I like bails and i think we made the right decision when appointing him.

What i dont like is everyone saying we are such a young squad bla bla ..yes we are but i think malthouse said in his pressi that the pies were actually collectively as a team 5 years younger or something along those lines.

This time next year (rd 11) will be when bails will be under the pump if we are traveling the same way as now.

Mousey, I didnt hear it so I might be wrong, but I'd say Malthouse was talking about the average age of the playing list. He might technically be right, but it's a bit misleading. Say Team A consists almost totally of 26 year old players, with two or three under 21s, whereas Team B is full of under 21 year olds but has five 30+ year olds- chances are Team A are at their peak and will be more experienced and stronger than Team B, who are well and truly in development mode. But, on paper, Team A could easily, on average, be a "younger side".

The formula also doesnt take into account the degree to which an individual player is relied on, e.g. the Bombers are a very young side on average, but have some key players close to retirement.

Their average age might be younger, but in anyones language, Melbourne are a much younger side than Collingwood.

-what he said was about the collective age (everyones age added up) was 5 less for collingwood.

-i also heard that they had less players than us with under 50 games of experiance...

however, in terms of collective age, 5 isnt much at all...if we took out whelan and/or bell for bennel or martin, and took out robbo for miller, newton or jurrah, our collective age would be less than theirs...

in reply to the fact that they had more players with less than 50 games or less, they are playing a lot of their new draft picks, whereas, we still havent played 2 of our top 3 from last year, as well as blokes such as mcnamara, jurrah, bail, as well as some of our rookies.

in conclusion, what mick said might make us sound like we are older and worse than the pies, but what he said could be taken out of context in the general scheme of things.

l'm beginning to think NNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO

Youre not the same guy who called up 3AW after the game and asked why Terry Wallace had been the target of such criticism this season while Bailey had been exempt?

Seriously.............

Anybody who thinks we haven't improved this season, either didn't see us play much last season or has somehow managed to wipe it from their memory.

We have improved greatly. Today was no doubt a disappointment, but that's all it is. Get some perspective and get over it.

Dean Bailey is 32 games into a full rebuild.

He is not taking any shortcuts.

It is going to take time.

We do not have any champions.

We are recruiting players who may become so.

It takes more than 32 games.

Ridiculous unhelpful thread.

Kill rodents if you must - but leave Bailey to his work

yes l am frickin' serious dropkick, have a look at what improvement we've shown since he began. He can talk the talk but can he walk it?

Without going into too much detail because its clearly its been covered here, and its now well established, you have no idea, but have a look at the average loosing margin from last year, compared with this years. Add to that, that we have a much less experienced side playing this year.

Yeah I would say hes doing a fair job.

BTW, are you 12?

I'm not convinced Bailey's up to it and I think the club made a mistake appointing a nobody rather than an experienced senior coach or a fresh face who actually could play the game well at the highest level.

However, he's 33 games into a 66 game contract. Today marked the half way point of his deal. If in 12 months time - after the young guys have another season under their belts - the club still put out performances like that then I suspect the only option will be to dispense of him at the end of 2010 and find someone else. But he's got another 18 months, really 2010 is when the club need to judge what he's done this year and last.

Agree, though I was quite happy with Dean's appointment.

Am quite worried he will be remembered more like Peter Rohde than an Alistair Clarkeson.

What he does this week will tell me a lot about him. IMO Bruce had 3 pathetic defensive efforts. Robbo was dropped for similar weak efforts, if Bruce is then my hopes for Dean will remain positive.

Thought he made a big mistake appointing Junior as captain and Bruce winning last years Bluey make me doubtful about Dean and those around him.

And while we're at it, get rid of that Bohdan [censored] who causes all our injuries!

Bailey has accomplished a lot of the boring jobs that had to be done without an immediate reward such as with delisting and recruiting. Apart from today, I think it is fair to say that there has been a noticable improvement in response in how the playing group has gone about it this year. Our football department is still not what it should be and this makes coaching life difficult. I am sure Bailey knows what he wants to do and where our deficiencies are but he can only do so much in a certain time.

We only just blooded the first of our top 3 draft picks from last year this round (11) when other teams have young guns playing in the middle as of round 1.

Our defence has become a unit which will only improve and this is directly due to the way Bailey and Wellman have built and developed it.

Our midfield is a black hole. This completely effects the team dynamic. Only talent will fix this as well as better facilities with respect to conditioning - it will take time but having said that I hope Bailey starts injecting youth in there for the rest of the year on a rotational basis.

Up forward is a similar personnell issue which we will fix over time.

Our senior players are remnants from the Daniher era who only know one way to play. It is hard for the seniors to adapt to playing with kids in 2009 footy and even harder for the kids to adapt to the senior players.

IMO next year will be the year that Bailey is under the pump but this year is important to get right as far as laying the foundations. With better facilities, more games under the belts of our kids and a bigger footy department then IMO Bailey becomes fair game. My only reservation with how Bailey is coaching is that our players don't zone very well and breaking laterally from centre clusters or to position is very bad. This I suspect is inhibited by our lack of run and endurance which we desperately need to work on but I just wonder how much we had to go back to the drawing board last year. I think you have to know where a coach has come from in order to measure how much progress he has made and I think some posters don't appreciate this aspect. We have many areas where we need to improve but all in all I don't see what more Bailey could have done to date if you want a job done properly with no short cuts.

I think the jury's still out, and will continue to be out until this time next year.

Bailey might not be a great match day coach but when all he can do is shuffle deck chairs on the Titanic it's hard to say.

Youre not the same guy who called up 3AW after the game and asked why Terry Wallace had been the target of such criticism this season while Bailey had been exempt?

Haha.

I hope they explained that they'd put Bailey under the same blowtorch if he was in the fifth year of his five-year plan.

What happens if the competetive performances between rounds 4-10 evaporate into 12 goal losses for the rest of the season?

Jury is certainly out on Bailey. How could it not after a 4-29 record?

But on the other hand, is he under instruction not to win > 4?

Who would you have appointed?

Mathews, even Sheedy for2 yeaars, Gary Ayres????????????

Youre not the same guy who called up 3AW after the game and asked why Terry Wallace had been the target of such criticism this season while Bailey had been exempt?

Seriously.............

Anybody who thinks we haven't improved this season, either didn't see us play much last season or has somehow managed to wipe it from their memory.

We have improved greatly. Today was no doubt a disappointment, but that's all it is. Get some perspective and get over it.

don't give rats tossbag about Wallace, l'm worried about some of the insipid performances MY club puts in, I'II guarantee if Jimmy was Prez when they were looking for a coach it wouldn't be Bailey

don't give rats tossbag about Wallace, l'm worried about some of the insipid performances MY club puts in, I'II guarantee if Jimmy was Prez when they were looking for a coach it wouldn't be Bailey

Unfortunately Matthews was coaching Brisbane and you can't be serious about Garry Ayres.

I'm not in either of the "Bailey is the next Norm Smith" or "Sack Bailey" camps, I'm currently very undecided.

Yes, our results have been better this season than last.

But watching the game plan that DB is trying to get the guys to play does not fill me with confidence that even with a strong list we would be doing well.

l'm beginning to think NNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO

We should all study the coaching careers of Mark Thompson and Alistair Clarkson for a bit of education. Both lacked supporter confidence in the first couple of years of their appointments, because their sides were losing while trying to build the list and develop the football basics. There were more than a few calls for their sacking.

Yes, I agree what a pathetic and embarrassing game that was yesterday against Collingwood of all people. No manning up as usual - and who stood up for us - where was Green, Bruce, Rivers, Davy and McLean isn't doing anything either - just a dreadful rabble of a game - and Collingwood isn't that good - team - what's going to happen next year - much of the same - what experience has Bailey had anyway - I wanted Sheedy - can't understand the club letting him pass - he would have shaped everyone up and got the membership really sky high -

I also don't think much of mcDonald as Captain not a quarter as good as Neitz was, doesn't seem to run up and pat the players on the back and give them any encouragement- we are stuffed-have we got years of this to look forward to????

We should all study the coaching careers of Mark Thompson and Alistair Clarkson for a bit of education. Both lacked supporter confidence in the first couple of years of their appointments, because their sides were losing while trying to build the list and develop the football basics. There were more than a few calls for their sacking.

Bull s****t what about the basics - just manning up is one major thing they never do - are they advised to do this by the coach- playing around the edge not knowing what to do - has to be a big one - when one young player had the ball and was running for the goal square - no-one there to help him - you have to have the coach supposedly LEADING you.

where is Woneamirri and Wheatley ? at least they can kick goals - we have no-one

Mathews, even Sheedy for2 yeaars, Gary Ayres????????????

Matthews was contracted at the time and endured a player revolt.

Kevin Sheedy was interviewed for the job and gave the most disinterested and unfocussed presentation to the selection committee. He was not interested.

Gary Ayres - You cant be serious.

Bull s****t what about the basics - just manning up is one major thing they never do - are they advised to do this by the coach- playing around the edge not knowing what to do - has to be a big one - when one young player had the ball and was running for the goal square - no-one there to help him - you have to have the coach supposedly LEADING you.

where is Woneamirri and Wheatley ? at least they can kick goals - we have no-one

You are obviously the baby and the bathwater type. There is no doubt everyone is disappointed with the effort. Its a reversal on the work rate and effort they have otherwise shown this year.

BTW, Wona is injured and Wheatley is struggling to be an accomplished VFL player at the moment. Dont let that break your rant though.

We had this thread at the start of the year, i bet you we will have this thread at the end too. Ultimately the coach will be blamed for all things that go wrong.

If dean bailey was sacked at the end of the year or mid next season the coach taking over would have a much easier job then dean does now. So ask yourself, would any other coach be doing better then we are now?

All i ask of Dean is that we see improvement in the youngsters and more game time too.

Bring back the thread with the dean bailey pole lol

Matthews was contracted at the time and endured a player revolt.

Kevin Sheedy was interviewed for the job and gave the most disinterested and unfocussed presentation to the selection committee. He was not interested.

Gary Ayres - You cant be serious.

You are obviously the baby and the bathwater type. There is no doubt everyone is disappointed with the effort. Its a reversal on the work rate and effort they have otherwise shown this year.

BTW, Wona is injured and Wheatley is struggling to be an accomplished VFL player at the moment. Dont let that break your rant though.

Good lord. Is that a hint of positivity in your post?

Couldn't agree more. I love it when newish posters get on and get passionate. But just because we played the filth, and lost badly, shouldn't distract from the first 10 rounds... which under the circumstances have been admirable and encouraging.

Jill... Next year there's no WAY we'll go as bad as this year. In fact, looking at the draw I think we should be very worried about missing out on the priority pick THIS year. We're not as bad as we were against the pies. A young team is going to have form drop-offs... especially excusable ones where we have a bunch of teenagers running around. I mean, just look at last year... The pies SMASHED Geelong by 80 points, and look what happened after that.

you can't be serious about Garry Ayres.

Why not? He's coached at AFL level for 10 years, he was an player at a very good club in a successful era and is coaching Port Melbourne brilliantly in the VFL.

I'd rather him than Dean Who.

But watching the game plan that DB is trying to get the guys to play does not fill me with confidence that even with a strong list we would be doing well.

Why do you say that?

We look very good when we move the ball through the middle of the ground quickly.

Unfortunately turnovers kill us, but that's skill-level - not game plan.

We should all study the coaching careers of Mark Thompson and Alistair Clarkson for a bit of education. Both lacked supporter confidence in the first couple of years of their appointments, because their sides were losing while trying to build the list and develop the football basics. There were more than a few calls for their sacking.

What's the support confidence been like for pretty much every coach who turns out to be a failure?

NB: I'm not asserting that Bailey will be a failure as senior coach.

where is Woneamirri and Wheatley ? at least they can kick goals - we have no-one

Injured / returning from injury.

What happens if the competetive performances between rounds 4-10 evaporate into 12 goal losses for the rest of the season?Jury is certainly out on Bailey. How could it not after a 4-29 record?

But on the other hand, is he under instruction not to win > 4?

What if we pull our ehads in, and win the next 11 games, and scrap into the finals?

There is no point discussing 'what if'. Especially when disscussing a coaches career.

On the radio b4 the game, Schwaby was saying that DB is here for the long haul. So I would get used to his face if I were everyone else.

When I saw the title of the thread I knew you'd be spouting your dribble. I'll tell you what let us down today and it wasn't the coach. Our forward line is led by Junk time Robertson who should be shelved immediatly for bringing the club into disrepute. After that we have no forward line. Our supposed leaders in JMac and Bruce are pale shadows of their now distant best. Our midfield was made to look one paced (slow) and we don't have an AFL standard ruckman. That doesn't leave all that much for a coach.

On the plus side I thought Grimes continued his impressive development. Sylvia is finally performing at the level he is capable of on a regular basis. Davey continues to have his best year. I think Bate, Warnock, Cheney, even Maric all showed enough for me to remain hopeful. We massively overhyped the game which gave Collingwood all the ammunition they needed to hit us hard, which they did. To right off the coach is absurd to a level thankfully only seen by a few posters on this sight, led ably by our man Mo. Now lets move on to Tom Sc.......

Correct thread. I agree.

My one worry was that collingwoods squad was collectively 5 years younger than ours. That really concerns me. Bails must now get Tough. Real Tough.