Rhino Richards

They were pretty obvious questions. Thats two out of how many possible recruits. Never make the exceptions the rule. Good recruiters maximise their draft picks and choose wisefully. Getting a serviceable AFL player off the rookie list is not that easy. Getting a star is punting on it. Lets go to Crown and conjure a premiership team. You dont aim high. Fair enough. But just remember whatever wins you get or want is going to come down to the players in your squad. If you dont make hay while the opportunity presents itself then you wont have many wins when 18 sides are vying for talent.

Tko Cassius Clay.

He has also got himself a 3 year contract to continue in the role. The pharmacist is milking every opportunity he can. He deserves to fail.

I have answered the Richmond question in an early post. Poor recruiting does not negate the importance of accessing the best draft picks you can. And gems like James Hird??? Taken pick 79 in 1991. There have been approx. 1,200 players that have been taken outside the first round since James Hird that have go on to top players? Any idea of the odds? Would not be many would it?

Well wizard you go ahead and tell me. And I am sure that it will be a stunning answer that self sauces another crackpot bit of wisdom BTW, you were asking about the difference a high draft pick (not just a No 1 pick) would make..... Last years B'low M'list - Adam Cooney (2003 - No 1) Last years Coleman Medallist - Buddy Franklin (2004 - No 5) Last years NSM - (2001 - No 1). And if you actually did the research Mo across all clubs over the past 10 years or so you would find that higher draft picks end up playing a higher number of AFL matches than lower draft picks. However, its not just a matter of accessing the picks but having the skill to actually choose the players who will make it. Richmond is a perfect case in question of recruiting poorly. And through your detailed research you will come up with the dud in the top 10 (eg 2003) and the odd Sam Mitchell (in the 30s). Knock yourself out big hitter.

Do the research and answer your own questions. It will be eye opening. You are coming off a low base.

Even a prize dunce like you could not be stupid enough to ask that question? Duhhh. Give that chip on your shoulder a rub Mo. The winter is playing havoc with it.

Yeah you're right. No supporters, no coach, no money and no future. Just like the shinboner spirit.

Take a little more time. Trust me More fool you.

Always like some facts Iva. Not your fiction and revisionism. When you dont have facts then rolling out a cliche does not hide. And I can assure you Iva I have less tolerance for mediocrity than you but I take the time to understand the issues behind the facade. Sorry Iva. Your penchant for rattling cliches adds little of substance to debate. And as I have show you greatly mistaken in your main point on a number of fronts and you cant seem to work that out. But its good you dont tolerate mediocrity.

And your earlier post??? Brilliant.

He was never going and it was obvious given the rebuild that 2 years was not enough. He knew like the Club knew they had a window of opportunity opening up and they got there 3 years early. Wrong. Its both on and off field and you cant divorce it. Pull the other one sbout Navy Blue Player spirit. With Fevola, Angwin, O'Halpin. Carlton were stuffed. My assessment of Pratt was very relevant about the fabric of the Club. Elliott, Rice and Harris have all had very dodgy business records. Pratt resigned as President because his record did not stand in good stead to renew a gaming licence. It speaks very much to the fabric of the Club. 2006. MFC were never a top 4 side and that should highlight that at our best we were gap fillers in September. It should highlight the warning signs then for MFC. Carlton did not have to do much either game as they could have played for baked beans. They were our two worst performances for that year. Context and perspective are not your strong points. We have had leadership problem at this Club for the past 5 years or longer. And we are paying the price of the list issues made years ago. We have got kids out there who are busting a gut but without the guidance and assurance and experience of capable and reliable senior players. We need to mature these kids quick as best we can. Unfortunatley the culture base we had 2 to 3 years ago has made this process start at point zero. As for Cam Bruce. Not a leader on or off the field. Its a pity that we are reduced to media spokespersons for the players being either Bruce or Robbo RAH RAH RAH. That's the spirit!

I love a guy without a clue. We aren't good enough to tank. Carlton were in winning positions in games in 2007 and rested better players and somehow forgot to tag opposition better players. And it was part of scheme to get Judd and pay him off Visy's payroll. WCE won a flag in 2006 and still have 15 of their premiership team in and they win less than 5 games, two years in a row. Perspective

Wrong. They had Pratt's money. We dont.

A few facts Iva. Hawthorn did not have the passion for Clarkson as they only gave him two years after making a meal of the recruitment process which left them behind the 8ball at the time where it was Clarkson and very little else. They had missed out on Wallet and got Clarko. Fate is wonderful. When the Hawks "bottomed out" they already had the largesse emerging in the 1999 and 2001 drafts. They had tradeable senior players who drew draft picks from other Clubs.... Hay, Thompson and Everitt to further sweeten the list and they also had a raft of selections in the top 10 of the 2004 draft. Now Carlton....the fabric of that Club remained strong... Your kidding me???? Within and outside the Club, people recognised that Carlton were absolutely fvcked. They were only saved by Pratt's largesse and a blind eye from the AFL as they plotted to throw games to gain the priority pick to trade for the orchestra vaudeville called recruit Judd. Salary Cap questions, throwing games, having a Club President who due to an outrageous and illegal price fixing scandal was not of a good character for them to maintain a pokies licence. In a long lineage of CFC president who had criminal records, Pratt represented the grotty fabric of that Club. Oh yes...He did have money. No wonder they fawned in memory of him. Its a stand there that just wont fade. And our legacy list deficiencies together with our parlous financial position and our lack of facilities (short a billionaire or two) puts us further behind the other Clubs you mention.

He was a highly touted F/S pick from Warrnambool that all the recruiting guys were salivating over at the time.

What a load of carp. He has been putting his head over the ball and without question copping the hits for many years. Redleg is absolutely spot on.

You're right. Lets all panic.

Really hard as I thought we had few standouts and a lot of ordinary players out there: 6. Green 5. Moloney 4. Davey 3. Sylvia 2. Frawley 1. Jurrah

Well done Rude Boy. You should be proud. I have rarely seen someone look so clean with their ball handling in their first game. Certainly not overawed. Exciting athleticism. A beautiful kick for goal or on the pass. If he maintains those skills plus gains a greater awareness of where to run and how to operate at this level then we will have a player who is special. Great debut.

Especially when we have a ready made forward in the VFL with no flaws. I heard Leigh make those comments. Throwaway line that was bound to excite the minds of some. This is a an insightful thread indeed.

Bravo. I guess the word plateau was a difficult one wasn't it. I guess your melodramatic posts are not a form of bullying in itself particularly when you seek to continually misrepresent the other persons point of view as your leading argument. Choice.

Even you not that ____ to just base your conclusion on the accumulation of stats. IMO he does not impact enough games. He does not hurt oppositions with the ball. Number of kicks, marks etc are the folly of those who cannot follow the game elsewhere. But you have just convinced yourself he has improved. On one hand your saying he has improved but then again he hasn't because of injuries, poor midfield, climate change etc. Worst case of buttering both sides of the bread Jaded even for you. It was not not meant to be an insult. Just an observation. Your bizarre efforts to misrepresent my position on McLean was dumb Jaded. And you did it twice. Even dumber. On that basis you could do worse than sit on a fence. And you are sounding more like Freak. Maybe thats the comparison. Thanks for that insight.

You have done it again. First you wrongly accuse me of saying he has declined when I said "plateaud". Now you are saying " plateaud" means improving in all critical aspect of your game" You are not normally that dumb Jaded but you are plumbing low. This is plateaud Jaded ---------------------------. A flat line From dictionary.com "to reach a state or level of little or no growth or decline, esp. to stop increasing or progressing; remain at a stable level of achievement; level off: After a period of uninterrupted growth, sales began to plateau. " He had little impact in a number of matches last year and at times looked terrible in 2008. I dont have to rely on statistics to tell me why I can easily observe. And B&F is a relative measure not an absolute. We were a far worse team in 2008 than 2007 but McLean could still have plateaud and improve his position. It does not indicate improvement at all. Mclean is no different to any other player who is trying hard. It does not mitigate the outcome. You make the big statement about be accountable when you cross the line then you go into an endless dribble of excuses why Brock cant be accountable for it. Its laughable really Its rubbish Jaded. At the end of 2006 he was on the cusp of making the next step and influencing games of football. I thought he could be the No 1 midfielder for us. He has not made that step and has base lined (sorry Jaded plateaud is too harder concept for some). In that time the game has got more demanding and is struggling with it and is still waiting to take that next step. I think he still needs to take the next step. I think he is part of the midfield rotation in 2012 but he is not the general in the midfield. That makes him necessary rather than very important. You hope he will be a very good player resting partially on the fact we get better players in the midfield. Right. So there is nothing wrong with my belief that he will be a blue collar solid midfielder but.... You dont understand what plateauing is and your statistics dont camouflaged we you just dont want to see. And in this case its a lot. Its also funny that you challenge Dappa Dan on his love of PJ. I dont agree with DD's view before you carry on about that. Dappa Dan of PJ is no different to your of Brock. Its both based on a self blinded view that suits a purpose.

At least do yourself a favour and follow the argument before call "rubbish" In my opinion he has stalled as a player. He has not declined Woop de do. In a midfield you admit is poor, his placing in the possession puts him at near top of an ordinary barrel of footballers. Check the posts I was making comments last year about this. I made comments observing him over the past three years in response that I was only judged him on this year. I didn't. Now you having a hissy fit that I did not raise the comments last year (I did) and then the year before that. FFS, I measuring it over the past three years. He has struggled to put in a full season and also a pre season in the past three years. That is enough to be a concern even before you look at his performance. The issue is not whether he will be elite. I have never stated that. McLean is a blue collar midfielder who does struggle with tags and has limitations. I dont think he has improved his performance over the past 3 years. Its a pity that his rise as a footballer depends on having better players or stars around. I think he is workmanlike midfielder who will be solid rather than very good. I hope I am wrong on that. For some time he has been struggling and if it is injuries that have restricted him over the past 3 years then I am worried if it extends to a 4th year. I have him as a keep for the 2012 team in the midfield rotation. I do rate him as a top 3 critical to the side like I did at the end of 2006. I have judged over three years not this year. You are like a scratched record of excuses and apologies. We have addressed that issue so rattle on about it So its bad decision making to undertake disposal that you cant do. Thats my point. Aaargh! The Club like Brock do not use the injuries as a crutch for refusing to see the obvious. You have said that yourself I have acknowledged the injuries aspect. But I follow your dictum... The rest is just contradiction. Ho Hum!!