Daniel Bell

[DaveyJones'sLocker 647]

I think that's about right. Everyone has form drop offs... but you'd be a moron if you siggested he's played badly ALL YEAR. He's had some good games... as a defender when you play well you're invisible. WHen you play badly it's ALL your fault.

As the people who are in the know keep saying, he's no star, but then where is it written that he has to be? He's a late first round pick... no-one was expecting him to dominate. A Wheatley-like career would be a good return...

average to good games maybe! not good, point being his position is not the hardest to play, nor easiest BUT

its likley he could be easily replaced by cj bode frawley if fit, whelan, and if his short term replacement/s find some form, he may miss several weeks, and has his self to blame

[Dappa Dan 2,188]

average to good games maybe! not good, point being his position is not the hardest to play, nor easiest BUT

No. Good games. I counted a couple... then there were a few games where he was just going. There were CERTAINLY no other games where his decision making and delivery cost us as much as on Sunday...

And I disagree. His position is an obsolute pain in the arse to play. You've gotta be kidding yourself if you claim the ALL HB flakers play the same job. Bell is an accountable defender first. He thrashed Medhurst up and down the ground, and he's an older more experienced IN FORM forward.

If you were to drop Bell you'd need to bring in an accountable defender, not another running player a la Daniel Ward. If you want to bring in Buckley or CJ then you have to drop Wheatley, who is playing their role at this stage.

I'm talking in absolutes of course... there are players who can both play accountably AND rebound, and it's this kind of player that we're trying to make Belly into... But I feel that he'll be accountable in 16+ games a year, but only able to rebound effectively in perhaps 10 games tops... which is why he frustrates.

It's also what makes Whelan such a genuine MFC champion.

So yeah. Drop him, give him some time to think about his game... when he comes back we'll probably be screaming out for an accountable defender.

its likley he could be easily replaced by cj bode frawley if fit, whelan, and if his short term replacement/s find some form, he may miss several weeks, and has his self to blame

That's certainly true. You would think the message would get through. Things he's always had on his side is work ethic and humility. I back him to come back within 3-4 weeks depending on who's in and out at the time.

[Hannabal 4]

We're last on the ladder for a reason.

Players like Bell polarise supporters. Some think he's a good young improving player and others think he lacks awareness, doesn't have footy smarts, and for all his willingness and hard work just doesn't quite cut it at this level. I'm one of the latter.

As I said, we're last for a reason and fifth year players like Bell aren't quite good enough. We all aspire to have a top 4 side, but Daniel isn't a top 4 player and I've seen enough to know he never will be.

[DaveyJones'sLocker 647]

i think ull find on monday medhurst had a pretty poor game, credit to bell but as the game went on medhurst pushed a lil furhter up the ground at times, and i would have liked to see bell run off and get more possesion like when he had the shot on goal.

[Dappa Dan 2,188]

As I said, we're last for a reason and fifth year players like Bell aren't quite good enough. We all aspire to have a top 4 side, but Daniel isn't a top 4 player and I've seen enough to know he never will be.

I think we have, at the best of times, maybe 5 players that fit that description... At our worst moments I struggle to count two players that would be "top 4" players a la the MAJORITY of Geelong's starting 22.

McLean and Jones seem to fit in there most of the time (though not all the time), and there are players that show it's within their reach, like Garland and Bate.

But I agree, Bell would be outside this group, which is why I advocate a trade. I don't think he'll ever be as valuable as he is now on the market. His shortcomings MAY be read as fixable at his age by a Malthouse/Matthews type of coach who respect hard work and heads-over-the-ball above everything else.

My point being, the entire side is NEVER going to be made out of "top 4" players as you say. Not even Geelong can boast a whole list like that. SOME of our youngsters won't scale the heights of superstardom, but they'll still be required.

[jikajika 0]

We're last on the ladder for a reason.

Players like Bell polarise supporters. Some think he's a good young improving player and others think he lacks awareness, doesn't have footy smarts, and for all his willingness and hard work just doesn't quite cut it at this level. I'm one of the latter.

As I said, we're last for a reason and fifth year players like Bell aren't quite good enough. We all aspire to have a top 4 side, but Daniel isn't a top 4 player and I've seen enough to know he never will be.

Again with the unjustified dismissal!

Usually yr reasoning is pretty sound, mate, but you've got a blind spot with D.Bell.

I think you mean that you've seen enough to BELIEVE he never will be a top 4 player.

[Hannabal 4]

Again with the unjustified dismissal!

Usually yr reasoning is pretty sound, mate, but you've got a blind spot with D.Bell.

I think you mean that you've seen enough to BELIEVE he never will be a top 4 player.

He's had a great preseason and yet been dropped tonight for the third time this season - a probable wooden spoon season. Will he be lucky and get a third reprieve before the game due to injury ?

Some supporters can't bear to hear a bad word about any player on the list. It would appear that you fall in to this category. Please yourself. I prefer reality.

[Geddy Lee 582]

He was one of my favourites but I don't want to see him in the team anymore. He is not close to being good enough and has proved this time and time again. Rather have Whelan in the team tbh.

[Jarka 767]

Some supporters can't bear to hear a bad word about any player on the list. It would appeat that you fall in to this category. Please yourself. I prefer reality.

What amazes me is that there are people who post on this website who truly believe that we have a top 4 quality list...

[deanox 10,057]

u say whelan is a better chance than any, when he is the smallest of the lot. bode is about 4-5cm smaller than bell. and i think ur grossly overrating bells speed and agility, when frawley would be the same if not better.

'bell is easily replacable, but they might not replace him directly' ? what type of statement is that? it means he is playing [censored] and deserves to be dropped and any player put in his place could prob do a better job for the time being, if not another player can come in and player (unknown) could be moved into bells POSITION which also u are grossly overrating (ur making it sound like BELL KPP? )

your giving to much credit to a player that has done [censored] all year,he might have stopped is opponent at times, but he doesnt help out his team mates, he has no awareness and as shown on monday he consistantly creates COSTLY TURNOVERS,

ur basing ur whole argument on height and speed when height can hardly be considered significant

unless u can give me there agility and 20 m sprint results from draft camp i might review my opinion

i say wheelan is a better chance than any yes. was i basing this on height? no. CJ is taller than either i think but couldnt play that role. bruce is slightly taller again but doesnt have fast enough closing speed. wheelan is a defender. bell, to me, fits the same category. the skill that he seems to perform consistantly is stopping his direct opponent kicking goals. he does this by tackling well, and by matching players in the air, especially on leads. could you imagine playing CJ or bode on medhurst? imo both would get killed. bode is too small to match him in the air. CJ runs around aimlessly alot. CJ plays a great role rebounding, picking up possessions and driving forward, similar to wheatly. bell struggles with that aspect.

i believe bell should get dropped this week, but i am saying there is no obvious replacement for him. bell in good form would be a reasonable match up, imo on brown this week, and so would wheelan. could you imagine CJ playing on brown? i cant, im happy to be proved wrong tho, because that would indicate that CJ has come a long way in the last 5 weeks.

what good are draft camp results? for wheelan that would be nearly 10 years ago, for bell at least 5. but bell is one of the clubs fastest over 100m, in a straight line. im not sure how good his agility is.

[deanox 10,057]

We're last on the ladder for a reason.

Players like Bell polarise supporters. Some think he's a good young improving player and others think he lacks awareness, doesn't have footy smarts, and for all his willingness and hard work just doesn't quite cut it at this level. I'm one of the latter.

As I said, we're last for a reason and fifth year players like Bell aren't quite good enough. We all aspire to have a top 4 side, but Daniel isn't a top 4 player and I've seen enough to know he never will be.

do you think bell could be simply out of form or are you happy to write him off right now?

[DaveyJones'sLocker 647]

guess the proofs in the pudding ey

Out bell

in whelan CJ

emergency frawley

[Hannabal 4]

do you think bell could be simply out of form or are you happy to write him off right now?

Bell is capable of playing AFL football. I'd give my left one to have played one game.

Do I think he's good enough to regularly play good football in a quality team ? No.

[deanox 10,057]

guess the proofs in the pudding ey

Out bell

in whelan CJ

emergency frawley

find where i said that bell shouldnt get dropped this week.

also find where i say he wouldnt get dropped for either cj or wheelan?

my point is that cj plays a different role than bell and that people have been commenting only on the negative aspects of bells game and expecting him to play the same game gathering lots of possessions and rebounding forward.

as someone said abov, it will be interesting to see in a few weeks if everyone is crying out for a mid ranged defender who is accountable, because in general, wheatley and cj arent, and bode is finding his feet.

[deanox 10,057]

Bell is capable of playing AFL football. I'd give my left one to have played one game.

Do I think he's good enough to regularly play good football in a quality team ? No.

fair call, although i persoanlly believe that if he is in form he is capable of holding his spot.

he has a lot to elarn, we'll see if he is able to bounce back from the twos.

[jikajika 0]

Some supporters can't bear to hear a bad word about any player on the list. It would appear that you fall in to this category. Please yourself. I prefer reality.

Nope, just got a penchant for pedantry. Whether you like it or not, neither you nor anybody else has knowledge of Daniel Bell's footballing future, only beliefs.

Of course, you're welcome to claim knowledge of all manner of unknowable things.

Please yourself. I prefer reality.

[Hannabal 4]

Nope, just got a penchant for pedantry. Whether you like it or not, neither you nor anybody else has knowledge of Daniel Bell's footballing future, only beliefs.

Of course, you're welcome to claim knowledge of all manner of unknowable things.

Please yourself. I prefer reality.

Some of us use our eyes and experience and some prefer to wallow in an unlikely faith that just maybe the unlikely could come true.

Please yourself, just don't offer your recruiting services to the club.

[jikajika 0]

Some of us use our eyes and experience and some prefer to wallow in an unlikely faith that just maybe the unlikely could come true.

Please yourself, just don't offer your recruiting services to the club.

Why would you follow occo down the same path?

Hopeless/McLeod.

Eyes and experience/wallow in an unlikely faith.

None of these are particularly helpful to the case of Daniel Bell, and for that reason I subscribe to none of them.

[Hannabal 4]

Why would you follow occo down the same path?

Hopeless/McLeod.

Eyes and experience/wallow in an unlikely faith.

None of these are particularly helpful to the case of Daniel Bell, and for that reason I subscribe to none of them.

WTF is Occo ?

I don't read long threads Cocksnot. My views are my views.

[Nasher 33,617]

$20 says Bell doesn't play for Sandy this weekend.

[DaveyJones'sLocker 647]

find where i said that bell shouldnt get dropped this week.

also find where i say he wouldnt get dropped for either cj or wheelan?

my point is that cj plays a different role than bell and that people have been commenting only on the negative aspects of bells game and expecting him to play the same game gathering lots of possessions and rebounding forward.

as someone said abov, it will be interesting to see in a few weeks if everyone is crying out for a mid ranged defender who is accountable, because in general, wheatley and cj arent, and bode is finding his feet.

id think if his role was so important and there was noone to replace him, you would assume it would be unlikley he would get dropped. and for memory this is not the first time this year

i think ur just being stubborn,

he has been useless and its not like we are tryin to replace a neitz or mclean etc

[jikajika 0]

WTF is Occo ?

I don't read long threads Cocksnot. My views are my views.

Quite.

The problem with not reading threads is that you can unwittingly put forth views which others have already put forth, and which have already been refuted.

I can understand how reading long threads can be a drag, but I can't understand why you would become upset when it is pointed out to you that you are repeating the same fundamentally flawed and already-disproven line of argument as other commenters.

Pride before a fall?

[Hannabal 4]

Quite.

The problem with not reading threads is that you can unwittingly put forth views which others have already put forth, and which have already been refuted.

I can understand how reading long threads can be a drag, but I can't understand why you would become upset when it is pointed out to you that you are repeating the same fundamentally flawed and already-disproven line of argument as other commenters.

Pride before a fall?

OK, I took the bait and read this tedious thread. Where have my views been unequivocally refuted ? You state that Bruce can't kick, Wheatley dislikes physicality, and that Bell struggles with decision making. Ground breaking stuff. I wish I'd said all that 2 years ago. Oh, hang on...

Bell also has terrible lateral movement. He's ok in a straight line, until, of course, he's run down from behind, but he has no natural footy instincts to set up play from defence, he has poor awareness, and a very limited footy brain, hence your assertion that he's the best coming out of the backline of the 3 is extremely flawed. Travis Johnstone is as thick as a brick, but when he's on the footy field the play opens up before him as if it's in slow motion, with Bell it's on fast forward, although I'd prefer it was on rewind. That said, I don't like any of the 3 setting up off half back.

And btw, Wheatley isn't an elite kick. The mechanics look great and one in ten he'll spot up a superbly weighted 50 metre pass to seduce the likes of your good self, but all too often he turns it over by foot - usually sailing over the targeted players head. And why does he turn it over my Pentridge pal ? Pressure. Would those same targets be hit at training ? Absolutely. There's more to being an elite kick than the mechanics, the mind is of uppermost importance.

Thanks for wasting 10 minutes of my time.

[jikajika 0]

Where have my views been unequivocally refuted? You state that Bruce can't kick, Wheatley dislikes physicality, and that Bell struggles with decision making. Ground breaking stuff. I wish I'd said all that 2 years ago. Oh, hang on...

Bell also has terrible lateral movement. He's ok in a straight line, until, of course, he's run down from behind, but he has no natural footy instincts to set up play from defence, he has poor awareness, and a very limited footy brain, hence your assertion that he's the best coming out of the backline of the 3 is extremely flawed. Travis Johnstone is as thick as a brick, but when he's on the footy field the play opens up before him as if it's in slow motion, with Bell it's on fast forward, although I'd prefer it was on rewind. That said, I don't like any of the 3 setting up off half back.

And btw, Wheatley isn't an elite kick. The mechanics look great and one in ten he'll spot up a superbly weighted 50 metre pass to seduce the likes of your good self, but all too often he turns it over by foot - usually sailing over the targeted players head. And why does he turn it over my Pentridge pal ? Pressure. Would those same targets be hit at training ? Absolutely. There's more to being an elite kick than the mechanics, the mind is of uppermost importance.

Thanks for wasting 10 minutes of my time.

Yeah. Nah. Still didn't quite get it, did ya?

I wasn't asking for yr views on Bell or the half backline, or yr views on my views.

All I was doing was pointing out that, like occo, you had committed the fallacy of the excluded middle, and that as a commenter who generally makes lucid contributions, you might like to reconsider yr implication that views on Bell's footballing capabilities are determined EITHER by eyes and experience OR by wallowing in unlikely faith, much as occo inferred that Bell must EITHER be hopeless OR be the next McLeod.

But thanks for playing. As mentioned, yr contributions are generally lucid, but yr arrogance works best when they are also relevant.

[Hannabal 4]

Yeah. Nah. Still didn't quite get it, did ya?

I wasn't asking for yr views on Bell or the half backline, or yr views on my views.

You'll get what you're given.

And the excluded middle is 'output to date', not some fanciful argument built on fairy floss, that in a more welcoming and cuddly environment he may produce a different level of performance. You're selling short the contributions given to him by this club over 5 years.

I've seen all I need to see. Could I be wrong ? Of course. I also reckon you're a Homosexual. Could I be wrong ?

Doubtful.