i don't think clubs are going to risk taking him with pick to 1 or 2 just to try and stuff us up...it would be stupid....there are better players rated 1-3 so we can take jack with our 2nd round.....sheedy might have dementia....but silvagni and his recruiters aren't just there to stick it to the dees......they are there to get the best for their club

If someone is insane enough to risk their 1 or 2 pick on him then I say let them have him. He isn't going to be rated that highly given that he's lost half a season and missed a fair chunk of the carnival (and AA selection). There will be many higher rated players in the draft.

It will hurt us in the short term in that we have already indicated that we will take him and could be considered to be lacking in integrity, but it will hurt the club who bid on him more as they will be giving up a very highly rated pick. In the long run I can only see it helping us. If we burn a club badly the first time, will anyone be game to play silly buggers with us again? It would be sending a clear message to the rest of the competition that we will burn you if you try to screw with us.

The above being the case, I feel that I should say also that I love JV and really hope to see him in the red and blue next year. I just think it is more important to the club to stand their ground and not be caught bluffing or waste our early picks.

How dare you speak sense!

Is he tall? Nope, maybe 178cm at a stretch

Is he quick? Nope, not over distance

Is he multi dimensional, multi tasker, Go forward or back? Nope

Elite penetrating kick?Nope

Similarity, Judd, Pendels? Nope, Thinking Tony Shaw, Mitchell

Real draft value? about 12/18

Match winner? Not that I have seen, good hands in close, great foot soldier

Viney Sentiment? Good guys come last, and we are expert at that.

About Kevin? Who cares

Midfield rating? Jamar, Viney, Howe, Mckenzie, Magner, Maloney, Trengove, Bail, Nicholson, Spencer, Martini? About 16th/18th

Edited July 11, 201213 yr by bluey

People need to realise that if we do pass on him, which is unlikely in itself, he will not be returning to the club any time soon. And if he was to return to the club, it would have to be done via a trade which would end up being just as costly.

I'm very confident that JV will be at the club next year whether we have to take him 2nd or 1st round. It's just a game of seeing if GC or GWS are willing to play Russian Roulette with their recruiting and list?

Will GC want to risk loosing Lachie Whitfield?

Will GWS want to risk loosing Brodie Grundy when they're crying out for a ruckman???

If he's not rated in the top 5 we simply tell GWS and GCS we won't be picking. Pick the best player - it's that simple. If that means Jack Viney goes to another club then so be it. This attitude that we pick him regardless of his worth is plain wrong in my eyes. Surely Todd would want to avoid any accusations of nepotism. It's probably 2nd round or bust for him.

If he's not rated in the top 5 we simply tell GWS and GCS we won't be picking. Pick the best player - it's that simple. If that means Jack Viney goes to another club then so be it. This attitude that we pick him regardless of his worth is plain wrong in my eyes. Surely Todd would want to avoid any accusations of nepotism. It's probably 2nd round or bust for him.

You're right with that. I know the club rate him extremely highly. Just a question of whether or not that rate him as a top 5 pick?

I get the impression that they do, but I could be wrong.

Great topic!!! Considering the yr we have had thus far, unfortunately we are back to talking draft scenario's and I think that we dont want to use pick 3 or 4 for Viney. MFC need to make it clear that if GC/GWS do bid for Viney to screw us over, that they might actually end up with a player of high risk to them as he would probably walk after 2 yrs anyway. We still got picks 3, 4 and 13 after this and im sure we can pick at least a couple of decent players (touch wood).

My gut feel is that there is no way GC/GWS will risk taking viney in front of us. To much to lose if he were to walk after 2 yrs. Pretty much lock him in at 13 i reckon!

Is he tall? Nope, maybe 178cm at a stretch

Is he quick? Nope, not over distance

Is he multi dimensional, multi tasker, Go forward or back? Nope

Elite penetrating kick?Nope

Similarity, Judd, Pendels? Nope, Thinking Tony Shaw, Mitchell

Real draft value? about 12/18

Match winner? Not that I have seen, good hands in close, great foot soldier

Viney Sentiment? Good guys come last, and we are expert at that.

About Kevin? Who cares

Midfield rating? Jamar, Viney, Howe, Mckenzie, Magner, Maloney, Trengove, Bail, Nicholson, Spencer, Martini? About 16th/18th

I think you will be quite surprised when he finally plays AFL.

I hate it when 'experts' put kids into neat little boxes based on what has gone before.

Imagine what I think when pesudo-experts on a forum put kids into neat little boxes based on what has gone before.

If we think he is near the 4th best talent in the draft - we will take him at 3 if we are forced to.

Hopefully all avenues will be explored to get him in the second round.

Edited July 11, 201213 yr by rpfc

I wonder if we can regurgitate all this for another 60 pages !!

Am a bit over it til the seasons end.

But carry on please

Watts, Morton, Scully and Trengove were all rated top five before their drafts.

Watts, Morton, Scully and Trengove were all rated top five before their drafts.

And so was Judd, Hodge, Ball, Pavlich, Franklin, Deledio, Cotchin, Roughhead, etc.

Surely we have to back our judgement to get these picks right?

I'm very confident that JV will be at the club next year whether we have to take him 2nd or 1st round. It's just a game of seeing if GC or GWS are willing to play Russian Roulette with their recruiting and list?

Will GC want to risk loosing Lachie Whitfield?

Will GWS want to risk loosing Brodie Grundy when they're crying out for a ruckman???

GWS will get a ruck later in the draft & No Doubt will take a mature ruck from another club to tide them over in the absence of Brogan. They wouldn't have to take Grundy when they need so much more in other places.

Time will tell, Sheeds did have the Big Fish, at a time when he had Simon Maddern.

Is he tall? Nope, maybe 178cm at a stretch

Is he quick? Nope, not over distance

Is he multi dimensional, multi tasker, Go forward or back? Nope

Elite penetrating kick?Nope

Similarity, Judd, Pendels? Nope, Thinking Tony Shaw, Mitchell

Real draft value? about 12/18

Match winner? Not that I have seen, good hands in close, great foot soldier

Viney Sentiment? Good guys come last, and we are expert at that.

About Kevin? Who cares

Midfield rating? Jamar, Viney, Howe, Mckenzie, Magner, Maloney, Trengove, Bail, Nicholson, Spencer, Martini? About 16th/18th

Does he need to be tall ? Nope. Not for his role. See Kerr, Cousins, Crawford, Mitchell

Is he quick ? Yes, his speed where he needs it, i.e. breaking away from an in-close pack is very good

Is he multi-dimensional ? No, he'll just be our best and cleanest inside mid getting the ball heading our way

Elite penetrating kick ? No, just a good one

Match winner ? It depends on your description. Not in a Franklin or Stevie J mould. Does grunt win games of footy ?

Viney sentiment ? No, just an opportunity. He's been described as a "culture changer"

About Kevin ? I agree

Midfield rating ? No one player is the messiah, they're building blocks

I too don't want to give up pick 4 and will back the club if they let him go depending on their rating. Some supporters believe it's a foregone conclusion that we'll take him come hell or high water, but the only statement from the club is the contrary. If the club let him go to GWS so be it.

But I do rate what he'll bring to this football club.

Watts, Morton, Scully and Trengove were all rated top five before their drafts.

These 4 you've mentioned, other than Trenners, are all skinny skilled kids, who will take a bit of time to develop they're bodies. Naitinui wasn't in that basket.

Toumpas with a strong body, has already played a couple of Years senior footy in the SANFL representing his side in their Premiership, about a year or so ago.

Wines is bigger again.

Stringer is strong & has natural aggression.

Whitfield is light, but has been AA 2 Yrs running, literally.

Viney is gold at pick 25 - that's what we want. I don't think GC is a risk to bid for him - I don't think he's the type of player Scott Clayton rates, they've had a poorer than expected season and just need to stick to their knitting at the draft and not get too smart, and they're just not as mad, conniving or vindictive as GWS. The simplest solution is to tie pick 3 to GWS, the most straight-forward way to do this is through the mini-draft.

Watts, Morton, Scully and Trengove were all rated top five before their drafts.

Just so we're all on record. Do you consider Trengove to be a poor top 5 selection ?

I'm happy to say that I don't and have great confidence he'll end up an A grade midfielder despite his inglorious 2012.

Hey I am just curious to what every one thinks of letting J Viney go to GWS If in fact they nominate him at pick 1 or 2.

I am really sick of clubs trying to walk all over us example K Sheedy.

This scenario would stick it right up GWS and the AFL.

Just say Todd tells Jack to play at GWS for 2013 and only sign a 1 year contract then he can return to Melbourne in 2014 and in fact tell GWS all year long he is happy at the club maybe give them a bit of Dejavu (Scully) see how they like it.

It's a long shot I know but just posing the question.

PS My first post look foward to chatting to all you Demon fans.

The deals done!

He's going to be a Demon stop worrying.

and get him in your Supercoach by round 3!

Obviously this won't help us with Viney, but how about to stop teams from circumventing to rules to force clubs to choose between a father/son pick and giving up a pick they deserve the AFL make an independent selector who rates the F/S picks themselves and where they say the player has to be taken the club takes it or leaves it.

Ultimately everyone wants F/S picks to go the their chosen club, it's a unique romance in our game that connects families to clubs forever. What i'm suggesting is fair and prevents opposition clubs from forcing a team into lose/lose situation. Because if we take Viney for overs ultimately he will be compared to the player that we might've got, and if we bypass him then suddenly we are a club with no ethics and loyalty to a long standing legend of the club.

FWIW i think we'll take him where we have to, I really hope it's 2nd round because it's where he'd be rated at the moment.

Hey I am just curious to what every one thinks of letting J Viney go to GWS If in fact they nominate him at pick 1 or 2.

I am really sick of clubs trying to walk all over us example K Sheedy.

This scenario would stick it right up GWS and the AFL.

Just say Todd tells Jack to play at GWS for 2013 and only sign a 1 year contract then he can return to Melbourne in 2014 and in fact tell GWS all year long he is happy at the club maybe give them a bit of Dejavu (Scully) see how they like it.

It's a long shot I know but just posing the question.

PS My first post look foward to chatting to all you Demon fans.

NO

AHHHH, UMMM, BUT UM, SO I THINK ....NO!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Just so we're all on record. Do you consider Trengove to be a poor top 5 selection ?

I'm happy to say that I don't and have great confidence he'll end up an A grade midfielder despite his inglorious 2012.

I still think he was worthy at the time of going top five, but my point is that just because they are rated top five now, doesn't always equate to very good long-term players. To be honest I was probably harsh on Trengove but his lack of pace really has for a long time concerned me.

I still think he was worthy at the time of going top five, but my point is that just because they are rated top five now, doesn't always equate to very good long-term players

Yes, I think everyone knows that there's no cast iron clad guarantee.

Maybe I rate the opportunity of a top 5 pick more than you. Another poster gave you a list of many of the successes. Why anyone would play down the value of a top 5 pick is beyond me. They're gold if used wisely. They can get you back fighting for a flag.

Do supporters still care about a flag, or they happy to win a few games of footy and be competitive in most games ? I'll suck on tonnes of pain if the end result gives us a decent crack at a flag.

I heard Todd Viney speak on draft picks a couple of weeks back during the championships and he mentioned

us taking the best available - so lets hope we get Jack as a seconds rounder, because he wont get picked at 3,

he isnt the best available, GWS or GC pick him then they have him - and we get Grundy, which is a massive get.

GWS clearly need a ruckman, GC might bid on Viney, but I would think theres a fair few in front of Jack atm anyway.