely be the 5th forward and would demand the respect of his opponent making him nervous to run off, Howe and Watts should be very difficult match ups for the 4th/5th defenders

I do too. Id play him as a Pocket come stand in target. If ol Hulk is apt to wander, and thats fine then having Howe remain could be a gem.

The forward setup is still in flux I reckon and thats also suggested by the experimentation underway currently

I didn't get home until just before three quarter time. This is what I saw.

• No Melbourne goals
• Seven consecutive free kicks to Fremantle (although actually interrupted by a dodgy free given to us in the back line, with one umpire calling it back and the other paying advantage for no net benefit)
• A Freo shot hitting the post and being called a goal, to the merriment of Fox Footy's "commentators"
• Oh and the ball flew over Hogan's head four times

The criticism of Tom McDonald is confusing to me

He is an elite one on one defender, has great endurance and decent pace. Yes he sometimes turns the ball over, but the reality is he shouldn't be driving us out of the backline.

He is best 22 every week.

hogan is quite fast at ground level and will improve his output when Dawes and others in the forward line get to know each other

in the first qtr the forwards weren't ready for us to win the ball out of the centre so many entries went over the head of MFC players we made a bad mistake NOT drafting silvagni when he was at casey

his body work and positioning was excellent

as far as Dawes kicking the ball to no one in the last qtr Yes he did --there was no leading player running to CHF --some one is at fault maybe coaches for set up or forwards playing too far up the ground or ??? but unless there was a boundary line lead that Dawes missed seeing it wasn't his fault

our team couldn't stop Hill he was a machine

Walters did not a lot but what he did was a class above anything else on the day

The criticism of Tom McDonald is confusing to me

He is an elite one on one defender, has great endurance and decent pace. Yes he sometimes turns the ball over, but the reality is he shouldn't be driving us out of the backline.

He is best 22 every week.

Jaded , the criticism of Mac is invariably confined to one area.....that being of or around his feet. its a valid criticism for mine. So much good work comes undone from poor disposal by many a player. It just hauls the team back to mediocrity.

Would you put money on A Tommy Mac kick ?

I trust youre now less confused !!

One thing I have come to realize is that I will gladly take a couple of Watts lazy efforts a game if it means we will have his foot skills in the side.

We lost to the Dockers because of poor disposal, nothing more, nothing less. Same thing that probably cost us another 5 or 6 wins last season.

Yep hh it is has been happening for a long time.

I tell you what though, it will be good having Vince, Viney, Howe and Watts come back for us also. We will be alright this year I believe.

Edited March 6, 201510 yr by Barra17

I tell you what though, it will be good having Vince, Howe and Watts come back for us also. We will be alright this year I believe.

What does "alright" mean Barra

Went to the game yesterday and will hold my analysis until I watch the replay on the television. However real question marks on Grimes, Bail and Garland for starting 22?

I didn't get home until just before three quarter time. This is what I saw.

• No Melbourne goals
• Seven consecutive free kicks to Fremantle (although actually interrupted by a dodgy free given to us in the back line, with one umpire calling it back and the other paying advantage for no net benefit)
• A Freo shot hitting the post and being called a goal, to the merriment of Fox Footy's "commentators"
• Oh and the ball flew over Hogan's head four times

This may just be the most nonconstructive post in the history of Demonland

What does "alright" mean Barra

We will be competitive against most sides which is all we really want and be in with a chance to win.

Went to the game yesterday and will hold my analysis until I watch the replay on the television. However real question marks on Grimes, Bail and Garland for starting 22?

I just did a best 22 up and came up with this. Not sure how accurate I am though, but this is the way I see it in my eyes.

B: Jetta, McDonald, Frost

HB: Lumumba, Dunn, Howe

C: Vince, Viney, Cross

HF: Kent, Pederson, Watts

F: Garlett, Hogan, Dawes

Fol: Jamar, N. Jones, Tyson

I/C: VandenBerg, M.Jones, Salem, Newton

Em: JKH, Toumpas, Garland, Grimes, Bail

I tell you what though, it will be good having Vince, Viney, Howe and Watts come back for us also. We will be alright this year I believe.

a bonus is all four know what those two big sticks are for !!