deejammin'

I hope so, we had our biggest lapse of all against Freo with a ruckman so we still have to prove it but if you'd told me we'd lose Gawn Hogan and Spencer for 8 of the first 11 games and still be 6-5 I'd have taken it in a heartbeat.

Id like to see: In: Gawn (or if not ready, Spencer) Out: O Mac (not on form, on team balance) Oscar is very stiff as he played a good game but Tom is a better backman, Pedersen goes forward and we can't go too tall. We need a good ruckman to help us win the midfield battle, we've covered it well but it's time to get first use again. ANB and Harmes would be on the chopping block if they want to reward Stretch and JKH but I'd back them both in. Its a pretty simple formula win all of the next 3, play finals. Win 2/3 most likely play finals, 1/3 finals possible but unlikely, 0/3 no finals. Its a huge 3 weeks for us. Time to play 4 quarter footy and get our best team back on the field.

To all those in this thread going on about the umpiring I recommend you go back and watch these moments: Early last qtr Collingwood (Howe?) player takes possession at the top of our goalsquare runs, does a don't argue, gets tackled, tries to kick, misses ball, definite holding the ball to Melbourne, not paid, certain goal missed. Treloar taken by Viney in a tackle drops ball on ground, no disposal, HTB missed, picked up by Collingwood goes inside for Collingwood goal. Levi Greenwood drops a mark in the centre square, not infringed, tackled properly by Viney, ball heading forward for Melbourne, either the dropped mark or a free paid and a FIFTY paid to Collingwood. Pies score when Dees would've had a certain score. First quarter Watts taken out in a marking contest on the Wing, pies player takes the ball while Scharenberg barrels him over with what looked like a tackle in a marking contest without his eyes on the ball. Pies goal, no free for Melbourne. There were many other holding the ball frees missed for us, soft high tackles paid to them at crucial moments and many other moments. The Hibberd and Hunt ones should've been HTB, but they missed plenty to us as well. Also both managed to hit the ball so the argument is whether they threw it first and that has barely been paid for 5 weeks. Should've been HTB and we got the rub of the green on those two but so did they, many times, especially in the first half. It was a magnificent gutsy win and to claim the umpires won it for us is ludicrous. great game Dees! Being on Gawn, Hogan and the doggies!!! Edit: Not to mention Oscar perfectly bodying a contested mark on the wing to have it reversed then a pies player does the exact same thing in our forward fifty.. NO FREE!!

Thanks so much Deespencer, Hell bent and Saty your brilliant reports make the abscence of footy at this time of year almost bearable.

Perhaps Jobe's Brownlow is in a storage facility with the extensive documentation of Essendons drug program, fully filled out ASADA forms listing all the "legal" substances taken and letters to Bruce Reid asking for details on Thymomodulin?If only Jobe had looked for it earlier this all could have been avoided! .....Alternatively perhaps Jobe is an unrepentant drug cheat.

I'm still just so pumped about this!!! The more we find out the more I love Jesse. He has clearly been very loyal in the face of big money offers and the lure of home. Also unlike a lot of other young players in this competition who seem to think you are entitled to success by jumping ship to a power club ASAP (cough Jaeger Cough). Jesse seems determined to drag us up the ladder. So pleased for him. Can't wait to chant his name in the stands next year as he kicks bag after bag!! Ps: Welcome back rpfc

Great news! The MFC has done a brilliant job signing all our must keep players. Now we can push for finals over the next three years. That will make them want to hang around. Maybe some active twitter users can blow up Damien Barrett's account about how "gettable" Jesse was this year? He'll claim circumstances changed but that's the thing with his bull),&@ he claims anything and then justifies it with rubbish. Terrible journalism and it seems he was used by his manager mates. Yay Jesse!!

Why didn't they list the substances they knew by name (from text messages) on their ASADA statement forms if they thought all was above board? Why did they not talk about the substances with the club doctor? Why did the worlds largest court on drugs in sport find against them? The Asada/Afl drug code is simple, you are responsible for what goes into your body, if you don't check it and it is likely to be a banned substance you are banned. I know a lot of pro athletes too and they are incredulous at the way our media is fauning over the Essendon players and so desperate to give them excuses. Maybe your personal relationship has clouded your judgement, or maybe you should lay off the ecstasy, it is an illegal drug after all...

Happy to have different views mate. I tend to think CAS has more integrity than Essendon and the AFL and nothing I have read, heard or seen makes me think Essendon are anything but guilty. Im a diehard Melbourne man however and now he's here I'll be barracking hard for Melksham as I do all our players.

Saty I think it's disgusting that the whole thing has been reported and discussed in such a biased way that the whole issue has been distorted and an obvious attempt to cheat has been treated with sympathy rather than the objective view it deserved. I don't think or mean that anyone is disgusting, sorry if I offended or upset anyone and I'm sorry my words could be interpreted that way mate. I would have been better served by saying "distressing".

Lol. Good call.

Justin Quill is also an interesting choice to give his opinion on this issue given he is not a industrial relations lawyer but rather a leading Media and publications lawyer with his bigger clients including AFL media and the Herald Sun. Source: http://www.mk.com.au/our-people/justin-quill/

I didn't read it selectively. I told you that I don't doubt that Essendon players may have a strong negligence case. But when weighing up the strength of a lawyers argument it doesn't help his credibility when the one categorical legal statement he makes in the article is wrong.

That's fascinating if true, can you point me to where you learned this and some proof of this? It still doesn't change the circumstance that in the case of a large amount of litigation lawyers of both sides think they have a case and one side is almost always wrong on the verdict. 50% is more of a saying/exaggeration and there are some unscrupulous lawyers out there who give disingenuous advice to get cases and some clients who force lawyers to argue cases they don't think can win. But overall a large amount of honestly given legal advice by good professionals is found against regularly.

Interesting to quote an article that is 8 months old and also wrong. Quill says: "You don’t get many guarantees from lawyers, but I can almost guarantee you that there will not be any appeal or anything like that from this decision,” Then the Essendon players appealed the CAS decision, so for a "leading sports lawyer" he's already got one thing wrong. I don't doubt his assertion that the players could potentially win a negligence claim against Essendon, but the thing about legal advice is that 50% of it is wrong. Just ask James Hird's lawyers.

I also think they are guilty clearly. And I understand that the younger players faced a tougher circumstance than players like Jobe. But the treatment of this issue in the media and by some on this forum, being so desperate to excuse the players at every turn, never admitting to any of the facts of the case, has been truly disgusting. Its interesting to note the difference in the way our media has treated the Essendon players who couldn't come forward for fear of senior players and club champions versus Russian athletes whose families are threatened by a dangerous regime. Those poor poor Essendon players.

I can imagine it. But ultimately it's the same argument as the Nuremberg trials, doing something you think is probably wrong but accepting it and doing it because those more senior tell you to is actually not an excuse. I don't doubt the younger players were more naive, or heavily influenced by those senior players, but ultimately when it comes to drugs in sport if you take the substance and don't report it you have no leg to stand on. A lot of Essendon players could have been saved a lot of time and money if just one player had been brave enough to report. Some players clearly said no, look at Zaharakis. (Sorry Ted tried to quote you and got my own)

Interestingly none of the Essendon players managersor the AFLPA were kept fully informed by their players on the program at Essendon either. So while I see your point, the players only have themselves to blame, they were fully able to fill out their ASADA forms, speak to Bruce Reid or speak to their managers but chose to maintain secrecy for a competitive edge, that is not innocent behaviour and I don't see why so many are so keen to excuse it.

I really hope you're right. Jesse has been a bit up and down this but overall his performance has him in the top 2 or 3 young key forwards in the comp and he can improve. I don't like this new era of massive player movement and loyalty and contracts meaning next to nothing. It would be really nice to be able to support a similar looking, improving best 22 for a few years. And considering the excellent job our club has done in keeping key players this year Jesse is the final piece of the puzzle. I really hope he stays and all this WC stuff is just media noise.

It seems to me young AFL players say no to their bosses all the time. They say no to contracts, they say no to staying if they have a better offer, they say no to giving the club an idea of their intentions, some really talented players say no to different roles, they say no to staying an hour away from their hometown, we had one who lied to a club champion who was dying of cancer for a whole year to take a big contract. The good ones say no to booze with friends, unhealthy food, staying out late, etc etc. But when it comes to saying no to taking an enormous amount of injections that contravene your ASADA/AFL training, aren't administered by a doctor or nurse, aren't told to the club doctor or put on ASADA forms before matches it's all of a sudden impossible to say no. I think you should get your hand off it.

Wow, you are a hair splitter aren't you. CAS the worlds leading authority and top arbiter of doping in professional sport found to a "comfortable satisfaction", CAS's determinant of guilt for all its cases that "all players were significantly at fault" for violating the code by taking a nominated banned substance which was Tb4. You can argue legal wording semantics all you want but the result is the same. All doping cases worldwide are judged by comfortable satisfaction, this is the standard by which guilt is judged in doping in professional sport. Tb4 was the substance the players were accused of taking that violated the code. The highest court in the world on drugs in sport found to the worldwide standard for the leading code in drugs in sport that Melksham and his colleagues took TB4. Melksham= Banned drug cheat

Great post, I missed this before I posted my less detailed one above. Got fired up by the ignorance of Saty's comments on the subject and skipped ahead. Beautifully put Bing.

Thymosin Beta 4 has been categorically proven in numerous research studies to promote advanced healing in human muscle, organ and bone tissue. A simple google search will provide you with all you need. It's main medical function when administered in the large injected dosages like the Essendon players received is to help with the quicker healing of heart tissue after major heart attacks, it also promotes the same kind of rapid healing in all muscle tissue. It is banned because the majority of increase in athletes fitness comes from making small breaks in muscle tissue due to excercise and having them repair stronger. Tb4 speeds this process up to superhuman levels. Saty I respect your love of the Mfc and your enormous contribution to most threads, particularly training. But Jake Melksham was found guilty of taking Tb4 in large dosages to aid his athletic performance at a time when it was banned. He is a drug cheat, he's done his time and will be welcomed back by MFC supporters but no amount of blurring lines because you are unaware of details of peptides like Tb4 changes that fact.

Boofheads like Boofheads, Robbo, Sam Newman QED

Great stuff. Its the whole problem with drugs in sport once they have been taken where do the benefits for the cheating athletes/disadvantages for everyone else end? Essendon have already tainted 4 seasons of football by playing with the benefits of extensive PED use. Thankfully they didn't win the flag but who knows what impact they had on ladder positioning and percentage? Would the other results have been the same? There should be universal outrage from all supporters, other players and club administrators about the way this has tainted the results of every year from 2012-2015. Instead there's actually debate about whether a player who won an individual medal at the height of an illegal performance enhancing drug program should give it back? Incredible influence Essendon PR and AFL HQ business as usual has had...