george_on_the_outer

To get back to the title of the thread: The rules of the game have not changed with respect to "incorrect disposal". i.e having had opportunity to dispose of the ball, the player when tackled must dispose of the ball by hand or foot... Sadly Geishen ( thank heavens he is now gone ) had instructed umpires to completely disregard the Rules of the game. They don't care how the ball is disposed of, as long as it "gets out".....thrown, dropped or spilled. If it doesn't "get out" then you are pinged. If it does, it's play on. The fans know the rules better than the umpires, and they will continue to call "ball" because they are usually right.... ( except for Collingwood and Essendon, who think the rule is any opposition player who is tackled is "holding the ball" )

Come on everyone......it's always difficult for Andy to ask for money, and he and Nasher are the only reason this site keeps running. Without them, we will finish going the same way as Demonology. You can donate $5 or $50 or more....but ever little bit helps. It's not fair that we ALL enjoy the camaraderie of Demonland, yet Andy has to pay for it out of his own pocket. So jump on board and help out...........

Not long after Viney was drafted by us, I met one of the coaches from Echuca ( where both Wines and Viney played),on an AFL coaching course. His comment: we would have been silly to draft both of them, as you don't need 2 of those players in the side at the same time.( He would know as he did!)

Exactly......This "new" game plan is a rehash of the old Alan Jeans mantra about the game: " we've got the ball, they've got the ball or the ball is in dispute..." To put it even more simply...when we have the ball the opposition can't score. And yes it will frustrate the hell out of supporters. Just wait for the calls of "just kick it" to be heard throughout the outer in season proper. Roos has shown he is not about pretty football....he is about winning games. The other disadvantage we faced in both the Richmond and Geelong games was a lack of forward targets. That is the Option 1 that rpfc spoke about. Hopefully come Round 1 it will be open to us. In this game, Hogan showed his willingness to run into space to enable the kick forward, but Geelong were soon onto him, as the solitary "go to man". You don't notice that when watching on TV, although the commentators often spoke of "no-one to go to". And let's not forget Geelong are a well drilled unit. They fill the space very well.

Noticed the Duke of Wellington Hotel is now a bronze partner, but The Wharf has disappeared. http://www.melbournefc.com.au/the-club/sponsors/sponsor-matrix Probably not what PJ was talking about though.....

Agree with all the comments to date. For me the most promising thing about him is that he kicks the ball properly, can mark above his head, and instinctively knows where to run...i.e. he is a natural footballer. We don't have to teach him these skills. Which unfortunately are lacking with our current crop of rucks, and have been trying to teach for up to 5 years in some cases.

A bit of AFL sanctioned video here of the training session, once you get past the Saints fluff... http://www.afl.com.au/video/2014-02-07/saints-hit-beach-dees-and-hawks-intraclubs

How about we don't promote any..... There are 20 players outside the game day team who should be next in line to be selected. 3 months ago we selected some of those players ahead of the rookies, because we thought they were better options. What has changed? Riley would have been put on the LTI, because you have to stay there for 8 weeks. There is no point doing it 1 week out from the season start, or you shoot yourself in the foot, if he is fit to play in say round 3. And why would you elevate say a backman like Georgiou, or a small forward like Jetta, if a ruckman is needed in the event of injuries to our ruck group? At this point in the season doing nothing is the best option.

Have the betting agencies got wind of something??? http://www.sportsbet.com.au/betting/australian-rules/afl Essendon now at $15 for least amount of wins. Only us, saints and GWS attracting better odds. Brisbane equal. Am told the odds were 100-1 just three months ago.

A wet training session in the middle of summer. What a contrast to last week and that which the BOM is predicting for next week! Good news for the start: Jamar, Gawn and Dawes are back training with the main group. They were excused for "contact" sessions, but finally a ray of hope for our big man division. However, Fitzpatrick, Hogan and Clark were still with the rehab group. Hogan ran heaps of laps and has a bandage on the knee. Clark running laps as well, but not as much as Hogan. Fitzy not sighted outside the rehab group. Viney also cemented in the rehabs. (is it his hip?). I'll make one outrageous prediction at this stage of the year: JKH will be a certainty in the season proper. A wet sliding, slippery ball bouncing through players legs in the goal square. Suddenly, a flash of lightning from the left and with one hand JKH picks it up and slides it through the big sticks. He's the small, fast crumbing forward we have been looking for. Roos running the session as he did before Christmas. Lots of game type running, for hours on end. When something isn't working as it should, in come the players, the correct method outlined, and out they go again. No-one is in any doubt about what he wants right there and then. It was an absolute delight to see a group of skilled capable players in the mid-field. The addition of Watts, Tyson, Cross, Mitchie, and Vince just sees sure hands and vision which was lacking last year. But just more of that type around the ball is exactly what the doctor ordered. It then releases Trengove, Toumpas and others to other duties. It will be a completely revitalised group for the coming season. The rucks, Spencer in particular, got a good workout together with Greg Stafford, in a series of marking contests. The change to the rotation rules for 2014 means they will have to spend more time on the ground, so they had better be able to mark the ball in a contested scenario when resting. Also good to see Christian Salem as the kicker for this set of contests. The 18 year old was selected for his ability to put the ball exactly where Stafford wanted it. His skills are simply first class. We may not see much of him this season, as we have a lot more depth, but when he is ready, he will be a revelation. Not much else to comment on. The rest of the group are looking good (like everyone does at this time of the year), but Strauss is starting to show some real capability and desire that was lacking before. He certainly has put on the muscle, and kicks beautifully every time. We might have another smoky for the season ...

Excellent reports from Seraph and Steamin, leaves me with little more to add. Cross: Very impressed ... he may be older (who am I to talk about a 30 year old being old!), but he knows how to move in traffic. He will be a real bonus for Jones because he can get the ball and dish it out. One of those types who you wonder how he got 30 touches at the end of a game. Tyson: Still a young and developing body but can he move the ball quickly! Sharp hands and along with Cross will set new standards for the mids. His best may be some time away, but he is a real gem in the making. Michie: Another good pick up. Moves effortlessly and almost appears to be going half pace, but is suddenly there in the thick of it when needed. Toumpas: Agree with the other reports. Lost that puppy fat, moves quickly and can he kick ... accurately and quickly. Has quickly adapted to AFL pace which he struggled with in his first year. Spencer: Please stay on the ground fit, we will be needing you more than we should this year. (Jamar, Fitz, Gawn, Clark, Dawes all sidelined ... do we have anyone else over 200cm?) Nicholson: can only kick when not under any sort of pressure. Once the drills involve an opponent the ball goes anywhere. Jamar: not even out with the rehab group. No hope for start of season. Too hot to stay to the end. The foggy start at 9.30 with the temperature at 17 soon disappeared!

I'll probably add some more later, but I think we have some real problems for the start of the season. Today the rehab group consists of Gawn, Clark, Dawes, Viney, Fitzpatrick. They were the ones who turned up. No Hogan or Salem(that I saw). The troubling aspect is that it leaves Spencer as our sole big man, with maybe Pedersen as a back up.. With the first NAB game just over a month away, this is looking ominous to me. Dawes and Clark at least have seasons behind them and may not take as long to get back up, but I still strongly subscribe to the theory of every week off the track after New Year means 1 week less in season proper. Billy Stretch looks keen and capable. But he is still a skinny kid and only 17, so you can't expect much else, and you really can't do comparisons based on training sessions. It is pleasing that he has the opportunity to participate at full AFL level training and the club get the chance to look at him close up, like they did with Viney.

Since we don't have any elite players perhaps we could recruit some more Non-elites like Sandilands, Judd, Jon Brown, Matt Priddis, Jordan Lewis, Nic Nat, to the club....? Rance, Shaw and Monfries...please....

Improvers: Simple......if they don't have their season blighted by injury like last year Clark Dawes Gawn Sliders: Again simple: Jamar....can't get on the park any more, and can't jump off the ground when he does. Take your pick out of Bail, Nicholson, Byrnes.

Here is the link to the Morgan poll in 2011: http://www.roymorganonlinestore.com/News/1424---Swans,-Magpies-and-Lions-have-most-supporte.aspx There is no doubt at all that Australia wide, we have one of the lowest "supporter" bases, with consistent numbers around 200K over a 10 year period. However, figures for some other teams simply don't make sense: e.g Brisbane with 1.4M in 2004, but 820k in 2011. or Sydney with 1.7M in 2006, but just over 1M in 2011? Supporters simply don't disappear. They may die off slowly, but a drop of this number indicates the sampling is flawed. Likewise Port with 300K supporters? Only if you sample in Elisabeth in S.A. And therein lies the problem. If you sample in Brisbane, Geelong or Fremantle or Port you will get a skewed result. How does Morgan then translate that Australia wide?.... They don't say. Yet while the sample is flawed, it does show an increase in "supporters" ( however Morgan discover that) post a Premiership for every successful side.

The annual report has been out for a while, but is worthwhile spending some quiet time over this holiday period to make sense of it: ANNUAL REPORT While it is easy to make comments about who and what were responsible, the Club incurred a loss of $1.7M and is now carrying $3.1M of debt. That's not good news in anyones book, but the fortunate side to the debt is that a substantial amount is associated with Gaming machine licenses. And it is being paid down by the income from the same over the next 2 years. And those same machines increased income by $5M from the previous year. Without that the financial results would have been approaching disastrous. The report does highlight the effects of the appalling on-field performance in 2013. Revenue down by $4.4M from membership, sponsorship, gate receipts and corporate hospitality!. No one wanted to pay money to see a s...t side playing c...p football. Peter Jacksons hope of turning the red ink of this year into black in 2014 is very achievable, with just a modicum of improvement on-field. We have already seen the membership numbers improvement and hope that translates to an overall increase for the year. Likewise the locking in of old and new sponsors was nothing short of miraculous. Let's hope the players can deliver something that makes it worthwhile going to the footy in the coming year!

Nice little article here from Titus O'Reily. Interesting to see Essendon haven't come up with anything for 2014 after their disastrous 2013 effort: http://www.titusoreily.com/post/70442900082/reviewing-every-afl-clubs-membership-campaign-slogan

Went down to Casey this morning, absolutely beautiful conditions for training ... overcast and low 20's. The ground is a delight, well grassed and soft. I usually don't wander down before Christmas, because the whole team is rarely there, so it is difficult to determine who is actually not getting on the track and who has gone for extended breaks or back home etc. That being said the following were not there: Grimes, Jamar, Frawley and Fitzpatrick. The rehab group was out early, while the rest were doing the normal stretches and warm-ups. So Dawes, Byrnes, Blease, Clisby, and Bail headed off to a back oval ... while I think it was Michie who ran lap after lap until retiring inside. Impressions? The first is the presence of Roos. He sits in the middle watching everything, and I mean everything. Unlike Neeld who was rarely sighted at this time of the year, Roos is taking it all in, and no doubt building up his impression of who can, who can't, who wants to and who doesn't care. But it was hard to find anyone not putting in 100%, again a contrast to previous years where there were always stragglers in the running bits, or some going at half pace or at a pace of their own setting. It is hard to say who is doing well or who has changed because of the drills being used. And this was the most dramatic change for me having watched training for many, many years ... the running! There were no drills which didn't involve running. For 2 hours the players performed all the usual stuff but at full pace. Those who didn't participate in the drill directly were sent on continuous runs around the boundary. When they were on the ground they just ran and ran. Poor Max King blew up about 3/4 of the way through the session and must now be wondering what AFL is all about, as he watched team-mates still going at full pace around him, while he lay on the ground exhausted. Then to finish it off, after the 2 hour stint, the group was sent out on another run. The result: all the players have played a game at the pace of the game without the contact. So expect the endurance of the group to be considerably higher than ever seen before. Getting blown away or fading in the final quarter should be a thing of the past. Finally, while it is still pre-Christmas, it was good to see Gawn, Clark and Trengove finally out training fully. I always subscribe to the theory that for every week in the rehab group following the break you can subtract one week from the season proper. Let's see who fronts up post Christmas and running before we make assessments about who will be available Round 1.

Game Plan? Two words with little meaning other than to make supporters feel like something scientific is being done! Playing football, like most sports is about the individual players ability to execute basic skills. Some players have an abundance of skills, others not. The real skill as a Coach is to recognise the skills and abilities within the playing group, and giving those deficient players a role which causes least damage. So when Roos was at Sydney he had Richards playing one on one solely in the back line, Rhys Shaw as a half back solely, McGlynn as a forward pocket solely., Jolly to hit the ball to his feet, where their good kids could do something with it. They were drilled to perform their role no matter what. There is no " game plan" about teaching players to kick or run to certain locations. Every quality AFL player does that naturally. What IS difficult is teaching the sub-optimal players to run and do things which do not come naturally. We have suffered from an excess of sub-optimals, who then weren't given a simple role. Roos plan at Sydney was filling roles. We have already seen the recruiting done to fill these deficiencies. And we know that Cross, Vince and probably Michie won't need to be taught AFL footy basics. This then has the secondary effect of denying selection to the sub-optimals. As others have noted.."game plan" is to win. Not having spuds, lazies or incapables running around guarantees that.

7 years of mediation Jack......must have been some legal case!

Exactly Chippy. Perhaps some others could investigate facts a little, just a little .....before they start shooting

Although it's 12 months out of date, page 122 of the AFL Annual report gives a breakdown of what the clubs get IN TOTAL. http://www.afl.com.au/staticfile/AFL%20Tenant/AFL/Files/AFL%20Annual%20Report%202012_web.pdf Make of it what you will, but the difference between a top club and a bottom club is very little. The travesty is that while we got a lousy 100K more than Collinwood in 2012, it was the other advantages given to them through fixturing, TV allocation etc, that enable them to promote and sell their brand. The AFL makes much of "sharing out the pie", with lifelines thrown to us, Port, Footscray etc, but this only makes up for the damage that their other actions cause.

Don't expect anything until after 31 October, when I understand the sponsorship deals expire. That is why the backdrop for the pressers in recent days still show Webjet and Opel.

I have no doubt we will keep pick 9 for a quality mid ( save for a ridiculous trade like Kennedy). It completes the deck which we have accumulated in this trading period. We have gone from having Viney, Toumpas at 18 to Jones X2 & Terlich, with a big age gap. The holes have been filled in the middle and at the upper end from an age perspective, with Tyson and Cross. An 18 year old at pick 9, ensures we have a continuous age profile through that group of mids. To me it shows that Roos is not just thinking about this year but next as well...and beyond. If any more trades are to be done, we might throw away late picks to secure another body for the mid-field as a filler, but it becomes a dice throw. Would they be better than a kid at a pick in the 50's, 80's or even 90's.

Out of contract are: TAGGERT, Rory TAPSCOTT, Luke GRIMES, Jack NICHOLSON, Daniel DUNN, Lynden MAGNER, James JETTA, Neville The further delistings will come from this group. Any contracted players salary has to be included in salary cap if delisted. One would think there are some relatively easy decisions among that group, or they could be traded for draft selections which won't be used.....