Lord Travis

If true, then we have done very well this off-season and picked up another player with elite potential.

This should be on the Draft and Trading Board. Toumpas without a second thought. Tremendous work ethic, good leadership potential, steps up when his team needs him, good pace, agility and skills. A more rounded player really. If he is available at pick 4 and we don't take him then we've stuffed up.

If Toumpas is available and we overlook him I'll be very very disappointed.

This sounds good to me. We should take some speedy and/or skilled players here, and this guy sounds like he fits that mould.

But then to counter that, Viney has better skills and is quicker and more agile. I'd rate Viney higher because of that.

Best of luck in whatever you choose to do Clint. I remember when his father passed and he still decided to play. Gutsy effort. You gave your all for the jumper, and you'll always have my respect.

Evans and Nicholson upgraded to main list. AFL's new Rookie list has been made smaller by 2 spots. We have 4 senior spots left to fill. Likely 3 National Draft and 1 Pre-season draft.

I was wrong, that's why haha! Just had a look at the stats and we were dead last in clearances for the year. For some reason I had it in my head that like 2011 we were towards the middle of the table in the clearances. Very surprising to see the team go that far backwards in clearances under Neeld. When watching this year it felt like we got more first dibs on the ball, but it was a lot of bang it in hope. That being the case, Wines will be the perfect selection, and the likely one. I still feel we definitely need an injection of good kicking skills into the team though. Our kicking skills are abysmal! On a side note, in Daniher's last full year as coach in 2006 we were 3rd for clearances. I miss watching that team

When I posted that we had picks 3,4 and 13. I would've loved Wines, one of Toumpas or O'Rourke, and another quality player such as Menzel, Mayes or Kennedy at 13. Since that point in time we now only have pick 4. I look at who we've brought onto our list, who remains on our list, and I see the slowest and least skillful list in the league. We'll be fine winning ball. Our clear deficiency is our footskills and ability to spread and control the footy. Wines won't really help this. Toumpas, O'Rourke, or Macrae would. That's why I'd prefer we get an all-rounder with kicking skills like Toumpas or O'Rourke, or an outsider like Macrae. That's just my opinion as someone who watches too much football and is sick of us losing!

With defensive depth we have now, Davis is no loss. I do think we should hold onto Jetta though. I like his attitude, and his kicking skills are quite good.

If that was the case he wouldn't have been delisted. Definitely worth a go though as he won't cost us anything.

That was Stanton. You must be thinking of the wrong player. Dyson's main asset is his pace! He's a speedy flanker/midfielder, but his skills let him down. He'd be worth a rookie spot, but not much else.

I would love Toumpas to slide to us! He's the most well rounded midfielder in the draft. If we have to choose between Wines and O'Rourke, I'd prefer the later, but will be happy with either. Please Melbourne just develop them properly this time! We've drafted so much talent in the last few years and haven't developed it properly. We cannot afford to keep wasting first round picks!

Sydney have Jetta, who kicked 45 goals from the midfield! Jack, Mcveigh and Kennedy all chimed in with 20 something each as well. Jetta, Jack and Mcveigh are all super dangerous whenever they get the ball in the forward half due to their skill, pace and agility. You just know if one of them gets the ball that a scoring opportunity is all but guaranteed. We have no player other than Blease who looks like he could hit the scoreboard or hit up targets cleanly on a consistent basis. Jones is good at hitting the scoreboard, but his field kicking isn't elite. I don't hold too much hope for Barry as he was rated as a third rounder, so is speculative at this stage. I just feel like the main thing we lack, and have lacked for years now, is good kicking skills in the side. We can get heaps of the ball, but if we don't have good kicking skills then it's just going to lead to lots of turnovers. All the best sides of recent years, Hawthorn, Geelong, Sydney, Collingwood, all have god footskills and create chains of uncontested play due to this. There needs to be a balance, and IMO we are overstocking inside at the expense of outside at this stage.

Wines' outside work is average-good. His skills are nothing special, his pace is average, but he does hit the goals when he get a chance. I won't be disappointed if we take him, as he'll be a good midfielder for us and definitely has the drive to make sure he gets the best out of himself. I just worry about our outside mids. Of the ones you've listed there, Blease will make it over time once his tank is big enough, Bail will likely be delisted in the next few years, Davey is cooked, Strauss is more a half back flanker and even there is struggling to get a game, and Watts will play down back or head back forward. So of that list there is only one who I'd say is going to be playing that role long term. Byrnes will play forward pocket for a year or two. Rodan will be a rounded midfielder for a year or two, Tynan is a defender, and Taggert I hope comes on as he seems like he could be valuable in the midfield. You can see from our list though we desperately need outside class more than inside grunt.

Holy sh*t let it go guys! How about we talk about Oliver Wines in the Oliver Wines thread? I think he's a certainty to get picked up by us now, although I don't agree with it. We'll certainly be well stocked for inside mids next year and going forward. We desperately need some outside spread and skill now.

I actually think it's the other way around. Outside players usually need time to build up their body and learn to read the game, get to the right places and hone their skills. Inside types can usually play straight off the bat. Going by this logic, you draft the outside type first to give them extra time to develop, then get the inside type later as they are usually ready to go. Toumpas, O'Rourke or Macrae this year, inside mid next year.

Good for key defensive depth. We have a large number of talls on the list. We might be the tallest club in the league now. I'd like to see us sign some midfielders, as it's still our weakness and we have to get the ball in the first place!

Brent Prismall and Ricky Dyson delisted by the Bombers this afternoon. Don't think Dyson is much chop, has pace but poor skills. Prismall could be worth taking as a delisted free agent at a cheap price? He has decent skills when up and going.

Watts lead the league for intercept marks before he got injured... so he was doing that pretty regularly. Maybe you should pay more attention? Also, fairly sure Tynan is heavier than the listed weight of 76kgs! His shoulders and arms are on the larger side at the club, and I'd wager he's closer to 86 than 76. Nothing to worry about with him, he is a solid unit and just needs to get fitter. When he played early games last year his work rate and intent were fantastic, he just blew up quickly. Get him fitter and he slots right into the team IMO.

I think most, if not all, the club sites are run through Telstra. They don't get quickly updated stats and info, and it probably won't get updated until once all the drafts are done and lists complete. On Taggert, I'm hoping he comes on and adds to our midfield depth, as our midfield is still awful and we need as many options as possible.

O'Rourke has better skills and decision making than Wines. He has no problem winning his own ball, as evidenced by roughly 40% of his possessions being contested this year. He is the type to get the ball amongst a pack and then break away to spear the pass. He's well rounded as a midfielder, and would suit our list better IMO.

I was one of the few on here not just blindly saying we should take Wines. I still think O'Rourke will be a better player, and is more rounded. People should watch his highlights video to see him read the play, break away from packs and hit up pinpoint kicks. That is one of the key things we lack, and when I look at our midfield at present I don't see where else this skill will come from. He'd fit in well at our club because of this.

Pace is average, kicking is average-good. He'll be an inside midfielder at senior AFL level. He doesn't have the pace or skills to play outside and be damaging. He is a good tackler though, so won't be one-way. Like Viney he is just ferocious at the ball or man with the ball. He will be OK to link up in chains, but he will mainly be a contested ball winner similar to Moloney, but with a defensive side to his game too. He's a "safe" pick, but I don't expect him to become a star. Toumpas, O'Rourke, Macrae and Mayes all have better skills, pace, decision making and upside, but are more risky in that it may not translate consistently to AFL level. I think Neeld's love for hard nuts will see Wines selected by us if he is available, even if he isn't the most talented.

Talented player, but not worth pick 4. Too much of a risk at such a high pick. He'll go at pick 20 to Adelaide IMO. He'll wind up like Petrenko, in that he won't be a pure midfielder, more a flanker, and will flash in and out of games.