old55

His clearances, tackles and contested numbers are pretty good. He's an outside finisher but he's not soft. He's exactly what we need IMO. In this thread across the course of one injury restricted year he's gone from gun worth pick 6 to "who cares" For all Ross and Clarko say "one soldier goes down another comes in" role playing, I still think there is a big element of synergy between players that develops over the years. I think everyone is excited about Max, Clayton and Jesse, but IMO something is missing in that equation at the moment. I think Hartlett provides the missing link and would really complement the inside work that Oliver is going to produce. Max tap, Oliver handball to Hartlett, 70m gained to Jesse 1:1. I want to win a flag. We've had 10 shocking years and people pine for the good old Daniher days when we made finals - we did that 12 years out of 20 prior to our recent trough but we were never really flag challengers at any time. I think we have the makings now but need to take the right list management steps. 2019-20 is the time to bring in 30+ FA as icing. Now is the time to build the list components to really challenge then. We've taken piscks 2, 3, 4 and 9 in the past 2 years, now is the time to invest in mature talent that fits our needs. Bernie will probably be finished and Hartlett will be 28-29 in those years and have played in our system for 3 years. I couldn't care less now about Wells, Dal Santo, Thompson or Mitch White, they won't figure in an MFC flag, but Hartlett could.

No, I'm pretty sure you haven't.

Hartlett highlights:

It belongs in the Hartlett thread but - we'd have to give our 2017 1st rounder. It's possible ANB could be worked into a deal. A 3rd club like GC with lots of 2016 first rounders may need to be involved. It's do-able.

You get what you pay for. Roos and Goodwin are on record trying to build a flag winning combo. Hartlett will be in his prime right through the period we challenge with our current crop.

Hartlett is a very skillful player - seems chronically under-rated here. He's actually almost 6 years younger than Wells - that's 6 extra years he would play for us. That's really the whole point!

It's quite possible with those deals needing to get done and high value pick 3 that Freo are biding their time until next year before pushing it.

The AFL is probably waiting on the appeal outcome. If they stripped Jobe's Brownlow and the EFC players somehow won the appeal then it would not be ideal.

Very good point! And they don't have a 2nd this year either. It would have to be some Judd-style deal then 3, 2017 2nd, good player.

Prefer Hartlett over Wells or Dal Santo http://www.footywire.com/afl/footy/ft_player_compare?playerStatus1=A&tid1=13&playerStatus2=A&tid2=14&type=A&pid1=398&pid2=3110&fid1=C&fid2=C

If Hogan left we'd be looking at Freo's 1st this year (3) and next year. We should be able to convert them into something like Tom Mitchell, Hamish Hartlett and Michael Hibberd and leave our picks intact. That's where it sits IMO. That's why it's important for Hogan to decide.

Based on selection preferences, roles and VFL roles in 2016, with Bernie and Salem in the midfield as you suggest, and with Hibberd and Melksham in the back 7 this is more or less how the list looks, with the / at depth:: Tall Backs [3]: T.Mac, O.Mac, Frost / Dunn, Garland Small Backs [4]: Jetta, (Hibberd), Hunt, Melksham / Harmes, Wagner, White, Michie, Smith, Lumumba Ruck [1]: Gawn / Spencer, Mitch King Mids: [9]: Viney, N. Jones, Tyson, Oliver, Brayshaw, Petracca, Stretch, Vince, Salem / Vandenberg, Bugg, M.Jones, ANB, Trengove, Grimes, Newton Tall Fwds [3]: Hogan, Watts, Weidemann / Pedersen, Hulett, Dawes, Max King Small fwds [2]: Kent, Garlett / Kennedy, Kennedy-Harris, Terlich

I'm not against it. I wonder about Hibberd, Hunt, Salem, Vince, Melksham, Harmes, Wagner and White all off HB. Sure 1 or 2 may be able to move into the midfield but we have Viney, Jones, Tyson, Oliver, Brayshaw, Petracca, Stretch and Vandenberg in that rotation already - not sure who they are going to force out?

I agree with your position. I'd only trade those player to significantly improve our list. For example if we could acquire some midfield class, a forward-ruck, retain a pick around the 2nd round (assuming ours goes for Hibberd) then I would be open to a trade of Dunn, Garland, Kennedy-Harris, Neal-Bullen, Harmes or Wagner. I'm definitely not interested in turning them over for picks beyond 40, I'd like to see another year development into Kennedy-Harris, Neal-Bullen, Harmes and Wagner to see what they can deliver, but if you want to bring in quality then you have to be prepared to give something. If ANB could get a trade for Hartlett across the line, if Geelong was interested in Wagner (to replace Enright) for Vardy (if we thought his body was OK), if Brisbane would give their 3rd rounder 38ish for Dunn or Garland - edit: Brisbane have 28 and 47 (traded 38 to Geelong last year), maybe we could upgrade 44 into 28. If we did bring in some midfield class and a fwd-ruck then I think M.Jones and Pedersen would be delistable. Mitch White has played well in the VFL but he was fumbly at AFL level against St.Kilda in the extra pressure, he might make it, but with Hibberd and Melksham coming in and Salem coming back he's a long way down the HB pecking order.

I think 16 a side is worth trying. It's not a rule change in the way the game is played so it would have minimum impact on umpire interpretation etc. I'd hate to see "zones" and players limited to them, that would be a major change to the way the game is played and umpired. 16 a side is a low impact change that could produce great results.

If we can pick up a fwd-ruck then both Dawes and Pedersen can be delisted IMO. If not then we must retain Pedersen. Stuck with: Lumumba Delistable: Dawes, Newton, Terlich, Michie (R), Max King (R) FA leave: Grimes Possibly delistable depending on who comes in: Pedersen, M.Jones, White (R) Tradeable: Dunn, Garland, Kennedy-Harris, Neal-Bullen, Harmes, Wagner (R)

Page scrolling broken?

It's worth trialling IMO.

Hartlett: 2012 -15 games, 2013 - 22 games, 2014 - 22 games, 2015 - 22 games, 2016 - 15 games. Data doesn't support "injury prone". Wonder what you thought of Bernie before he came across?

Dal Santo v Hartlett http://www.footywire.com/afl/footy/ft_player_compare?playerStatus1=A&tid1=13&playerStatus2=A&tid2=14&type=A&pid1=370&pid2=3110&fid1=C&fid2=C Yes we'd have to pay a lot more for Harlett

I don't think $700k is confirmed is it? Anyway the smaller share we pay, the higher pick we have to give and vice versa.

i can't remember an off-season when there were this many quality mids potentially on the market. Mitchell, Prestia, O'Meara and Hartlett. Sure last year quality was higher with Dangerfield and Treloar, but that's 4 decent players - maybe it's the new normal? I'm keen on Hartlett, he can definitely play and both outside and inside (decent contested, clearance and tackle numbers) - I think he fits our need more than Mitchell or Prestia and is a safer option than O'Meara. At 26 he's in a good age bracket - we're light on in the 25-28 bracket next year with just Gawn, Melksham, Watts, Jetta, Garlett and Hibberd as regular selections in there. That bracket will all be there when this group challenge for the flag. I think we could conjure a deal with Port involving our 2017 1st.

Prefer Hartlett

Pretty modest stats for Mitch White as 2nd best for Casey. Tackles = 0, I50 = 0, R50 = 1

Chris Johnson was the only one who transferred in the merger. Played in all 3 flags. Pike came later in 2001 via Norh. Lynch earlier in 1994.