rpfc

I don't think it is. The club has issues that need to be rectified and we are more than in our right to question the decisions, or lack of decisions, that are made.

Are you worried about the board itself or the lack of leadership from the board? I agree that the latter is a concern but I am more worried about the meddlesome Admin, the focus of the FD, and the pathetic on-field leasership. Maybe I am missing the forest for the trees, but at some point the grown-ups put in charge of areas have to act like one and take ownership over their own failures and problems.

Evidently the sniping we do on here is little compared to what goes on at the club...

He is not out of contract. He can stay, but not as a leader.

No. Do the Leading Teams 'decide your own group' but do it with the uner 24 group. They can choose their captain from the list but the bulk of the leaders have to come from our future - it is time to get them involved. We can't decide who can be good leaders. But we should set the parameters for the leadership group.

I hope Garry and Todd and telling this to Brad and his sorry band this week.

Or maybe it is artistic licence by the journo? What an awful state of affairs if this is true. If this little piece of nonsense is true we have got bigger problems than Tom Scully's recalcitrance.

I'm not saying that they do. What I am saying is that you pick opportunistic times to bring up your valid arguments and your valid arguments are myopic to the board that deposed the Gardner board. I don't want to do this now. From where I sit - the board are the least of our issues.

They did this to themselves. JMac is the only senior player I can think of that we moved on that was still contributing. He is the one we screwed up. And if the senior players are worried about being moved on too soon, they should be, they have had their time and have failed. Does that mean they lose their jobs? Depends on their contract... I simply want to - in 2012 - have a younger group in the Leadership Group, with the senior players on the periphery. It's reasonable and it's required.

Good points as always HSOG. It is somewhat (read greatly) diminished by the fact that you are rarely on here and seem to be only posting when there are board issues or a poster has taken exception to the Gardner board. All board members, past and present, have the best interests of the club at heart. Your inability to see any positives in the current board, nor admit any negatives in the Gardner board, don't do your arguments justice. There is no black and white with well-meaning people. And PS - Neale Daniher was asked to re-apply for his position. If their was any dignity in his dismissal it was all Neale's.

I don't know if it is all that clear... This is clear.

This is what I want to know - were all the players involved/aware of the "leaders" grievances? I am exhausted with Green, Rivers, Moloney, Davey, Sylvia, and, to a lesser extent, Jones. And I know this may mean McLardy gets another phone call from Brad Green of Brighton - but I want to see the Leadership Group removed at the end of the season and the under 24 brigade told to choose their leaders for 2012 and beyond. I don't want to be unreasonable when it comes to our 'senior' or older players, but at same point they are failures as leaders and we must evolve past them.

I don't know if it was that explicit, but I can see how a decree similar to that would engender resentment. But there has to be a balance between playing those players who will be around in the future and making sure you reward good form in the reserves of the older players.

He is in the top 5 players at the club. Just shows you the issues we have...

Brent Moloney averages 29.1 touches a game in 2012 when we win. He averages 18.9 when we lose. Not including the Geelong game. He averages 18 when we get beaten by 41 points or more. Not including the Geelong game. That is unacceptable. Yes, he will win the Bluey, but that just illustrates our issues doesn't it?

Ashamed? I'm still proud. I'm a little worried but I know that everyone's heart is in the right place even if their nose isn't. I not only think this club can be slavaged, I think this season can be salvaged. That isn't to say we will make finals - it's to say that the players, the coaches, the admin, and the board can have their say and get their issues out in the open so that 2012 can be spared these issues.

Melbourne's playing list just heavenly. Apparently... OD - I thought this piece to be a little too upbeat about the list for you...

There is a need for some clearing of the air (understatement) but you are assuming the players are all unified in their distaste with Schwab and Connolls, and that they are the ones 'in the right' (if anyone is...). The senior players seem to have issues with the direction of the club - namely that they are not good enough players to be apart of that direction, Schwab gets his head in places he shouldn't, and god knows what Connolls has [censored] off people about. The club will settle, Tom will make his difficult decision and we will move on either way.

I'll do a no-no and reply to myself... These two we have discussed in the past - and I can see them as issues for senior players. This is why we should have grown a pair and moved past our current 25+ players and given the reigns to the younger talent. You cannot expect the senior group to pull in the same direction if they don't see themselves in that direction. That being said - it is pretty weak for a player to be [censored] off at the club talking about how they will win a flag...

Yes.

Mick would probably say 'good riddance' - I don't believe he likes the way the MFC evolves around this fixture...

I'm exhausted about their behaviour aswell. This can be the thread we have a look at the grievances - keeping in mind they might be inferred BS by Caro. Over the past year those grievances have included: ■The manner in which several senior players, notably former captain James McDonald, were unloaded last season. ■Ongoing uncertainty among the senior line-up that they too will fall victim to the Schwab-Connolly ''premiership model'' of list management. ■The long and expensive post-season trip to China during which Tom Scully chose to return home early. ■Schwab's inconsistent comments regarding Scully, most recently that the Demons could match the annual $1 million Greater Western Sydney terms. ■Delays in the re-signing of talented young players. ■The lack of consistent structure in the football department and lack of clarity over development resources, headed up earlier this year by Viney. Several players and coaches and other staff have become increasingly disenchanted after being interviewed by consultant Ray Andrews, whom the Demons' board paid $80,000 to review the club's entire operation. Having opened up, most believed their constructive criticism had been ignored. Further, they felt the report had been buried for political expediency Discuss.

I very much doubt Cale had any idea about the senior players - apparently Green, Rivers, and Jones - going to see McLardy.

We are all inferring to a certain extent here so we know hot to take everything as gospel but I understand how the players can be annoyed with Schwab and possibly his interference in the footy side of things but Connolly is the head of footy... And the list of grievances in Caro's post is worth a thread itself... The players don't like the Premiership Model? The probably don't like it because it will cost them cash in the short term and their jobs in the long term. And I couldn't care less. From where I sit - everyone needs a rebuke. Schwab needs to stay in the front office, Viney needs to keep him there, Connolly needs to placate the players and their 'development worries,' and the players need to grow a pair and not let this simmer and explode like it obviously did last week and weekend. The way the senior players handled this is an interesting juxtaposition to the way they play - they waited for things to get better through someone else's intervention, they were brought into the 'game' by others, and they come off looking self-interested and misguided. And they ended up getting smashed... I hope Schwab, Connolly and Green are having a chat in that theatrette at AAMI Park right now and telling the players what they are going to do to fix this BS.