Lord Nev

OUT: May (inj), Baker, Viney, Jones, OMac, Lewis, Hunt, Dunkley IN: Hore, Stretch, ANB, Lockhart, Keilty, Jordon, Bedford, Chandler Let's have a look at some things we haven't seen, because I've seen enough of the same old this year. (Half joking btw)

All spot on for me aside from mayyyyyybe this one being a little harsh. Not the most skilled, but on a day where we had no real intensity I thought he was the one player going full speed for the ball and full intent into tackles for the full 4 quarters. Not a player I rate very highly overall, but I've actually really liked the pressure and effort he's brought every time he's played. 7 tackles, 5 marks, 6 score involvements (despite playing all over the ground) and 24 pressure acts I reckon is not a bad return given where he sits on the list and how the rest of the team performed, including the co-captains leading him.

Yeah how dare a former captain of the club and team of the century player whose job it is to commentate say things about the club he played for. Worst thread ever.

Out of all the players today, you choose him to criticize?

Our problems existed well before he got there. It's a cop out to blame him for 50 years of failure.

The problems with this club run so so deep. We have a name, a logo and a jumper, but we don't actually stand for anything. Some things you can allow for, forgive and understand, but the lack of fight when things are tough and belief in each other (not just talking about the players btw) are all just emblematic of an organization that exists just to survive, not to succeed. I believe that can only be changed by leadership club-wide. The closest we've had to a ruthless, wants-to-win leader has been PJ. Goodwin has become a PR artist, Bartlett just wants the "me time", Pert is invisible and our co-captains aren't directional leaders and are so limited as footballers that they struggle to lead by example anyway. Wasn't expecting a win today of course, but the way we have just wandered through this year says a lot about who we really are.

Or it means we're being reasonable about the relative cost of talent.

Can now sell him to Gold Coast as a swingman.

Apart from the fact Watts has played more than twice as many games of course.

Absolute cracker from an attitude and work ethic point of view. Not many who transition from other sports have that real old school footy 'bull' intensity, but this bloke was as tough at the footy as it comes. Well done on what you achieved Corey.

Third hand info, so take it as you will from an anonymous guy on the internet, but have heard we won't be getting Hill. Apparently the club rates the talent we can get with our first pick this year higher than Hill, and Freo are at the moment expecting a high first round pick.

I didn't say anything about Misson. Think you're attributing me to the wrong post mate.

I love the idea of Roughy as a forwards coach, but reckon he's pretty much cooked playing wise. Guess it depends on what else happens with our list though I guess.

I still believe TMac and Weid can be our main men up forward. Both have had horror years carrying existing injuries and then copping more. Not saying they will be the best combo in the league, but with full fitness and better delivery from a tweaked game plan and more outside players will make a big difference to their effectiveness. I'm all for us adding to our key forward stocks, I just don't think we need to chase a high-priced star to make it work well enough for us to challenge.

Not sure if I'd label it a vacancy as such, but more a need for quality depth maybe? Looking at our list demographic talent-wise, my guess would be we'd need to either draft or free agent a KPF. I haven't kept a close eye on the draft this year as I didn't think I'd need to (classic Melbourne), but as far as free agent KPF options go there's: Levi Casboult. Adam Tomlinson (probably more wing, but could play KPF). Justin Westhoff. Ryan Schoenmakers. That's going by the most recent list I could find anyway. Not a lot to choose from, but one of those could be ok. I'm sure there's other FA options that I haven't seen or don't know much about though.

Ah ok. My impression was always that it was more about Watts not being enough of a contested player for Goodwin's style. As much as I've heard he loves a good time, I've never heard one negative thing about Watts' cultural impact. Even taking what you say as gospel, I wouldn't have thought their cultural issues were comparable.

May, Lever, OMac and Frost all named against a short Collingwood forward line, in the wet. Surely there'll be at least one late change? My guess is May will play forward and Hore in for OMac.

Yep, I'd definitely be ok with keeping that first pick and getting Langdon and Martin. If we could also manage to pick up a quality free agent then that's a reasonably successful offseason IMO.

Fair enough mate, I'm not against it and agree with a lot of what you're saying. Just personally, I would rather do what we need to to get Hill as I'm not sold on Martin as an outisde runner, and think he plays his best footy at half back (which might also be handy for us anyway). That's the reason I posted that stat comparison, to illustrate the massive difference particularly in uncontested possessions. FWIW Martin is out of contract and has "put off talks", so he'd definitely be very gettable.

The point is we don't need more average utility players more than we need outside runners. The point of the stats is the uncontested possessions and metres gained, they would be the most important statistical indicators for our needs, so they are not irrelevant at all. I'm not against going for Martin, but he's not a similar player to Hill IMO, so I don't see why we would go for him instead of Hill. What makes you think Hill is not a realistic possibility?

To be fair, it's being mentioned on Demonland because various news articles have stated it.

Maybe as well as, but not instead of...

Petty. May forward. OR pending the weather they may drop OMac all together and bring in Hore. It's a very tall backline for a possibly wet and windy day.

Always liked him, but would think he's the last thing we'd look at given we need speed and creativity. What would he do during the 86% of game time he's not needed?

Yeah, but with Jones and Lewis undecided about next year, Frost possibly due for a payrise should he re-sign and the minimum spend in the cap, it would be pretty tight maneuvering. The increases for TMac and Gus potentially could have made a 200-300k difference in total too.