We don't need convincing on the score of duds. You win clearly.

Let's face it Toumpas is a dud

Do you really think it was an ill considered response? I mean, declaring that an 18 yr old is a useless hack of a player....is that not a considered statement that reflects both understanding and compassion? Very harsh Wayne.

I think you'll find Roost It also declared that Cadel Evans wasn't a cyclist's a###hole.

I also was at the game and agree with pretty much what Maldon has said. On the injury front, I went up to Jessie Hogan's uncle after he chatted with his nephew and he told me that Jessie received a corky after been slammed in a marking duel in the first quarter. He might miss a week but he's OK. I also noticed that Chris Dawes had an ice pack on his knee after the game. It could be just a cautioning.

A few observations. Chris Dawes is not AFL ready and I expect he won't be called up for a few weeks if tonight was any indication. On the other hand Fitzy is in fine form and should get his chance in the next couple of weeks. Jimmy T was disappointing in the first 3 quarters and looked a little lost. He seemed to find his compass in the last quarter and got more involved. His kicking skills are very good. I thought Strauss attacked the ball very hard and even broke through packs. You get a sense that he is gaining confidence with every outing.

The last couple of sentences are very revealing. Yes Strauss is improving and broke lines very impressively a few times. Fitzy has always been quick for such a big man. What makes a difference is he is now holding contested marks and leads very impressively. What do they have in common?

They have both been held back to develop in the twos, and create the hunger to succeed. Note Watts, toumpas, Viney, even tapscott. Their football education is incomplete and under a skilled coach we now have at Casey they will learn far more than the chaos currently running around as an excuse for MFC first team. The coaching staff simply do not have the insights to educate the young.

I think you'll find Roost It also declared that Cadel Evans wasn't a cyclist's a###hole.

Not to mention he posted in the changes after the Brisbane game for Shannon Byrnes to be dropped, FMD. If that is his conclusion after the match on the weekend I suggest he trade in the fookin guide dog

The coaching staff simply do not have the insights to educate the young.

Have a look at who does what at the Dees and Casey. The MFC-listed forwards, backs etc. at Casey are supervised by the respective development coaches from the MFC, who are also the active assistants for their areas on VFL game day.

These players only train for one session a week with Welsh, but train 5 days a week with the MFC coaches. If you're commenting favourably on the progress of Fitzy and Strauss, then it's down to the MFC coaches, and in particular the development coaches: Greaves, Satterly and Nichol

15 disposals from Toumpas is disappointing, have to wonder if his hip surgery has affected him

The main point was that we selected him because of his potential to be a dangerous outside player - every AFL player needs to have the ability to find their own ball (especially a pick 4........unless your name is Morton)

Cheers for that, didn't realise you worked for the recruiting department.

A huge thank you to all who have stuck to topic and actually given us information about the game. It's great to hear that some of our project players and recovering injury listers are doing so well and quietly getting themselves back into contention for the AFL while the firsts are struggling so badly. It gives some of us a bit of hope that maybe these guys will be able to step up to the top level and contribute later in the year.

15 disposals from Toumpas is disappointing, have to wonder if his hip surgery has affected him

Depends doesn't it. I wasn't at the game but he might have had 15 lovely disposals and competed, blocked, chased and won his own ball. If so it will project well because in a good side this kid is racking up cheap touches with his ability to find space that was still evident but horribly underused in his AFL games so far. It's a good sign that he got more in the second half. I'd rather a player work his way into a close game than the other way around.

Let's see how he goes for the next few weeks. Whats being lost in all this Toumpas bagging is that he's already showed he can play the game. He hasn't come out and stunk completely. He just hasn't looked comfortable at AFL.

Just some comments on the goals vid

1. Whilst Dean Kent's goal was very good its appalling that he either doesn't give the handball to Fitzy or Fitzy doesn't provide a shepherd.

We must learn some team football.

2. Hogans strong hands OMFG. Love his silly kicking action as well

3. Willy are an undisciplined lot close to goal!

4. Its always windy in Casey

5. Dawesy's 2 goals came from him putting on forward pressure.

6. Fitzpatrick has so much talent and still is all over the shop like a baby giraffe. He can be the next Stef Martin but this guy needs top notch coaching and he could be properly good.

7. Especially if we start to become more competitive at AFL level and if his form at VFL level can just pick up a bit I think we need to get Rory Taggert a game. I don't believe in handing out games but I do believe in playing kids if the earn a shot. There's something about this guys combination of size and clean skills that I really hope transfers to AFL level.

Just some comments on the goals vid1. Whilst Dean Kent's goal was very good its appalling that he either doesn't give the handball to Fitzy or Fitzy doesn't provide a shepherd.We must learn some team football

Well picked up, a few in the crowd on the fence were screaming at Fitzy to shepherd.

Was a disappointing bit of play from a guy who otherwise had a good game