I'm not mad. It's just that it seemed like you thought my suggestion had no merit whatsoever.

Well, the solidarity of the side has been the defence, its foundation. This has helped to keep pressure of the young midfield & forwardline. The defenses composure comes from its unity & togetherness. To pull it apart would break that & it would take some time to refabricate that sense of belief & composure they have for one another.

I wasn't ridiculing you, but rather ask if you were serious or if it was an off the cuff frustrated comment.

I don't think we can drop those defenders, especially with Garland injured & we were coming back from Darwin & playing the top team & Geelong. Just like Port.

Yeah named for Casey tomorrow unless it's a different Mckenzie.

McKenzie half rested, to play in a lesser intensity game with Casey. That makes sense as he's a bit older & has an extra season under his belt.

Deffinite Ins: Scully, Trengove, Bate are all must's IMO all in our best 22

Possible Inns:

Bail (showed heaps in his 2 games)

Mckenzie (tackling machine)

Martin (must play back only)

Cheney (playing some really good VFL footy and quicker than Joel Mac) they are all pushing for selection dependent on team changes / requirements for Carlton

Outs From:

Macdonald (Handy player but too slow??)

Garland (if injured)

Aussie (really needs to find some consistancy and earn his spot throught the VFL)

Rivers (same as Aussie)

I'd love to see Bail back in the team, he plays better in the AFL than the VFL.

x2

x2

X3

I'm not necessarily talking about this week, but Scully, Trengove, McKenzie, Bate, Bail and Strauss are the players I'd like to be developed.

Rivers, MacDonald (hack), Bruce, Bartram and Jones are some that are on borrowed time. Jones is ok and has improved his kicking, but in reality he's just a plodder without any creativity. Bartram is having a good year and has also improved his kicking, but as we improve his class deficiency will expose him.

In: Scully, Trengove, Bate + Any strong performers at Casey particularly Spencer, Martin (ruck) or McKenzie

Out: Any of Wona, Rivers, Garland (inj), Macdonald less likely Bartram, Watts, Bennell, Jones.

I'll tell you why they're less likely: Batram was top 5 for us yesterday, Watts has had 2 good games and is a key part of the future, Bennell had a star game last week and can actually kick goals and Jones, though he can't kick, is being given the tagging job and will get Judd next week.

None of them will go, and there are other options to make way for the talent that is ready to come back in.

So I gather from the above in most cases, we put out 3 defenders and replace them with two mids and a forward in Bate ???

Despite them all being defenders, Rivers, MacDonald and Bruce were close to being our three worst players yesterday. And they're all pretty slow, and if Carlton's forward line is anything, it's quick. So at least one of them is getting the chop, and probably two. Bruce doesn't deserve his spot in the team but I still have the feeling he'll keep it.

Bennell won't be dropped. The selectors' memory is not that short -- he was fantastic last week.

But he just has to learn to put in a four-quarter performance. Consistency and Bennell just don't go together at the moment, whether it be across a period of weeks or within a game.

No room for Maric in the side for mine. I'm having a hard enough time fitting in the automatic selections, let alone players in the Casey team who are a fair way down the queue in terms of deserving a run.

He's a fair way back at the moment. Scully, Trengove, McKenzie, Bate, Bail, Strauss, Cheney, McNamara all ahead of him.

In Scully, Trengove, Cheney, Bate, McKenzie

Out Rivers, Wonna, Garland (Inj.), MacDonald, ?

MacDonald is a battler, he tries hard and gives his all.. He is more effective on the rebound then rivers and should stay in.

Martin should not play! I cannot understand why people would want to bring him into our backline. Our backline is strong, and martin will be a chink in the armor. Martin is done.

Jetta and Bennell are exciting and will be good small forwards for us in the future, keep em in. Bennell has been awesome for us, I am also sick of hearing people bad mouth him.

Well, the solidarity of the side has been the defence, its foundation. This has helped to keep pressure of the young midfield & forwardline. The defenses composure comes from its unity & togetherness. To pull it apart would break that & it would take some time to refabricate that sense of belief & composure they have for one another.

I wasn't ridiculing you, but rather ask if you were serious or if it was an off the cuff frustrated comment.

I don't think we can drop those defenders, especially with Garland injured & we were coming back from Darwin & playing the top team & Geelong. Just like Port.

agree about the defence being the foundation. however grimes/frawley/warnock/garland/batram have been the heart of our defence this yeah with bruce/rivers/macdonald floating in and out. none of those 5 players are likely to be dropped (bar garland's injury) so our defence should keep it's unity and even dropping all 3 of bruce/rivers/macdonald wont hurt it (even if i think only 2 maxed will be dropped).

still should be very interesting who comes in/out this week and give a good insight to what the coaches see as our future.

Well, the Scullgove twins and McKenzie have to come in, today showed how much we actually need them. Cheney should be rewarded for great Casey form and be included to take on their small forward line. Bate should return from injury too.

IN - Trengove, Scully, Bate, McKenzie, Cheney

Garland's injured, Wonna's not match fit, MacDonald will be burnt for pace.

OUT - Garland (knee), Wonna (unfit), MacDonald (too slow), ???, ???

Am I missing anybody?

Out- Garland, Rivers, Bruce, Bennell (unlucky for Bennell)

You say Wonna is unfit, but he and Jetta were the ones putting on huge forward line pressure. I think Wona is a game or 2 away from a big one.

No way should we drop MacDonald, he has been probably the most consistent of our veterans this year and deserves more. Drop bruce if we need more pace.

Out- Garland, Rivers, Bruce, Bennell (unlucky for Bennell)

You say Wonna is unfit, but he and Jetta were the ones putting on huge forward line pressure. I think Wona is a game or 2 away from a big one.

No way should we drop MacDonald, he has been probably the most consistent of our veterans this year and deserves more. Drop bruce if we need more pace.

Im speaking of Junior. If you're referring to Joel then by all means..

agree about the defence being the foundation. however grimes/frawley/warnock/garland/batram have been the heart of our defence this yeah with bruce/rivers/macdonald floating in and out. none of those 5 players are likely to be dropped (bar garland's injury) so our defence should keep it's unity and even dropping all 3 of bruce/rivers/macdonald wont hurt it (even if i think only 2 maxed will be dropped).

still should be very interesting who comes in/out this week and give a good insight to what the coaches see as our future.

I think Bruce may get a run with through the middle. I think Rivers will stay, unless Martin comes in as a back. Macdonald IMO will hold Garlands spot.

I'd bring in Cheney this week for a small,,, & send Grimes into the mid zone to run with Murphy.

Edited May 30, 201015 yr by dee-luded

Looks like Spencer or Bail will not be ins as they may have been injured at Bendigo

I don't know why everyone is calling for Wonna to be dropped and questioning his fitness. Did you actually watch the game. The guy was fantastic in providing pressure in the forward line, and layed plenty of tackles. I think the Channel 10 commentators referred to him as a "tackling machine". The guy also kicked one goal and missed one after getting a free after laying a tackle and getting mackie caught for holding the ball.

Dropping him just doesn't make sense to me. Bennell doesn't have the tackling presence that Wonna does. Jetta has a bit of it. If we want to maintain our forward line pressure Wonna stays and you bring Bate in for one of the under performing mid-fielders or backs (or bennell).

Scully and Trengove obviously come back in but i don't know who for. The possibility is that miller gets dropped but Miller was our only effective tall marking option up forward so he stays in my mind. I think bennell gets dropped on form.

If Garland misses than scully comes in for him and then maybe trengove comes in for joel macdonald or rivers. To cover for not having garland and macdonald/rivers in defence grimes moves back to the back line and we go with a line-up of:

Ins: Scully, Trengove, Bate

Outs: Bennell, Garland (knee), Rivers/Macdonald

FB: Bartram, Warnock, MacDonald/Rivers

HB: Bruce, Frawley, Grimes

C: Davey, Trengove, Scully

HF: Sylvia, Bate, Green

FF: Watts, Miller, Wonna

FOLL: Jamar, Moloney, McDonald

INT: Jetta, Gysberts, Jones, Morton

In my mind these changes maintain our height and marking targets in the forward line, while keeping Wonna and Jetta give us the forward pressure in our inside 50. Moving Bruce and Grimes back to the backline gives us enough flexibility to cover their forward line while giving us enough guys to rebound the ball out of the back line.

This does mean Jamar again plays as the only ruckmen, but i'm less concerned about only having miller as a backup ruckman this week with bate in the lineup.

Morton can rotate along the backline with guys like bruce and grimes, jetta, jones and gysberts to rotate through the middle and forward line.

Strauss still hasn't done enough to warrant selection. Cheney would be unlikely to miss out and could be a good inclusion in place of Jetta if we need another small defender. Spencer is unlikely after hearing the guys say he was taken off the ground today on a stretcher.

McKenzie would probably stay out another week because of gysberts good start.

We need to consider who we are playing and the match ups that we need to have. Carlton have 1 maybe 2 tall forwards and then the small med size players. We can't go in with Bruce, Rivers and MacDonald, 2 have to go and that is with Garland injured. IMO we should line up like

Bartram Warnock Bennell

Grimes Frawley Bruce

Scully Sylvia Trengove

Morton Miller Green

Davey Watts Aussie

Jamar Gysberts Moloney

Jones Jetta McDonald Bate

In Scully Trengove Bate

Out Rivers Macdonald Garland

I don't know why everyone is calling for Wonna to be dropped and questioning his fitness. Did you actually watch the game. The guy was fantastic in providing pressure in the forward line, and layed plenty of tackles. I think the Channel 10 commentators referred to him as a "tackling machine". The guy also kicked one goal and missed one after getting a free after laying a tackle and getting mackie caught for holding the ball.

Dropping him just doesn't make sense to me. Bennell doesn't have the tackling presence that Wonna does. Jetta has a bit of it. If we want to maintain our forward line pressure Wonna stays and you bring Bate in for one of the under performing mid-fielders or backs (or bennell).

Scully and Trengove obviously come back in but i don't know who for. The possibility is that miller gets dropped but Miller was our only effective tall marking option up forward so he stays in my mind. I think bennell gets dropped on form.

If Garland misses than scully comes in for him and then maybe trengove comes in for joel macdonald or rivers. To cover for not having garland and macdonald/rivers in defence grimes moves back to the back line and we go with a line-up of:

Ins: Scully, Trengove, Bate

Outs: Bennell, Garland (knee), Rivers/Macdonald

FB: Bartram, Warnock, MacDonald/Rivers

HB: Bruce, Frawley, Grimes

C: Davey, Trengove, Scully

HF: Sylvia, Bate, Green

FF: Watts, Miller, Wonna

FOLL: Jamar, Moloney, McDonald

INT: Jetta, Gysberts, Jones, Morton

In my mind these changes maintain our height and marking targets in the forward line, while keeping Wonna and Jetta give us the forward pressure in our inside 50. Moving Bruce and Grimes back to the backline gives us enough flexibility to cover their forward line while giving us enough guys to rebound the ball out of the back line.

This does mean Jamar again plays as the only ruckmen, but i'm less concerned about only having miller as a backup ruckman this week with bate in the lineup.

Morton can rotate along the backline with guys like bruce and grimes, jetta, jones and gysberts to rotate through the middle and forward line.

Strauss still hasn't done enough to warrant selection. Cheney would be unlikely to miss out and could be a good inclusion in place of Jetta if we need another small defender. Spencer is unlikely after hearing the guys say he was taken off the ground today on a stretcher.

McKenzie would probably stay out another week because of gysberts good start.

Well dunn PM,,, I think thats a good effort & it shows probably the need to keep a couple of players who some think redundant, I think we need miller for another 2 Yrs. And if Cheney & Strauss are not quite regulars by the end of the season, as it appears, then Bruce may be needed for 1 more. I didn't think I'd day that, but there you are.

We need to consider who we are playing and the match ups that we need to have. Carlton have 1 maybe 2 tall forwards and then the small med size players. We can't go in with Bruce, Rivers and MacDonald, 2 have to go and that is with Garland injured. IMO we should line up like

Bartram Warnock Bennell

Grimes Frawley Bruce

Scully Sylvia Trengove

Morton Miller Green

Davey Watts Aussie

Jamar Gysberts Moloney

Jones Jetta McDonald Bate

In Scully Trengove Bate

Out Rivers Macdonald Garland

I don't think Bennell has enough physical presence in defense, so I'd prefer Jetta there as a stopper because of his tenacity. I'd also like to see Cheney who might go to someone like a Yarran or a medium sized forward.

You do not need defensive height you need defensive mobility against Carlton. Morton, Bruce, Grimes, Bartram can all play back. Strauss or Bail to come in to offer another defensive small option.

Jones disposal and offensive run was good today. Its a shame he let the guy he was tagging get 21 touches in the first half.

I'd question Morton & Bruce's agility against those Carlton players mentioned previously. That said, I'd agree that a backline consisting of: -

Warnock, Frawley, Grimes, Bartram, Strauss and perhaps Bruce (I'd like to see Bail back in) could get the job done. Garland is a big loss. Grimes Bartram & Strauss or even Frawley for those players mentioned. Warnock/Frawley for Henderson or O'Hailpin or Kreuzer if rested up forward.

Ablett will always get touches. It's a matter of quelling him to 30, instead of 40+.

Why drop Bennel after one poor game? He kicked four the week before and may do the same next week.

Would love to see Maric in. Wouldn't be keen to see Martin return unless he play down back

I

I didn't suggest dropping Bennell - quite the opposite. I suggested putting him down back to mind the Blues small forwards: he is a better mark, is quick, and is a long penetrating accurate kick.

We need speedy small backs this week. Rivers and MacDonald would be too slow

Edited May 31, 201015 yr by DeesPower

Deffinite Ins: Scully, Trengove, Bate are all must's IMO all in our best 22

Possible Inns:

Bail (showed heaps in his 2 games)

Mckenzie (tackling machine)

Martin (must play back only)

Cheney (playing some really good VFL footy and quicker than Joel Mac) they are all pushing for selection dependent on team changes / requirements for Carlton

Outs From:

Macdonald (Handy player but too slow??)

Garland (if injured)

Aussie (really needs to find some consistancy and earn his spot throught the VFL)

Rivers (same as Aussie)

None of the possible "Ins" could be justified on their Casey games. In any case, Bail went off in the second quarter and didn't return.

I don't think Bennell has enough physical presence in defense, so I'd prefer Jetta there as a stopper because of his tenacity. I'd also like to see Cheney who might go to someone like a Yarran or a medium sized forward.

Generally i'd agree with you about Benell, but I think Carlton are different. Meet fire with fire. Jetta may play there as well given their small forward line, and both Bennell and Jetta should give us good attacking options off our half back line. I don't think any of their small forwards are particularly strong defensively, and rely on their pace to match the bigger backs. Bennell in particualr is a strong mark for his size, and this could prove an advantage.

We need to consider who we are playing and the match ups that we need to have. Carlton have 1 maybe 2 tall forwards and then the small med size players. We can't go in with Bruce, Rivers and MacDonald, 2 have to go and that is with Garland injured. IMO we should line up like

Bartram Warnock Bennell

Grimes Frawley Bruce

Scully Sylvia Trengove

Morton Miller Green

Davey Watts Aussie

Jamar Gysberts Moloney

Jones Jetta McDonald Bate

In Scully Trengove Bate

Out Rivers Macdonald Garland

I think this is pretty right for Carlton

Edited May 30, 201015 yr by DeesPower

I think Bartram to play a lockdown role on Garlett and Bennell on Betts, but running forward hard and often to make Betts accountable or exploit his lack thereof.

Yarran I'm no so worried about yet.

Waite will be coming back into their side after his 2 week suspension and I'd put Warnock on him.

Frawley on Setanta and once again try to exploit him on the rebound.

I think aside from their midfield experience we match up fairly well against them.

agreed!!

no one really stood out much

i dont think bennell or jetta will get dropped surely its not like we expected them to have a fantastic game as they were playing the best team in the comp

Agreed and Agreed.....seriously how easy is it for some to knock this guy!!! Out of 6 forwards named he was clearly the best but should be dropped? CmoN!! At least he took some good marks and tried to influence each contest.....cant wait for a fit Wonna to be in the side...until then he must go back to the twos!

This week? Easy to say who I would want to come in - Scully, Trengove, McKenzie & Bate

Going out will be:

Rivers - seen the negativity towards Riv here on Deeland and tried to avoid it but he was horrible on Saturday and seems to be beaten one out far too often now....he is EXCELLENT as a free marking defender but not one out.....he needs to be dropped.

Garland - if injured this may keep Riv in the side or he might still get dropeed with Garland to get the four above into the side?

Wonna - just not fit enough yet.....cant wait to see a fit Wonna.....the twos is the place to get this fitness back

Will they make four changes? Not sure that they will and maybe three will do it?

If a fourth omission comes it may be one of the forwards that make way for Bate - hard to get stuck in when they didnt have the service but thought all of their efforts weren't too great - Watts, Miller, Jetta or Bennell? Out of that four Bennell surely wont get dropped just yet......may get 'rested'? Jetta wasnt too bad...Watts was very quiet but still needs more time before being 'rested'.....Miller? Thought he was the best of the forwards....unless they decide Bate is the better option??

So I'll say Scully , Trengove and Bate (if fit enough) are certainties and hopefully McKenzie is back

Why drop Wonaeamirri?

He was one of the very few guys who actually could tackle strongly against the Cats. No way will he be dropped for working hard.