maybe trade rivers?

then we can start playing cheney who at the moment deserves a spot in our starting 22

MUSCLE! SIZE! BULK!

MUSCLE! SIZE! BULK!

tapscott has that

dont know how tall he is though

not a bad size?

like chapman they say

I would like to see us target

1/ Quality clearance player to further assist Jordie

2/ 1 "chop out" back up ruckman to assist Jamar

3/ 40-50 goal potential forward ... almost "Cameron Mooney type"

However, obviously I hoping the boys we have currently on our list can do the job.

Gysberts has shown to have potential as a clearance player. Probably better than McKensie at it. McKensie does apply great pressure around stoppages though

Stef Martin has to be developed as our main BIG backman. Not sure what to do with Rivers but Garland and Frawley are flexible enough to play tall/small and give Warnock the 2nd big bloke.

We don't need that much size in that back half, it's a weakness.

We also need another KF who can kick goals.

Watts will be a gun but needs time and a real target to be second fiddle to for a while. Someone who is better than Miller. Someone who is a known goal scorer... As much as I hate that punchable [censored] named Anthony, he fits the bill.

Stef Martin has to be developed as our main BIG backman. Not sure what to do with Rivers but Garland and Frawley are flexible enough to play tall/small and give Warnock the 2nd big bloke.

I am so sick of hearing about Stefan Martin being good. He will never be good. He has no idea what he is doing when he plays.

We don't need that much size in that back half, it's a weakness.

We also need another KF who can kick goals.

Watts will be a gun but needs time and a real target to be second fiddle to for a while. Someone who is better than Miller. Someone who is a known goal scorer... As much as I hate that punchable [censored] named Anthony, he fits the bill.

I would rather keep Miller for another year than give up anything more than a 4th round pick to the pies for Anthony.

Has anyone stopped and thought maybe its not the side that is not taking MFC over the line, maybe the coaching staff have reached their personal limits and now the MFC need staff that can exploit the talents of the young side and make them the force we all know they can and will be. All the individual players can play, we have all seen the talent MFC have, so its not a question of what we need its a question of what we dont need anymore. I hear all the talk about list cloggers what about the coaching box cloggers???

Lets face it the coaching staff now are not pushing the side each and every game. We have all seen what a majority of the list can do, there have been game where we have all witnessed the side dominate harder than a dominatrix. How about a clean out of the coached box. I am actually referring to the staff under Bailey and not Bailey.

Justin Koschitzke a fresh start and out of the shadow of Nick

I think he's soft & would cost too much. If he didn't cost much, I'd consider him as a back ruck, I don't like him as a forward. I don't think he'd except being a spare parts player.

I'd rather pick up Jamie Charman cheap or thru the pre season draft, as a backup ruck while we bring up Martin & Fitzpatrick. Try to trade PJ to a team needing a backup.

Try to trade PJ to a team needing a backup.

Your user name is rather apt. WE need a backup ruckman and WE can't use him because he is useless - what is another team going to give us? A half eaten Mars bar? Belly button lint? What we will do is delist him and if another team wants him as a backup in the seconds they can have him.

tapscott has that

dont know how tall he is though

not a bad size?

like chapman they say

180 cm from memory so doesn't have height.... but he is solidly built and might be one of those players who play taller than they actually are.

Think in a few seasons he will look like Josh Hunt with a the same long kick on him(only right footed).

Im happy with our tall defenders;

our tall forwards look promising with Watts, Morton, Petterd, Bate, Jurrah;

rucks will take time to develop but I think we have the cattle and Jamar is good now;

we can never have too many gun mids, but I think we have sufficient stocks to develop;

small-mid forwards we have a plethora of in Jetta, Wona, Maric, Bennell, Tapscott, Green ;

small-mid defenders we have... Cheney? Joel Mac? Bruce? Bennell?

This area doesn't fill me with confidence.

I don't agree re tall backs-I think we need to groom another tall backman- last week not one performed adequately.Need a fast tall- David Neitz type forward. These are the initial main weaknesses we possess.

Your user name is rather apt. WE need a backup ruckman and WE can't use him because he is useless - what is another team going to give us? A half eaten Mars bar? Belly button lint? What we will do is delist him and if another team wants him as a backup in the seconds they can have him.

Pity about your attempted insults, that maybe a reflexion of yourself.

A half eaten mars bar is preferable to just delisting a player. On the bright side, we may be able to get a player who's struggled at the other club that we believe we can bring on.

Secondly we might be able to do good for PJ.

All it takes is to try. nothing ventured. I'm sorry about your negative & demeaning attitude.

Trades? Would love to see Roughead bought across, would be like watching the Ox in many ways once again. He has signed for 3 years or so, but does this matter if the right trade happened and Hawthorn wanted it? Look I know I am doing the proverbial in the wind here but say either one of Warnock or Rivers (and defenders are an area Hawthorn is crying out for)plus our first pick in this up coming draft? Would that be enough to suffice Hawthorn? I am not a fan of giving high picks away (especially with out record) but considering we have stock piled a fair bit of young talent in the last 3 and if Roughead was the result of that trade, not a bad result?

I think we have a need for a quality small defender. A replacement for Wheels. Bennell, Cheney & others have been tried but for various reasons, don't provide the full package. A 20yo David Wirrpanda would be great.

I said J.Harbrow mid-season last year and was howled down. Now look at him.

45HG16

Maybe you're the solution.

I stated on here or O'logy earlier this year, J.Riewoldt as a key forward mainly because he could grow with a list such as ours, rather than go after an established key "marquee" player. Now he's gone ahead and booted 10 in the process and a star (taking plentiful contested marks). No chance what-so-ever.

Right now, I'd prefer to top up with another mid via the draft. (best available).

Agree with all posters that we need a big ,strong accurate goalkicker.Anyone know who is leading the goal kicking in the VFL,SANFL,WAFL,etc?

Is there anyone in these leagues that may suit us? Must have some leg speed,not too old and an accurate kick.

Trades? Would love to see Roughead bought across, would be like watching the Ox in many ways once again. He has signed for 3 years or so, but does this matter if the right trade happened and Hawthorn wanted it? Look I know I am doing the proverbial in the wind here but say either one of Warnock or Rivers (and defenders are an area Hawthorn is crying out for)plus our first pick in this up coming draft? Would that be enough to suffice Hawthorn? I am not a fan of giving high picks away (especially with out record) but considering we have stock piled a fair bit of young talent in the last 3 and if Roughead was the result of that trade, not a bad result?

I thought the same 'Demon Jack 16', but I read here somewhere recently, & checked it out, that roughhead has just resigned, so unless they want to & he wants to move on, I'm afraid he's not up for grabs.

http://www.heraldsun.com.au/sport/afl/star-trio-lance-franklin-jarryd-roughead-and-sam-mitchell-commit-to-hawks/story-e6frf9jf-1225862954571

So what do we need? I still believe we badly need a David Neitz type of player ie large body, very strong, quick lead, strong mark, long accurate kick. There Is no-one on our list that's near that except maybe Fitzpatrick when he matures. Secondly, a second ruck. I don't believe either meesen or Spencer cut the mustard here. PJ potentiaaly might - it will be intersting to see how he performs at the weekend. Gawn is a long term (ie 3-5 years IMO) but extremely promising prospect but we need someone in the next 2-3 years capable of dominating finals football ie a Jolly type. I don't believe we have one on our list at the moment.

What do others think? Any other gaps? Any players in particular we should target?

I can't believe some of these posts...

We really need a Neitz-type and we could really do with a Riewoldt-type and a Cooney-type.

I think we should try to get at least one of them for Bell, PJ, Newton, Meesen, Cheney, McNamara, Maric, 2 bags of Cheese Supreme doritos and a handful of pocket fluff.

The other 2 we could get in a 3 team deal for every player on our list bar Scully, Trengove and Grimes.

Pity about your attempted insults, that maybe a reflexion of yourself.

A half eaten mars bar is preferable to just delisting a player. On the bright side, we may be able to get a player who's struggled at the other club that we believe we can bring on.

Secondly we might be able to do good for PJ.

All it takes is to try. nothing ventured. I'm sorry about your negative & demeaning attitude.

Take it as insult or don't. I don't care because I am calling it as I see it, and the way I see it is that anybody who thinks PJ has any trade currency is deluded which I thought was apt as that is your user name. Why would you offer anything other than a pick in the 90's (which won't get used) for a player that they could pick up for free if they wanted after we delist him?

There is some strange thought pattern that some posters have in believing that NQR players from the worst team over the last 3 and a half years will be sought by other clubs that are willing to pay us for them. If you think that me pointing out that it is magical thinking is "negative & demeaning" then you either need to get some thicker skin or stop thinking other clubs are run by morons.

Take it as insult or don't. I don't care because I am calling it as I see it, and the way I see it is that anybody who thinks PJ has any trade currency is deluded which I thought was apt as that is your user name. Why would you offer anything other than a pick in the 90's (which won't get used) for a player that they could pick up for free if they wanted after we delist him?

There is some strange thought pattern that some posters have in believing that NQR players from the worst team over the last 3 and a half years will be sought by other clubs that are willing to pay us for them. If you think that me pointing out that it is magical thinking is "negative & demeaning" then you either need to get some thicker skin or stop thinking other clubs are run by morons.

Ah, there you are.

Simple really, when Jamar was injured last year & Johno was the main ruck with continuity, he played very well. Some here thought he was the better Ruckman. And he indeed surprised me to. But, thats exactly what happened, he played really well. But as circumstances show, that when the Russian came back in, he blew everones minds.

PJ can play as a No1 ruck. He's nowhere near the best or 2nd best AFL ruck & probably not 13th best even. But he has a developed big & sturdy body, he's quick & can run well. He kicks well for a ruck, generally speaking & is handy around the ground when he doesn't try to do Too much.

He's not that great overhead, but is more than useful down the back line.

He's still healthy & youthful so could give service continuity, & seems to fit in well.

For a team that has the window open & is exposed for a lack of depth in the ruck dept', & don't have the time to develop a kid ruck, & cant get & a star ruck, he could be an attractive option.

He won't command anything in the first 3 Rnds I reckon, but he may find some interest as a swap for a player or a later pick. Either way I think we'll freshen our list a little & I hope he doesn't get hung out to dry.

Now you can return to your dutch courage old boy.

Simple really, when Jamar was injured last year & Johno was the main ruck with continuity, he played very well. Some here thought he was the better Ruckman. And he indeed surprised me to. But, thats exactly what happened, he played really well. But as circumstances show, that when the Russian came back in, he blew everones minds.

Ahhhh... No.

PJ was reasonable in a couple of games then went back to his usual substandard performances.

The only people who thought he performed better than Jamar truly know nothing about football.

PJ is done as a footballer. He never worked out.

Accept it.

Ah, there you are.

Simple really, when Jamar was injured last year & Johno was the main ruck with continuity, he played very well. Some here thought he was the better Ruckman. And he indeed surprised me to. But, thats exactly what happened, he played really well. But as circumstances show, that when the Russian came back in, he blew everones minds.

In fact it was quite the opposite. He was terrible. Those who thought he was the better ruckman really have no clue what a ruckman is and should do on the ground.

PJ can play as a No1 ruck. He's nowhere near the best or 2nd best AFL ruck & probably not 13th best even. But he has a developed big & sturdy body, he's quick & can run well. He kicks well for a ruck, generally speaking & is handy around the ground when he doesn't try to do Too much.

He's not that great overhead, but is more than useful down the back line.

OK he has a big and sturdy body but has no physical presence, can influence contests, poor overhead (you got that and hey that includes rucking). You have been sucked by his rover like skills but have overlooked that he has none of the needed skills. He stands 200 cm or so and plays about 170 cm.

He's still healthy & youthful so could give service continuity, & seems to fit in well.

Good give him a Nivea skin care commercial

For a team that has the window open & is exposed for a lack of depth in the ruck dept', & don't have the time to develop a kid ruck, & cant get & a star ruck, he could be an attractive option.

Do you think other clubs are that naive???

He won't command anything in the first 3 Rnds I reckon, but he may find some interest as a swap for a player or a later pick. Either way I think we'll freshen our list a little & I hope he doesn't get hung out to dry.

Given GC have the first 6 to 7 picks, Round 3 gets you pick 40 to 58. Hardly worth splitting hairs considering we will struggle to use our three picks if we elevate McKenzie and Spencer. Also if we were to trade for a player of equal quality ...we would we bother?

PJ is finished in AFL.

So what do we need? I still believe we badly need a David Neitz type of player ie large body, very strong, quick lead, strong mark, long accurate kick. There Is no-one on our list that's near that except maybe Fitzpatrick when he matures. Secondly, a second ruck. I don't believe either meesen or Spencer cut the mustard here. PJ potentiaaly might - it will be intersting to see how he performs at the weekend. Gawn is a long term (ie 3-5 years IMO) but extremely promising prospect but we need someone in the next 2-3 years capable of dominating finals football ie a Jolly type. I don't believe we have one on our list at the moment.

What do others think? Any other gaps? Any players in particular we should target?

Really??? We need a large bodied, strong forward and a second ruckman???! Who's this genius and why isnt he part of our recruiting department!

Personally I don't want anymore project type players such as Martin and Spencer. I don't want any Neitz or Robbo type players who are no good defensivly and are out of the contest if they don't mark the ball.

How about some good old fashioned footballers that have strong bodies, strong minds, excellent contested marks, good pace, good defensively, don't fall over after marking contests and love playing for the club. A larger version of Jack Grimes would be perfect.

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